An NFL coach looks at the state of world rugby

Thank god this guy is not on the IRB as a life long rugby fan I would hate to see it change like that, I don't want it Americanized so to speak so our players become overpaid divas like the NFL, don't get me wrong I like watching a NFL game every now and then but i love rugby the way it is, i would never want to see a bunch of rugby players falling on top of each other trying to get the ball. Leave rugby as it is

wtf ? more people watch rugby than nfl ? ? . .sorry but i prefer our game the way it is , last thing we need to do is turn it into a advertizing debacle like all those american excuses for sports . By the way a 340 pound fat man wearing pads is not an athlete ! . .only in america is he an athlete ! bloody yanks !

So in these times of financial crisis, professional rugby administrators could save money by cutting back on fireworks, pop bands, inflatable stick men and music licensing with the added benefit of appearing responsive to the wants and needs of their paying spectators. Sounds like a win win to me.

Hi guys, I have latched on a bit late but here goes. Watching a typical test between the Boks and NZ (and this goes for most matches) I always notice the lack of pre-game hype that is generated. In South Africa there seems to be an attempt to get more of a show on and "non-rugby" types will tune in to see it if it is any good.These are the additions I would want to see without fundamentaly changing the rules 30 minute halftime show in 3 10 minute segments with decent bands, dancers whatever Proper camerawork- in Europe they seem to use soccer cameramen who only seem to be able to take massive closeups be a million miles away Most importantly, get the commentators on to a next level, I do admire the Americans who know the sport and have a proper running commentary going. I want stats stat stats- I wont to know (during the game) what the stats say, not a "roundup" when you realize actualy how crap your team were

The national anthems is a good example of how entertainment has aradicted the feeling on match days. The Six Nations generally had a brass band with the crowd and players singing the anthems - thankfully after 3/4 years of some pop star destroying your national anthem. Entertainment os good, but rugby crowds are far too intelligent to be entertained merely by loud noises and brights lights like the Americans, well except maybe the kiwi's.

Katipo, "Devil is in the detail" is exactly right. I remember the first ever night rugby test match in Australia. Australia v South Africa. Instead of having some half-successful rock star screaching out a crap Whitney Houston version of Advance Australia Fair, there was a military band which just played the tune. The entire crowd sang the anthem and it sounded as loud as the crowd singing Flower of Scotland at Murrayfield. And no holding up the game in order to plug John Williamson's lastest CD with a cringe-inducing Waltzing Matilda. John Eales summed up the player's feelings about the 'tradition' of playing Waltzing Matilda when he said it had an intimidation value of zero and an entertainment value of even less. From my experience, the vast majority of the crowd agreed with him. There are some areas where going for showbiz definitely detracts form the game. But managed well, it works.

Hey Fragglerocker, I think the entertainment devil is in the detail. A brass band and moulin rouge dancers at a Paris rugby game is culturally appropriate, traditional and entertaining. They add value. Loud pop music blasted over the PA system at the SFS to the extent that it drowns out the roar of the crowd and even conversations between spectators is damn annoying and the primary reason I stopped buying a season ticket to the Waratahs. Umm, I should also mention those damn inflatable stick men that obscured my view of the TV replays and the increased ticket prices. These things actually detract from the enjoyment and experience of attending a rugby game (in my opinion)

I agree with many of the points raised in the interview. I also follow NFL (having married a girl from Pittsburgh). But I would like to point out a counter-argument to those that are worried about appealing to spectators with 'entertainment'. The idea of favouring entertainment over sport is always going to be controversial, and those voicing their concerns have a very valid argument, but just look at Stade Francais in the French Top 14. Last time I watched one of their games they had a Parisian brass band in one corner for the entire game, and rock concert before kick off, medieval falconry and actual jousting at half-time, and the instead of cheerleaders they had the girls from the Moulin Rouge doing the can-can down the sideline during the match. Trashy entertainment maybe. Crass commercialism maybe. Over-involvement by a media-mogel owner maybe. BUT LOOK AT THE RESULTS: Top 14 finals almost every year, world class players, a recent major growth in TV ratings in a country dominated by soocer, and a sell out crowd at one of the largest stadiums in Europe every single week. - ARU take note!

