All hail the A-League's unsung heroes

Dave it's true that MV's record at TD is not wonderful (last two outings were 0-2 losses) - even in season two the record was nothing flash (away record was actually better). Here is an interesting question: who has the best home record of all the clubs? Could well be that AU, CCM and the Jets are up there.

Towser IMO There are a few reasons the Roar dont score enough goals at home to win games; 1. They dont get enough bodies into the box when the ball is delivered...have watched a number of their games and made the comment to my son. Part of this reason could be because at home they seem to rush forward and maybe midfielders/wide players cannot get to the box in time. Due to their appalling home record now you add the psychological factor of trying too hard (rushing and making wrong choices) which compounds the above. Away from home the team doesn't have the pressure to push forward as much and so can build up the play patintly without the crowd on their backs. 2. The wide defenders dont get forward to support attacking plays often enough and this may also be due to the first point. 3. Finally you dont have any out and out clinical finishers and never have...even Brosque in the 1st year wasnt prolific in front of goal. The few clear chances that are created are generally wasted. Anyway most HAL teams struggle at home even MV at TD. When away teams sit back and defend in numbers the majority of teams dont have the quality to break them down, become frustrated and are susceptible to the breakaway.

Towser actually, the graveyard theory has a lot of merit!! Apart from the MV game, I have been tipping for the Roar to turn it around, and say the same thing every week: the Roar just has to turn it around this weekend, and then watch in disbelief as I curse myself at bucking the obvious trends with my tips! It's an interesting thing with sporting trends (or hoodoos as we call them in Victoria, not sure if the term is used widely elsewhere) some can be quite unbelievable and persist for years such that you have to conclude: well, this is no longer conincidence (not saying the Roar will not win at home for years...) Which two A-League teams have this bizarre record where they continually beat each other away from home? - I'm sure the Roar is one of them, the Jets or CCM might be the other. I can't recall whether it persisted into the 4th year - but it must be damn close. Of course there are stacks of hoodoos in the EPL because the home grounds of the top teams are such fortresses, and with smaller clubs spending long periods out of the top flight, they can go literally decades without winning an away game against a big club. When was the last time Villa defeated the Gunners away? Something like 15 years? That's actually a smallish hoodoo! This could be the year where quite a few hoodoos are broken.

Pippinu I sit & watch every home game. I converse with the regulars about the same deja -vu game. We blame everything ,but do we have any real answers? As you say there away record defies logic. Some blame the graveyard underneath the stadium. Who knows. Maybe you could watch a Roar match at home(Perth this Sunday) & give us an unemotive assessment Of WTF is up at the Roars home matches..

Towser How is it possible that half way through a season, a team knocking on the top 4, has zero wins at home while winning nearly all of its away games? What is it exactly that comes into play? Surely it can't be explained away by reference to the manager - there's something quite quirky going on.

Pippinu I have doubts about Franks coaching. I'm not alone at the Roar. His home record is marginally worse than Mirons & hes long gone. Unfortunately Frank is regarded as a bit of a prodigal son in QLD football circles due to his Captain/Coach win in 1997 with the Strikers,then after of course Socceroo coach.

Towser re Miller waiting in vain for support - you're right that he shields it as well as anyone in the league - but surely Frank would be drumming that into his charges, over and over and over - it must be a case of players not being switched on enough.

Pippinu Miller's goals yes. But in other areas he was ahead of the game & the less"professional" Roar players failed to read his plays. Plenty of times this season I"ve seen him control & hold the ball in midfield,a little turn here to give himself space ,all the time shielding the ball. What for? nobody running into space intelligently for him to pass to. Eventually his cleaned up by the usually quicker younger defenders on the opposing team. Wasted oppurtunity. I welcome any constructive criticism. You saw what careful planning over a number of years can do with the"Silk Purse" Gamba Osaka. They were once at the "Sows Ear " stage of most A-League clubs. It is in the AFC's & MBH's best interest for the A-League to improve to the level of the J-League so that what we discussed before(ie 5 or 6 Asian Super leagues can evolve with the best Asian players fed into them so the ACL can eventually be a smaller version of the ECL). We will be pushed into developing "Professional Football" whether we like it or not.

Maybe with fame and fortune comes the loss of anonymity and being a domestique and a move towards petulance and arrogance. I'd rate most of the Socceroos '74 squad as domestiques - Jimmy Mackay, Jimmy Rooney, Ray Richards and so on. But how many of the current Socceroos who are enjoying world fame and fortune would you call domestiques, while not really being arrogant or petulant.

Towser really good post and a pleasure to read. Interestingly, somewhere on another thread, can't remember where, I just mentioned that A-League games can get a bit crowded and, shall we say, "inelegant" in midfield because players simply show too much of it and are dispossessed far too easily - very similar point to the one you're making about players running with the ball. These are some examples of a few things that the A-League needs to improve on as a whole, and I don't think it is being overly critical to mention such things. A few of Miller's goals early in the season must have come close to meeting your exacting standards?!

