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The Roar

Derm McCrum

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Joined December 2008

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The truth shall set you free.

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On average 35% not English qualified per squad in Premiership.

English champions Saracens to be relegated for salary cap breach

Oh – I don’t know – Wales were pretty damn good in the seventies, and Scotland were far better in the nineties than they are now in terms of actually winning things. Ireland on the other hand were dismal in the late eighties and all of the nineties until 2001 and professionalism was finally adopted and practised. They still only reach quarterfinals in the RWC though.

Rennie and Penney should be the last of the NZ coaches in Australian rugby

No – their hand was not forced. Every team pays its top players competitive salaries. It’s what they decided to pay their second rank players is probably what put them over.
They’ve been £1.2m, £1.3m last two seasons and potentially 2m over this season. Itoje, Farrell, Vunipola were not going to go to France and lose their England places (and substantial match fees of 22k per match).

English champions Saracens to be relegated for salary cap breach

There are only salary caps in two of the six participating nations – France and England – because they are privately-owned clubs.

However, the unions set operating budgets for all the other teams, and some operate foreign player quotas on season squads e.g. Wales and Ireland.

English champions Saracens to be relegated for salary cap breach

Think you’re missing a couple of important words there in your Jones quote….
😂

English champions Saracens to be relegated for salary cap breach

Don’t think that description of running two international quality squads applies to the four Irish teams. Largely because they’re subject to quotas on foreign players.

Saracens qualified for the European H Cup from their league using a squad that was not compliant with their league’s rules. They gained qualification and top seeding with their squad.

There are signs that EPCR are going to change rules so that qualifying teams are compliant with their league, and impose sanctions, if not.

English champions Saracens to be relegated for salary cap breach

Clearly. I’m shivering in me slippers here, Ken. 🙂

The Australian view from across the water: Scott Fardy

Well we can take your word for it as an anonymous commenter or Scott Fardy who said it.

He hasn’t played soft in any of his 50+ appearances for Leinster. And the Heineken Cup would be on a par with Super Rugby.

The Australian view from across the water: Scott Fardy

Hi AH. Yes he did a good job captaining the Leinster A team in the Celtic Cup comp between Irish and Welsh sides at beginning of season – they won 8 from 8 and retained the cup. He hasn’t had any look-ins for the senior side as yet, but his opportunity may come during the Six Nations games. He looks another good prospect given his performances in last year’s Six Nations U20 and the RWC U20.

The Australian view from across the water: Scott Fardy

Yep. Baird is looking pretty handy. If Dowling and Dunne also come through then Leinster may not need a replacement for Fardy next season.

I’ve a bet on that they can have a squad 100% Irish qualified by end of the year.

The Australian view from across the water: Scott Fardy

Good chat, and very nice writing, Nic. Happy New Year to you. Hope you’re enjoying the Blues as much as I am sat in the stands or in the pub.
To my mind, Scott Fardy is the up to date version of Rocky Elsom in his glory days with Leinster in 2008/09. Am glad he signed on again for this season as he continues to deliver. He’s been a wise grandad to the young kids coming through like Scott Penny, Will Connors, Deegan, Caelan Doris who could all be appearing in an Ireland jersey next July for the 2 – possibly 3 – game series in Oz.
Leinster have played 22 games across their 3 comps – Celtic Cup (academy), PRO14, Heineken Cup – so far this season and won all 22, scoring 71 tries in the two main comps.
Fardy is the 5th highest player with the most minutes played so far across 10 games. For a 35 year-old lock, that’s not bad going. He’s surpassed this season by that other spring chicken lock, Devin Toner, two years his junior at 33, who plays a phenomenal amount of club games in addition to his test rugby, and never seems to tire.
Btw, Fardy’s season game time is a little bit more than you’ve said – he had 22 games in each of his first two seasons, starting 36 out of the 44.

The Australian view from across the water: Scott Fardy

Oh without a doubt, Neil. McCall has borrowed heavily from the Irish provincial model in this regard, and Baxter clearly is following suit, with the new Saints coach, Boyd also indicating that’s where they’re going over the next few years.

Ex-Waratah Dave Dennis is hunting ‘the double’ with the Exeter Chiefs this season

“One thing that the club has done well over the years is build a really strong squad in terms of depth. We’ve currently got 60-odd players. There’s a real nice blend of people involved too—the odd foreigner, a lot of local lads, a lot of guys that come through the academy,” he said.

