Welcome to the new dawn of English rugby

The season is too long in Europe as you are getting 11 months of Rugby which is too much on the bodies of players.Rugby Union should be played for no longer then 8 months so it gives a nice 4 month break to look forward to the next season. NFL is a great example.

Unfortunately that was not playing to form for the tahs based on recent years. But hopefully it's their MO going forward.

How would this affect The British and Irish Lions tours to the Southern Hemisphere? Would the NH players be to jaded to go on an end of year tour?

It makes sense to me that, with less sports content (especially football) in the summer months that you'd have more people attending rugby games. Especially on those balmy school holiday evenings when it stays light for longer in the day. Beers, BBQ and taking the kids to the rugby. Now there's a great evening out for the old fashioned English Rugby fans!! The inbound-outbound tour switch is another "no-brainer" I reckon. SH teams travel to the NH in June and NH travelling South in November. It provides a winter break for the SH fans and a fitting finale to the NH season. You'd also move from hosting tours in mid winter to hosting tours in early summer/late spring. So again it's warmer, drier and better for open rugby and night time kickoffs (which will happen anyway). The 6 Nations, well where do you start with the benefits there. It's already accepted that the 6N has the best travelling crowds and all the atmosphere you ever need at a rugby game. But then imagine a trip to Rome in the summer time, instead of the winter. You'd also land the 6 nations in the major school/university holiday period and open up all sorts of travellers pack opportunities! This would also align the 6 nations with the new SH 4 nations and we'd have no issues getting Los Pumas released from their NH club contracts to play for their country in a regular tournament. It would also ensure the IRB could specify a set global off-season for players through the months of late December through to February. On top of that you'd have the worlds premier club/provincial competitions all climaxing towards the end of the year and the opportunity would arise for a Heineken Cup vs Super 15 match (or something spectacular of the like). In England, Scotland and Wales you'd move from competing with Football towards, massively increasing the potential supporter base. You'd also reduce any issues with ground sharing and turf wear and the tenancy of Rugby clubs would become a great cash injection/partnership for Football teams who's stadium don't get much use in summertime. The competition for attention in Ireland would be a less straight forwards hurdle. GAA and Football both offer significantly different stumbling blocks, but the heart of the Rugby season (through June/July) would be packed full of International inbound tours, 6 Nations and some H-Cup games games. So the IRFU would have plenty of ammunition to capture the public attention!! The French, well who knows there at the best of times. It does seem to be a fairly money centric sport at the moment and I imagine the LNR would love to gain more public support in the North. A move to warmer weather and away from football could be a great bonus for the game in those more northern areas. But the heartland in the South might not welcome such warm weather (although how great would an 8pm kickoff be on a lazy French summer evening!).

A March - November season for the NH? In NH, it's spring, though March this year hasn't been exactly balmy with snow in the last few days. But still it's getting warmer, grounds improving and days are longer. so that sounds good. Then you hit the first rounds of the H Cup in April/May as the soccer season comes to an end. GAA sports kick off in a big way, and the Irish national soccer league also starts. Cricket and Wimbledon get going in the UK. Still it gives us plenty of choice. (Don't know what they'll be up to in France.) Then the SH teams would tour here in June then a break for the 6 Nations in July/August, then back to finish off the leagues and Cup in Sept/Oct and travel south to do the November tours against SANZAR. That could work. Hope the SH teams don't mind shifting things around for us, still it would be in the best interests of the game.

It's not about the idea. Everyone likes it. It's the manner of implementation by the IRB refs who have made an unholy mess of bringing them in. We're now going to have the farcical situation of SH refs ruling it one way in the S12+2, English premiership refs another, and the Magners' refs another. Have a look a this article featuring an interview with the Scottish captain on the topic http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/rugby_union/article7083490.ece

Honestly though guys, it is a fact that England (and the UK in general) suffers a lot of wet and cold weather over the winter months. Just like most other places really. It is also a fact that it is more difficult to play expansive rugby in wet weather and on muddy pitches too. In my opinion it is the wet weather that is most to blame for the tendency of british rugby to me more attritional and tight. There are definitely teams who can throw the pill around in the GP and some absolutely great athletes who can run and step and score brilliant tries. But, the weather more often than not makes it hard to do this. On top of this, you have an increasing demand for night time rugby for the benefit of TV viewing. This demand will only increase over time and kick-offs will be pushed into latter time slots. Again, playing in the colder night time temeratures are a detriment to the ambitions of attack play. Handling levels go down and the fans in the stands are subjected to a colder temperature which is more complimentary to a cup of tea than a pint of lager. To me, the benefits of a Summer centric rugby season in England are large. While the negatives are small. But then, it's not my country or my rugby competition so maybe it is easier for me to accept the benefits of such a drastic change. The recent winter in the UK was only the icing on the top, so to speak. The extreme cold weather made games in many codes unplayable. But the snow factor is probably not even as bad as rain + mud factor that is around for much of the season. To me, a move to Summer rugby, is one that makes playing the game more fun for both amateurs and professionals alike. Personally I used to hate (as a child) playing bare foot rugby in NZ in the frosts and cold winds of winter. I don't imagine this basic human instinct is different anywhere else?! Throw on top of the improvement to playing conditions, the improvement in comfort for spectators (especially for late night games), the reduction in sports entertainment from no football, the improvement in pitch quality and it seems like a "no-brainer" in many ways. Just out of interest, what do people see as the logical reasons AGAINST a move to a summer centric season?