OK sorry for the double post. Just to reiterate my opinion: Rugby can deal with an outsider looking in (as this guy seems to be) and it should have the balls as Thelmawrites says to have a good hard look at itself. But to be perfectly honest Rugby Union is a far more successful brand than the NFL, in that more people play it, are associated with it and go to watch games or watch it on TV> Doesn't mean more people invest/consume the product, but NFL Rugby aint' going to sell the game globally...Soccer's almost the antithesis of American Football and yet whose talking about altering our old buddy Football ;)

Sorry Who needs a Melon (I've only got to his first comment so bear with me) I'll read your first post after 1 post this beaut I'm highly disappointed in you guys for not telling me something as whoop-ass as this thread had started. I've been on holiday too..had heaps of time to post comments ;) You all know I love my American Football and Baseball and they're getting a right royal thrashing in this very intriguing topic...and yes finally I agree with Steffy on something Americans are one of the most acculturated, most passive (and dare I say obese) countries in the world. I mean China loves to brainwash its people, but for all their talk of liberty and with a new president at the helm and Change and all that, Americans are some of the most uncritical people in the world when it comes to Capitalism and the system of consumption which we've all inherited from them. For them it's a simple fact of nature, that sport is supposed to be fun and that fun has to be associated with consumption, thus by in large they are radically uncritical of sport's attempts to get them to sit in their seats not just to watch a match, but also to treat sport like a movie as some enlightened fellow said earlier in this thread (sorry I can't remember who :) ) This issue of passivity is quite odd, but one can understand it as a result of over hundred years of saturation by the world's first free market, where money buys people's souls ;) Sport is not about empowerment it is about conformity, perhaps that's why Romania used to fund Rugby under the Soviet puppet government You'd think being about liberty, people would kick up when they feel their rights to enjoying the game are being impinged on, but ah well. I like to think about my sports, I don't play sports but I like to consider myself an armchair commentator. I don't blog on this kind of stuff, but one cannot gain a true understanding for sport's position in our culture unless one takes a look at oneself and one's place in the grand scheme of things. Apparently Americans don't do this...and they loath all that reminds them of their dogmatic behaviour. Goodness at least the AFL's putting some effort into trying to compete with its competitors. By the way, American Football's mostly about trying to achieve the greatest results by the minimum of risks, ie taking the ball two yards rather than twenty if there's any chance of an intercept. Of course the Bradys/ Warners/ McNabbs take a few more risks. And the coach has too much input, which doesn't suit our egalitarianism. That's not what this anon. head suggested, but it would be what it takes to make a game like "NFL" work in the three-dimensions of the game of Rugby Union . To tinker with the contest would give the game more in common with American Football than a Rugby code. This guy is smart and has some valid points but he seems to want a game that he can understand better, being in the context of other North American sports.

Dublin Dave Thanks for the excellent reply. It stumped me and I couldn't gather my thoughts last night (I check the Roar at midnight) and will post my reply tonight at midnight! I just wanted to acknowledge your reply and the smiley about Trinity College before this thread ic closed. Oh, John Grisham has a shortish novel "Playing for Pizza": about an NFL reject playing gridiron in Italy. It's nowhere Jame Joycish or Thomas Beckettish but it's funny and utterly unlawyerly. Monty String Likewise I replied to an earlier thread of yours asking me to name my Wallbies for the NH tour. I think the thread might have been closed and you didn't see it. Could you ask your mystery gridiron coach (MGC) what sort of "training" the NFL refs, umps, judges go through? How do they get their decisions so precise? Cosmos Forever In NFL, the defense have big bad boys so the imperative for the offense is not to lose possession of the ball. College football is much more offensively "creative" (at least when I watched it a long time ago). I've only seen ONCE the sort of rugby passing through a gap, and the play is called "The Wishbone". Other plays you see in college football that you rarely see in the NFL are The Screen, The Shovel Pass, and the running back playing quarterback. Enough for now. Until midnight. Cheers.

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Dublin Dave I agree - rugby should be more concerned about the guys playing the game than some couch potato who might watch 15 seconds of a game between getting his budweiser and eating a corn dog.

