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Stanthefootballfan

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Joined September 2018

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I am a Springbok fan, originally from beautiful Cape Town. These days I ply my craft in Nanjing in China. I love rugby, cricket and soccer. Occasionally I like a bit of Aussie Rules and baseball too, and tennis, and wrestling, and boxing, and running ...

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Haouas only got banned for three weeks. Wow.

https://www.skysports.com/rugby-union/news/12321/11955653/france-prop-mohamed-haouas-banned-for-three-weeks-for-punching-scotlands-jamie-ritchie

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

You do sound like you like soccer more than rugby. And know more about it too. I am the opposite. They are two very different games. I appreciate both sports for what they are.

I will concede you very likely know more about soccer than I do, and admit that I prefer rugby. There are a few of your views on rugby that we will have to agree to disagree with.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Rugby is by its very nature a brutal game. Rugby players have a little niggle and then they drink a beer together afterwards. Maybe punching should be allowed. But just not in the face.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

I don’t think I am confirming what you are saying at all. Football is not a tactically more advanced sport than rugby. It only relies on tactical play more. Rugby is a more physical game. Not because it relies less on tactical play. It just IS more physical. You would quickly realize the difference after you played a game of rugby and football. Hence it is a much bigger disadvantage to be a man down in rugby. It is simple physics when you come to think of it.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Sending-off and replacing foul players at junior/amateur levels should happen even faster than at the professional level. There are lots of boys waiting on the side-line waiting to get a game. No need to keep serious repeat offenders on the field. Replacing a hot head will not encourage hotheadedness. It will teach juniors how to obey the spirit of the game if they dare to “play dirty”.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Overall, I think it should be easier to play a man down in rugby than soccer
Sorry, I beg to differ. My sporting instincts tell me differently.
Rugby is a physically much more demanding game than soccer. I am not saying soccer is not a very physical sport. I played both sports enthusiastically, and I still watch both. If I had a choice I’d play with one less player in a soccer game much rather than in a rugby game. Football teams rely more on tactics to win a game than their rugby counterparts who rely more on their physical attributes. I am not saying tactical play doesn’t matter in rugby.
Scotland beat France this weekend because the French had a player less on the field. The result was decided by the brandishing of a red card in that rugby game and this tends to be the effect in most rugby games. Unlike football where teams who are a man down are more often likely to hold out for a victory or a draw.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

I’d like to add that James Ritchie should’ve been punished with at least a yellow card. His was a serious foul, but surely being an instigator is not what he was paid for to do. And in the end, the officials didn’t do a proper job either. Unprofessionalism on all sides if you asked me.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

I sensed a bit of anti-French bias from the on-field officials.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Thanks. I read it and you made the argument more succinctly. I couldn’t agree more. Give a red-card to send offending players off and then send on a replacement (after a ten-minute penalty-period). If anything a ref would probably be more likely to give red-cards which would actually make the game safer by forcing players to toe the line more carefully. Stricter after game action would also help to deter foul play.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

I couldn’t agree more. Give a red-card to send offending players off and then send on a replacement after a ten-minute penalty-period. If anything a ref would probably be more likely to give a red-cards which would actually make the game safer by forcing players to toe the line more carefully. Stricter after game action would also help to deter foul play.

Seeing red: We need to even the playing field

Yes. Keep the red card by all means. Then send on a replacement after ten minutes. Unless the on-field officials deem the red-card offense so malicious that a team is forced to play with one less player for the remainder of the game (and the whole team needs to be punished). Strike a balance between punishing foul play and ruining an event.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

BTW did anybody here notice how Jamie Ritchie also threw a punch during the scuffle? Why didn’t he get punished? At the very least it should’ve been a yellow-card. JR was one of the main instigators that led to a punch to being thrown. No wonder he smiled as Haouas walked off after being red-carded.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/gerry-thornley-rugby-needs-to-tackle-the-agents-provocateurs-1.4197949

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Compared to football/soccer the effect of a yellow and red-card decision in rugby has a much bigger effect on the game. The reason being rugby is a much more physical game for starters.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

I like the idea very much of a red-card without replacement only in very extreme situations to be decided by the on-field officials.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

I sincerely believe that taking out players the way you suggest doesn’t exist at the top levels of the game anymore. If a team would go to such great lengths I believe the referee should be allowed to make a judgment call. In other words if the offense was serious enough and the referee deems it appropriate no replacement should be allowed for the red-carded player. But that should only be in extreme cases.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

I don’t think the Scots would have won it if the French had 15 players on the field. Even with the point advantage, they had built up during the ten minutes after the red card was shown.
If Haouas lost his match fee and got a one year ban (or longer) from all forms of rugby that would be an appropriate punishment. On top of that if the FRF got fined a million Euros then that would have been an even better punishment.
But a second-half with 14 French v 15 Scots did definitely give us a result, but not the one a genuine rugby fan can enjoy.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Fair point. I suggest more severe punishment after the game that will impact not only the individual offender but the rugby union as a whole. Fine unions huge amounts if your player gets red-carded. If the after game consequences are severe enough it might make your suggested cynical play a lot less likely.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

That is the most sensible thing I can imagine you could do as a referee.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Imagine watching the All Blacks v Springboks. You have been waiting for this game for what felt like forever. You have dreamed about it. Damn, you have even spent thousands to fly to NZ to get into the stadium to watch the game. Just before half-time an All Black gets red-carded for dirty play. As a Springbok fan, will I be happy? HELL NO. I will be annoyed. Because the game has been spoilt. I want to see 15 v 15 players the way the game was meant to be played. I say punish the All Blacks. Send the offending player off and he can go and take a shower and worry about his future. 10 minutes later let the All Blacks send on their (forced) replacement, and hopefully, by that point, if the Springboks took advantage of the situation, the Kiwis will get a fair chance to fight their way back into the game.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Red cards should happen, fair enough. I still think replacing the player after minutes would be on-field punishment enough though. I don’t believe it will encourage more foul play (especially if the offending RC player gets punished appropriately and severely with a zero-tolerance attitude after a fair hearing AFTER THE GAME).

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Maybe give free kicks instead of scrums when a prop is out of play?

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

I agree that severe punishment should be meted out to keep foul-play out of the game. Make bans longer for punching and other hooligan behavior by all means, but it is the on-field impact of the red card in how it takes away from the game that I have a problem with. If a team is forced to replace the red-carded player after a 10 minute period both teams would be back to 15 and we could watch a normal game again. Forcing a 14 v 15 man game for longer than 10 minutes is painful to watch. It becomes a non-contest.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Yes, Melburnian. I agree with everything you say. I think red card offenders can be punished severely to make the game fairer and safer, but the appropriate severity of the punishment can be decided in a hearing after the match. Criminal charges should be laid even. I don’t condone foul play, but I rather question the way the red card rule is implemented and ends up taking away from the game on-field.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Some red card cases are not so clear cut indeed.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby

Some players react stupidly in the heat of the moment. The more severe cases you mentioned are criminal acts and should be treated as such.

How to fix another red card ruining rugby