What price winning?

I remember a post (losing) game interview last season where Bomber was asked about the teams' lack of initiative. He said he had talked to the team at each break and they had ignored his instructions. Pretty hard for a coach to make things happen onfield if the "team leaders" do what they wish. Although I still have a healthy respect for Geelong, Ablett is a huge loss and I doubt they will make the Grand Final. If Essendon do not improve, not too difficult from where they finished last year, I wonder who will be made the scapegoat ? It all makes for an interesting year of football. :)

bomber got a nice free ride on the back of the best recruiting leader the cats have had over past dozen years, Wells look at 2006 the basis of the team was on track but the coaching team stuffed up it took the appointment of team leaders to take them through to 2007 premiers, but who stuffed up again in 2008 the coach sat their and let the hawks back in the game what moves did he make none, why was'nt a fit Mooney in the middle lifting the side because the coach was numb. so what happened in 2009 the team leaders took charge ,and made it happen. now we come to 2010 the team as a whole are on their way until we hear rumors the coach and one of his top player are not talking, great stuff from this well paid coach. now we come to 2011 its my thoughts that Essendon will find their coaching stocks will not have the improvement they hope for whereas the Cats with their soundness and new keen coach will be flying again.

For starters it's not just about 2011 finals or not, but beyond that. May take 2-3 years to get it right. I want Essendon to be competitive, to fight tooth and nail in every game. Its too early to know how we will go in 2011. We have a young back line, but many rate Pears very highly to replace Fletch in time.

With regards to your comments regarding Bomber, I disagree but respect your right to your opinion. Thank you for the reply.

I dont think Essendon are a shoe in at all, Im just being realistic that I dont think that they will make the finals in 2011. They will be competing with some other clubs like Carlton, Sydney, Melb, Nth Melb and Hawthorn for spots in the eight. Whether they can make it will depend largely on how a Plan B and Plan C actually get implemented at the club. They also have some of the more average players in the league that fit the "experienced category" such as McViegh and Welsh and Dustin Fletcher is still there best defender, it doesnt bode well, especially if he goes down injured or gets his couple of annual suspensions. Thompson was using the Ablett situation to shield own intentions of leaving. As I already said Geelong will be forever grateful for Thompson and his coaching panel and what they did for the team for the past 10 years.

Well what can I say ? I didn't think this was going to happen in any discussion between us but here it is....... I agree 100% ! :>)

Firstly, it is not uncommon in business to move from one role to another. You are hardly going to announce it to the world until it is a done deal. Secondly, my sources tell me it was former Essendon players close to Bomber that made the initial contact and figured his time was up at Geelong post the Ablett fallout. Thirdly, the media have drawn a link between the supposed 'hypocrisy' of his Ablett comments in hindsight. When in fact it was due to Ablett not signing with Geelong which Bomber desperately wanted which was the catalyst for his own rethink. Finally, a mentor coaching role is not the same thing as the senior coach.

As I said in the original post " There’s nothing wrong with this in the environment of high scrutiny, and high pressure coaching. Coaches are fired by Clubs when they no longer want them so why can’t coaches resign if they wish?" The problem arises with the, unanswered, question of whether Bomber and Essendon had been conferring whilst he was still Geelong Coach, with considerable time left on contract. This, I believe, is where ethics come in to the picture.

Game plan and player motivation, team ethos, spirit, the works. One of the first things Hird has to address is the poor kicking under pressure, the BS play on regardless works if the players are capable of accurate disposal under pressure. Hird is bringing far more skills based coaching back to the players, 'teaching' in his words. Knights was trying to be Geelong of 2007 but did not work hard enough on skills and when the game turned against the Bombers he had no plan B to counter it or reduce the scoreboard damage. Our defensive pressure was appaling. Games against the Bulldogs and first half against Richmond as a couple of examples of potential were scorching hot last season. We have one of the most exciting lists, but need Ryder, Hille, Watson at their best to win the ball out of the centre. Who better to plan and coach them than James Hird.