Ian Nail on the head with those comments. I think rugby should be very wary of seeking to "appeal " primarily to the couch potato with a popcorn bucket in one hand and a remote control in the other. It might just succeed!!! But then it would just be a passing fad for many of these guys who will be just as likely to click over to Monster Truck Racing, Ultimate Fighting Club or Gladiators when their attention wavers. Concentrate on the true believers and you will attract many more. Monty Just to come back to you on the international appeal of baseball. Here's an excellent article which appeared in the Irish Times a few months ago. It's from a regular column on American sport written by an American journalist called George Kimball. http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2008/0424/1208904400689.html Even allowing for the fact that his column is aimed at the small Irish audience, Kimball does with it for American sport what Alistair Cooke did for American culture and society in general with his legendary Letter From America broadcasts for the BBC. Kimball takes it for granted that his audience will not be instantly familiar with all the characters, issues and intrigues that populate American sport and presents his reports and observations accordingly. His weekly column is a must read IMHO. Although mainly concerned with softball, as opposed to baseball, he does illustrate very clearly how the American's self centred attitude stymies the growth of their games overseas. So what if there are 110 members of the International baseball federation? If these are predominantly made up of US embassy staff and military personnel based overseas then it is not properly an international game. Believe me. The average European could name ten famous baseball players, from any era, with the same ease with which the average American could name ten famous Belgians!

I fail to see why he wouldnt put his name down) It seems to want to NFLize rugby. Its a documented fact that NFL has failed several times to grow the sport globally, even more so than league. It cant have the appeal some think it has other than in the US. It remains a largely amateur game around the world. So why would rugby adopt the razamataz? I dont want rugby to go all commercial like NFL but I think the NFL bloke was saying that to grow in a competitive environment the administrators have to think like a business not as coaches. Also talking about it being a stop start sport??!?!?!?!? When he coaches American Football????? That’s the definition of irony right there!!! Why not just add some forward passes in there. Then with the no knock-ons, the quarters at the WC, half-time show and we have?........NFL+ Stoping play, razzaamataaz, specialist players mmm NFL lite. Rubbish. The guy is focusing on entertainment entertainment. That is a side issue. US sports are myopic & appeal to primarily their own in regards of playing & limited in global appeal to go watch other than on the TV. Honestly Monty, did you just right this out yourself while sitting on the toilet??

forget about what the coach thinks of rugby Monty - ask him why more rugby tactics aren't used in NFL as a surprise. Imagine a series of lateral passes putting a fast runner into the gap behind the line of srimmage - it would work! I was at a Raiders game in Oakland back in October and couldn't help think that some league and union tactics would have taken the game by storm! Go Raider Nation!

Here's an interesting article about Sports and Globalisation -- http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/d5e3056a-d131-11dc-953a-0000779fd2ac.html?nclick_check=1

Dublin Dave - re the only thing you can only do in America - - - - and likewise when in Australia attend an AFL game as a truly unique world experience......... .......long live culture, bio, economic and sporting diversity. the saddest day might be when the sort of "I wonder if so and so could play such and such" questions all get answered........(i.e. everyone plays only 1 global sport)...........the worlds gotta remain 'richer' than that!!! certainly though, give me Dylan ahead of super sizing.