I don't think a global season is a plausible option, Justin... or not in the next 50 years anyhow. Beyond that I disagree with your core points. Firstly, low scoring games in the English winter aren't really that common. Secondly, I would suggest that the majority of English rugby fans have played the game at some point, and if that is the case then they will have played in winter conditions, and thus are unlikely to be turned off by the occasional mud wrestle. I'm not conceited enough to trot out the increasing attendance figures, and platitudes like "We're all right over here, chum!", sort of stuff, and I WOULD like to see a break during the winter as they have in the Italian and Scottish soccer leagues. However, fundamentally I do not see winter rugby as a problem. You could argue that having to play in wet conditions improves skill levels, IF teams have an ambition to play with the ball, and the majority of GP teams do have that ambition, IMO. During the past two seasons I have been deeply unimpressed by the skill levels of the Australian and SA backs (and I'm not just attempting to be bitchy by saying that). For example, a player like Luke Burgess still struggles with basic passing duties. Ultimately, therefore, I believe that good skills come down to good coaching and ambition. Take the Waratahs as an example. They are badly coached, IMO, and have no ambition, and thus the teams skill levels seem way down the skillometer. I would also suggest that winter rugby extends the playing careers of tight forwards.

I would agree with Bakewell, but the flip side is that the more games you play the more experience you accrue. There has to be a happy medium because the travel in the S14 is excessive. The NH calendar is basically a lost soul, so the most the Brits can hope for is an illusion of central contracts like we have with the (flawed) EPS agreement.

I may not have worded that right, my apologies. I am convinced though that a move away as much as possible from the dead of winter, muddy ground and wet conditions is the way forward for the game in the NH. It would also set the basis of a global season. Fair enough it's tradion to play in winter but you won't win new fans slogging out 6-3 scores on a cold night in London. I agree with some of VCs arguments below.

Yep, I agree. It's good to see the likes of Bath and Gloucester moving up, and to see even Sarries having a crack. But I think we'd see even more ambition if the sport was a summer game. Interesting comments from Mark Bakewell on Delve's move: "Gareth is currently playing 36-38 games a year and probably 50 per cent of those on grounds that are soft and muddy. He is now going to play 14 games at a different speed and then have seven to eight months when he can train to be fitter, faster and stronger.” A perfect summation of why the southern hemisphere structure is vastly superior to the north's.

Let's not forget that we have just come through one of the worst winters in recent memory. Clubs like Leicester, Northampton, London Irish, Bath, Gloucester and Harlequins do try to put width on the ball. The same teams (aside from an injury hit Leicester) tried to do so during the winter, but things (for obvious reasons) just didn't click. IMO the past few rounds have been very good.

Something had to be done. It's been thoroughly depressing to see ghastly, hoof-rugby teams like Saracens have such strong seasons. They wouldn't win a point in the S14. It's disconcerting that British rugby scribes have been so obsessed with dishing Antipodean ideas that their own awful rugby seems largely to have escaped their notice. Stephen Jones, to be fair, has spent most of this season bemoaning the entertainment on offer but somehow he still hasn't managed to make the obvious link between the slowness of the ruck and the dreadful rugby. So credit to the IRB and the S14 for leading the way on this. BUT: please let's not entertain any insidious mutterings about the scrum and maul. I've already read a shocking interview in which Jonathan Kaplan claimed that "too many penalties are being awarded at the scrum" - what ever happened to rewarding the dominant scrum, Jonathan? - and the Kiwis already seem to be angling for a reform of the rolling maul simply because their teams lack the technical nous to stop it. Quick rucks + rewarding strong scrums and strong mauls = A terrific, balanced game.

I'm beginning to come around to this idea. The weather is probably the single biggest reason why northern rugby can be quite stodgy at times. I enjoy the sight of eight beefy boys rumbling in the mud as much as the next man, but it does worry me that this type of rugger produces a somewhat one-dimensional breed of player. Perhaps a Mar-Nov season is the way to go...

I think you're looking for an issue that doesn't exist.

'The sooner the NH realise they need to be playing rugby in the summer the sooner they will produce consistently skilled and athletic rugby players'. Justin, this doesn't make any sense at all. Please list off some unathletic rugby players for me. One is either athletic or not. Fit or not. trains or doesn't. Weather has nothing to do with it. As for skill, I also miss your point. Players either have a level of dexterity or not. Practice then makes perfect. Weather has little bearing on this. These benighted arguements really are getting dull. Have a look at Dara lawlor's recent article on Ireland for a look at what a true rugby thread discussion should look like.

The Northern Hemisphere does play rugby in the summer months. The season runs from August through to June. It also plays in the Spring and Winter months as well.

What I find intriguing is that the majority of Pom bashing seems to come from Roarers who I have never heard of or ever seen contribute to a rugby thread. Very odd.

Wasting your time WW. The majority of the southern world's view on GP is based on an assumption that has been perpetuated through the media. Please just give up looking for objectivity in these kinds of threads. Backing up arguements with paper trail fact's aren't how arguements are won and lost here sadly. How amazing is the relegation battle between the bottom 4 at the moment? Adds such a dimesion to the competition. is there a team in the GP that is NOT fighting for something? I love JT's 'limited skill' arguement.........esp seeing as Melbourne seem to be buying GP rejects hand over fist at the moment. At the end of the day, its human beings playing rugby, not that different anywhere you go. Given weather conditions and the vast difference in the number of games the NH guys play compared to the SH, this is bound to have an impact on how the game is played. In any case, 1-5 are the critical positions that provide success in a World Cup IMO. Decent forwards are required but without the 1-5 nobody wins anything. Ball in hand or not.

The sooner the NH realise they need to be playing rugby in the summer the sooner they will produce consistently skilled and athletic rugby players. Playing in mud heaps for half the season does no one any good and competes directly with the worlds biggest sport. What would they be up against in summer? A bit of cricket? The poms are'nt worth watching in that either ;)