Pippinu Remember the Ireland goal clearly This is where the line between "Pub Football" & professional football is defined. Crossing is a basic in my mind of playing "Professional football". So you see a player in a perfect crossing position to plonk the ball on somebodys head in the penalty area.Was it Torres crossed with the outside of his foot for Liverpools headed goal when I watched the highlights of the EPL .Brilliant,prime example using a difficult technique also. Back to the A-League crossing is abysmal. as you state. A simple, basic part of professional football, skill. Another is keeping control of the football ie a player is running with the ball but trys to round a player & pushes it too far ahead leaving the ball to run out or able to be picked up by a back up defender. Simple basic skills still lacking in the A-League. Novices may not notice these but "professional" fans do. I watched a "professional club" Gamba beat AU last week. Mastery of these basic skills was obvious in this team. AU struggled with them still. Professional sport is about an expectation that the professional on the field can deliver if the oppurtunity arises. Football is no different. So your team has the ball on the by-line you expect your professional player to deliver an accurate cross to a forward. He does so & the only reason that the forward doesnt score is that the defender on the opposing team has marked your forward in a professional manner & fulfilled their fans expectation by heading the ball first. He has delivered their "professional football "expectations. The amount of "Professional deliverance" the Roar has given me in 4 seasons is minimal. It is so few & far between I remember all 3 incidents clearly. Zullo crosses Kruse heads in. Zullo hits a long range shot maybe 25 metres out,scores. Reinaldo runs down the by-line cuts back inside beats 2 Sydney defenders angles his shot in. When the Roar is delivering these type of incidents regularly I'll know were cooking with gas.

Towser Kemp is solid - but when we start talking about crossing the ball... Actually, when talking about problems with the A-League, surely our dearth of quality full backs is key amongst them. It seems to me that on the rare occasions that a full back reaches the by-line, the ball ends up either in row z behind the goals, or way, way over the other side of the pitch - absolutely no one can hit the hot spot with any regularity! I can't think of a single player. Now I know we're well off the quality of the EPL, but check out these two fine examples of full back play on the weekend: 1. Boswinga's goal from the corner of the box - a classic full back's goal (incredible debut season for him); and 2. Garrido hitting the by-line at pace and then spotting up Ireland just on the edge of the box who finished with a great goal (his finishing this season has been superb)

Surely Kemp is a domestique in the sense were talking about here. Always seemed a solid reliable player to me. Speaking of formations when I played the 5-3-2 system was in place. Despite seeing a variety of modern systems with nouveau names for players, my own opinion is that this was & is the best system ever invented. Each player knew his job,Big strapping centre forward fed by clever inside left & right Forwards or flying wingers who could cross accurately. Centre forward marked by big strapping centre half & inside forwards marked by left & right halves who worked their butts of but were equally as skilful with the ball as the inside forwards.. Wingers marked by "bring em up from mine "full backs. We talk about modern coaching & the pressure placed on the poor sods well I believe that the 5-3-2 system allowed the players to run the show not the coach. Therefore they could express themselves better on the pitch without having a tactical system nagging away at the back of their brain. To me was the closest to allowing the true footballing ability of a player & therefore team to be expressed. We wont ever go back to it of course,the modern coach is a demi-god. Mores the pity.

Sorry Paddy - I was referring more to the NT - but now that you mention it - it's worth looking at the three striker system that both MV and CCM are using - both holding down 1st and 2nd and playing each other this Friday. With half the A-League clubs persisting with the common 4-2-3-1, how are both MV and CCM getting away with three up front? And the answer is that amongst the three strikers, you have hard workers who chase down defenders and hassle them in their own third, I've already mentioned Simons for CCM, and Arch and Danny boy certainly do that for MV.

dasilva I forgot to add that you're right that Dukes is not viewed in the correct light that he should be - but if people knew more about his club record, and how well he stands up to decent opposition in the manner you have described, they would perhaps have a different opinion. Also, he must have the best damn touch in the world for such a big bloke. If there was a ratio of touch to bulk - he would win it hands down!!

dasilva that's it - the world's only defensive forward! Actually I can recall seeing one defensive forward previously of that ilk - the first leg of our qualifier agaisnt Uruguay in 2001 - remember that little lone striker who spent the whole game hassling the defenders - never even put one shot on goal all night - can't remember who he was - but it worked - Australia had a lucky one goal advantage and it wasn't enough. Do not be surprised if Pimbo unleashes the defensive forward tomorrow morning - at least for some of the game - espeically with Cahill carrying a foot injury that will most certainly stop him from seeing out the full 90. By the way, Matty Simons is quite an effective defensive forward, except he is actually scoring goals this year!!

Sledgeross - Terry McFlynn is another player that fits the domestique role perfectly. And I'm glad Jimbo, that you see me for who I really am. That's a good discription Ricardo mate - a domestique is almost a bit of a throwback to the footballer of old. And knowing Pippinu's A-League allegiance, he may be alluding to Archie? Correct me if I'm wrong, pip.

Harry Kewell? Sadly underappreciated and not given enough media attention for mine ;)

the defensive forward I think you were talking while back about trying to stop the other team building from the back

holman right?