There are 66 players in the Exeter squad, of whom 19 are in the academy. Of the 47 players in the senior squad, there are 17 players who grew up in other countries including Tonga (1), Wales (2), Australia (3), Argentina (1), Namibia (1), Ireland (2), New Zealand (1), South Africa (2), Zimbabwe (2), Scotland (1).

Ex-Waratah Dave Dennis is hunting ‘the double’ with the Exeter Chiefs this season

Is it their away wins anywhere or outside Europe you’re referring to, T-man?

For Schmidt’s tenure, they played 76 matches. 42 of those away from home incl neutral grounds. They lost 15 matches.

He won a test for the first time in South Africa, losing the series narrowly by 6 points. He won a 4th test tour series in Oz. And won a test tour series in Argentina and Japan.

Certainly an improvement on his predecessors.

How Stephen Larkham is finding his feet at Munster

I see. So by Europe you meant France and England?

Fireworks on the fifth: What the Saracens crisis means for the global game

I would have thought the reason SR starts earlier is because the new global season came in this year.

The SR final on June 20 matches with the finals in Europe – Premiership final June 20, PRO14 Final 20 June, Top 14 final June 26. This then leaves sufficient time for travel, preparation before the tests begin in July.

When will Japan join the Rugby Championship?

Hey Geoff. I think most have moved on with the Championship and now the Heineken Cup underway again.

The monies go to the unions and from early reports, they’re looking at infrastructure and development of other parts of the game as much as anything else. Connacht are looking to redevelop their stadium so it’s more on a par with the other provinces. That plan has been in train for a while so no doubt they’ll be looking to tap that. Similarly, Leinster are increasing/ upgrading the RDS Arena so that will help. I doubt the IRFU will want to start a salary bonfire but no doubt agents will be bringing a few cans of petrol. Let’s see.

The Wrap: The art of writing the recurring rugby column

Stonking piece of writing, Mr P.
Kudos.
Note to Editor: Please keep this writer and don’t cheese him off like all the other ones.
Note to Geoff: The PRO14 has finally agreed a deal in principle to sell a 27% stake of the Championship to private equity firm CVC Capital Partners filing with the Irish Competition Commission. The deal will result in a cash boost of almost £120m to the PRO14 Championship owned by the Irish, Scottish and Welsh Rugby Unions.
It’ll be interesting to see what the owner-Unions do for their clubs as a result of receiving such monies. And what SARU and FIR who have participation agreements with the PRO14 might receive from the deal if approved.

The Wrap: The art of writing the recurring rugby column

The PRO14 has agreed a deal in principle to sell a 27% stake of the Championship to private equity firm CVC Capital Partners.

The deal will result in a cash boost of almost £120m to the PRO14 Championship owned by the Irish, Scottish and Welsh Rugby Unions.

It’ll be interesting to see what the owner-Unions do for their clubs as a result of receiving such monies. And what SARU and FIR who have participation agreements with the PRO14 might receive from the deal if approved.

Collective failure of the Six Nations

I’m not deflecting. I don’t disagree that SR players are going – they see better options for themselves elsewhere – mainly in Japan, France & England. And it’s the private owned clubs that are driving it as they are the ones with the money. But it’s not just players from SA, Australia and NZ. It’s players from Scotland, Ireland, Wales, Italy, Argentina, Georgia, Moldova, US, Canada, Fiji, Tonga, etc.

If you want to paint the whole thing with a very wide brush and describe the destination broadly as the North, have at it. I’m simply pointing out that it’s not the North, it’s three countries in the main as the destination, two in Europe and one in the Far East, and those are all privately-owned clubs as opposed to national unions. Hence, my original statement, it’s become national unions running and owning the game vs private-owned clubs – that is going to continue and get stronger for the private clubs.

However, to quote your last post if it “doesn’t matter who’s taking them, it matters that they’re leaving”, I think we’ve strayed too far from the original point of the article so I’ll leave it there. Enjoy your summer break.

Collective failure of the Six Nations

Italy and Scotland have always tended to have some of their players playing outside PRO14 with contracts in lucrative foreign club climes. Wales also have some and introduced a min cap rule same as Australia.