Compared to the majority of professional sports, rugby union is an infant and its growing pains are obvious as it struggles to see if it can compete with football, NFL or any other professional sport for the floating spectator. The baby needs feeding, money and the need to attract the TV dollar to help finance and grow the professional game is undoubtedly important. It would be naive to ignore the demands of the TV moguls but should the whole fabric of the game be changed to meet the commercial break? NFL, NBA etc obviously have adapted to meet the demands of TV, but I would argue in the States it is culturally more acceptable than in Europe, where we find the commercial breaks to be an annoyance and generally fragment the game and can be a real turn off. I very much doubt whether this coach has ever played rugby, as by playing he would get a different perspective of the game. The nuances of the game would become more apparent and he could then bring a more rounded view to the party. It is inevitable that he looks at rugby from an NFL stand point which probably is why the NFL continues to have limited appeal outside the States, whereas rugby union has a wider appeal worldwide. It raises the question of whether there is anything worthwhile one can learn from the NFL or from any other indigenous sport in the ‘States. Having spent a number of holidays in the ‘States culturally there are many differences but probably the most significant is the inward looking attitude of the majority and the lack of appreciation that many things are better outside the States and rugby is one of them. There is no complacency far from it but rugby in the immediate future will always have a limited appeal. Why, because it is a minority sport and it can not compete with football in the winter months yet it can retain a strong following with a particular ethos that is attractive to TV and the media. Indeed one of the more positive results of the growth of rugby has the recognition by football of respect for the referee. Another interesting stat is the increasing number of female supporters, who would never go to a football game; I can gauge that from my four daughters and their friends. There are increasing numbers of rugby players who have become disillusioned by professional football and have switched to rugby and that trend will continue as the game gradually becomes stronger and attracts more sponsorship, but rugby is never going to be gold mine. Rugby has to pay its way and must be careful that it doesn’t run before it can walk. Looking on from the UK, rugby in OZ has its rather unique pressures where it is a professional sport probably third or fourth behind AFL. NRL and the growing A League, competing in a market place with a captive spectator audience which is very limited in size. Rugby, in my view, is entertainment and as proven in Europe is beginning to attract bigger gates and audiences, TV companies want more rugby. However to change the fabric of the game artificially on the pretext of making the game more attractive, more attractive to whom, some idiot who sits in front of his TV set flicking his channel changer eating his popcorn and drinking his bud is very short sighted. Martin Johnson is a keen follower of the NFL as are a number of high profile rugby players. Of course the coach would dismiss the attractiveness of the rugby player to NFL because the professional NFL is fed by a strong, well organised college structure that provides the players of the future. They don’t need any others as they already have too many coming through the system. However if you were to transpose the likes of Johnson, Eales, Vickerman, Habana, Sheridan, Robinson etc and they had been brought up in the American college system would they have made the grade, who knows but I bet they would have made a good go of it. One or two others points, all the GPL clubs I have visited have time clocks visible to spectators, “ref link” which at present is limited to internationals is to be trialled for GPL games next season. “Ref Link” as the name implies is a direct radio link to the ref who explains his decisions not only to the players but also to the spectator. How many times do NFL teams bring on their specialist kicker for a shot at goal at the fourth down, to get the three points? Quite a number I would suggest so I find his comment on points for goals rather hypocritical. If Chicago was to be chosen for 2016 Olympics it could be good news for rugby as last years Churchill Cup was centred on Chicago. It is all relative but it appears that rugby has a foothold in the Chicago area and as the host city can bring pressure to bear on the choice of new sports will it enhance rugby’s chances?

Thelmawrites Exposure on TV is only part of the equation. In the UK, and Ireland, there was an explosion of interest in American football in the mid 1980s thanks to the emergence of a new free to air TV channel which promoted the game with coverage tailored for a new audience and broadcast at least one live game a week from the NFL. It became very popular for a while but there was no attempt to build a playing base in Europe. Even with the advent of the short lived World League of American Football which had teams in Barcelona, Frankfurt and London, all of the players bar a few token converts from other sports, were American NFL rejects. It was a fad for a while and then fizzled out. The American attitude is simple: they're our games. We will organise the business framework within which they operate. If you want to play at the top level, you gotta come to America. They treated the likes of Barcelona and Frankfurt as just another Smalllville, USA. And they're not. Even in soccer, which is a genuinely global game, the powers that be maintain a strict regime which requires the rich clubs in Europe, where most top players play, to release their players for competitive international games. Although the clubs gripe about this, it has the effect of keeping some form of contact between African, Asian and South American, not to mention the odd Australian, players and their home audiences. However much the likes of Manchester United and Real Madrid may covet a worldwide audience of devoted replica shirt buyers, the simple fact is that nothing generates more interest in a country than the sight of their national team playing in a major championship. That underpins an interest in what a top club in a faraway country is doing. Remove it, and you remove that vital link. This is a concept that American sport simply cannot comprehend. It's just not factored into their considerations. Now don't get me wrong. I'm not saying this because I dislike Americans. I don't. Or because their sports are bad or their players not as well rounded athletes as the rest of us. That's not the case either. They're wonderful games and their top players are stupendous athletes. But the relationship between American sports teams and their followers is very different to what we have in Europe. In fact, given their success in selling other parts of their culture both good and bad ranging from Bob Dylan and Martin Scorcese to blue jeans, baseball caps and down to cholesterol burgers and Barney the Purple Dinosaur it is refreshing to note that sport is probably the only part of American culture that remains exotic and mysterious to the rest of us. Isn't it nice to think that the one thing you can do in America that you can't do anywhere else is to go to a good Baseball or American football game? PS, although I still live less than a mile away, it's a LONG time since I was a Trinity College student. :)