Where do their players go? To private clubs with more money.
If all you are seeing is players going North, then presumably you can see that they’re all going to private owned clubs with the money to attract them. With Japan who play in Super Rugby one of the big destinations, and who some in SANZAAR territory want to involve in the Rugby Championship. South Africa has already decided to be involved in two competitions and has acted accordingly – it chose to enter into a union-run competition, not a private club one. It draws its players from everywhere.

The rugby world is changing, mate. It involves East, North, West, and South.

Collective failure of the Six Nations

Tell me the Crusaders players that you’re referring to and where they’re going?
From my own research on 2019/20 transfer for Crusaders and other NZ teams, I find:
Blues (Transfers out)
15 players with 8 moving elsewhere in NZ, and 2 to England, 1 to USA, 1 to Canada and 3 to Japan (7 Private clubs)
Chiefs
16 players of which 8 moving elsewhere in NZ, 6 to Japan, and 2 others released/injured in NZ. (6 private clubs)
Highlanders
16 players of which 5 are moving elsewhere in NZ, 2 to France, 1 to England, 1 to Ireland, and 7 to Japan (10 private clubs and 1 union club)
Hurricanes
16 players of which 7 are moving elsewhere in NZ or retiring and 2 England, 1 Wales, 1 USA, 1 France (maybe), 1 SA, 3 to Japan (8 private clubs and 1 union club)
Crusaders
Owen Franks (31) 150 app to Private Club Northampton in England
Tim Perry (31) 25 app to Tasman in New Zealand
Ben Funnell (29) 88 app to Private Club Ricoh Black Rams in Japan
Sam Whitelock (31) 143 app to Private Club Panasonic Wild Knights in Japan
Jordan Taufau (27) 97 app to Private Club Leicester in England
Matt Todd (31) 140 app to Private Club Toshiba Brave Lupus in Japan
Kieran Read (34) 156 app to Private Club Toyota Verblitz in Japan
Mitchell Hunt (24) 42 app to private franchise Highlanders in New Zealand
Tim Bateman (32) 50 app was in Japan retired in New Zealand
Ryan Crotty(31) 150 app to Private Club Kubota Spears in Japan
Ngani Punivai (21) 2 app to private franchise Highlanders in New Zealand
Israel Dagg (31) 89 app retired in New Zealand
In summary, it’s 12 Crusaders players with 1,132 appearances between them.
5 of them with 158 appearances are going elsewhere in New Zealand or retiring.
5 of them with 727 appearances are going to Private clubs in Japan.
2 of them with 247 appearances are going to Private Clubs in England.
Average age of those Crusaders leaving NZ is 31.
Of all five NZ SR teams, the split of player destinations is:
25 to private clubs in Japan
7 to private clubs in England
3 to private clubs in France
2 to private teams in USA
1 to private league team in Canada
1 to private club in Wales
Total
39 going to private-owned clubs
2 going to union-owned teams in Ireland and South Africa
In short, it’s a Union-owned vs Private-Owned Club/League thing – mostly in England, France and more and more Japan.
The Japanese option is one that the NZRU are actively pursuing/persuading their top players to take their sabbaticals. Some of those players are going to play 2 seasons in one year in Japan and then return. Others may retire given their age.
.
PS in Australia, it’s 15 Japan, 7 Eng, 7 Fra (Private) and 1 Ireland (Union)

Collective failure of the Six Nations

You get so many NHers saying….

That’s it in a nutshell right there, T’man. I don’t see myself as a “NHer” – that’s how you see it. I see you as a New Zealander. I’m Irish.

South Africa are increasingly becoming a blend of European and SA influences as their squad and coaches at the RWC demonstrated. It’s becoming more a global game with unions vs private clubs the real line of contrast and comparison.

Collective failure of the Six Nations

Saracens need to drop maybe one well-paid player and the problem is solved.

France, England and increasingly Japan will continue to be the destination for 85-90% of SH-born players, certainly the top quality ones. The rest will go to other places – USA, Wales, Scotland, Italy, Ireland, etc.

Unions vs Private Clubs, not North vs South.

Fireworks on the fifth: What the Saracens crisis means for the global game

“reduce the ridiculous importation and player banking that effectively wrecks domestic player options in Europe etc and leave room for the less rich unions (Argentina, Fiji, etc) to actually develop some cohesion in their elite squads.”

Can you go into a little bit more detail on how that would work in practice in Wales, Italy, Scotland and Ireland and the benefits it would bring?

Fireworks on the fifth: What the Saracens crisis means for the global game