SportsFanMelb I don't know that Essendon are a "shoe in" for the finals but if you look at their list with a discerning eye rather than that of an opponent supporter you will see it is not as bad as people seem to think. As I said in my response to Redb, in my opinion it was the game plan. They were trying to play to a plan that required almost 100% efficiency whilst dealing with ridiculous unwarranted handballing in the back line. (The reasoning for this still eludes me.) Anyway, I believe the team we have is better than the odds represented by the bookmakers so, although I haven't bet the house, I've had a few interest bets. With regards to Bomber Thompson I don't think it has been "proved" that he was a hypocrite although it has been made to appear that way by the media obviously in an effort to keep the story running. Regardless, when you throw mud some will stick. Whether Bomber has been treated unfairly or not we will probably never know but he did a good job whilst at Geelong and their supporters should be happy. All the best.

I'm not one eyed at all!! One is red the other black. :) You are being too precious re Bomber. http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/cats-hurt-by-failure-to-heal-rift-20110110-19l59.html The catalyst. There is no good way for a coach to leave a club, most get sacked, he had every right to move on if his heart was not in it.

Well out of all your responses , few of which addressed the initial question, you have finally said something I can agree with which relates to Essendons' list. Everyone says Essendon's list is weak ! You have pointed out the teams we beat over the last two seasons of which three were top four contenders. The list wasn't and isn't weak, the game plan was poor. I think many people will be surprised this year at the team' performance which doesn't alter my personal dilemma regarding The Essendon Football Club. Redb you are a one eyed supporter which is your right but it also means your idea of what is actually happening is so biased as to bear little resemblance to the actual truth. No disrespect intended and I am pleased James and Bomber are at home. I'm just not happy with the way it was done.

Thats the beauty of the AFL system, no team dominates forever like the Euro soccer leagues!

Geelong are heading down, Essendon on the way back up. Better get used to it :)

I didn't say Sheedy turned on his club as he quite clearly didn't. What I said was"like Sheedy I like to believe they are doing it for the kids....... "I love Kevin Sheedy's passion and vision for the game and maybe Ablett is also looking at the big picture.I realize Ablett was was following the money but his profile will help afl in the long term and that is why it was a good decision in my oppinion.

So by your logic Essendon are a shoe in for a finals spot this year and the players they have were not one of the main reasons that Essendon lost. No one on this forum has claimed Knights is a great coach (or even a good coach)but Essendon lost many games by poor disposal and poor decision making and they will be the same players that will pull the jumper on this year. No point living on teams that you beat in 2009, that year has come and gone and what did Essendon do for the previous 5 years before that? Making 1 finals appearance in 6 years (and getting flogged in that game by the tune of 90 points) indicates that they were lucky to make it. It doesnt matter if Bomber was a Geelong man or not, doesnt have any bearing on the fact that he was a hypocrite. Geelong have been in the gun by all teams the past 4 years and they have done a pretty good job handling it. Talk about spin - do you work for the EFC media department? The line 'There is a journey......' BS is trotted out by every club that has had some lean years (check Richmond they have been on a journey for 30 years!).

Ahh the same list argument. So 2010 ladder position was a reality check, 2009 a fluke. Well that is called spin. If your logic follows, Essendon will finish 14th in 2011. Almost all fans of other clubs miss the point, its not that we lost so many games, it was how we lost those games. The list in 2009 was capable of making the finals, beating Collingwood, St Kilda, Hawthorn, Carlton along the way. Still beat Grand Finalist St Kilda twice and Top 4 team Western Bulldogs in 2010 but then would lose to West Coast!. Knights was sacked becuase he could not build on that list and coach the team, he lost the players, he lost everybody. Oh and Geelong are in the gun from Essendon, it may not happen straight away but it will happen and Bomber will be on the sidelines to watch the Cats trudge off. Bomber never was a Geelong man, you better accept that, Ablett's lack of loyalty to the hoops turned Bomber to think about his own heritage and that is Essendon. Essendon members and fans know there is a journey and that the sons of the club are back to the club they love. Members signing up is proof we want to be part of that journey. Go Dons.

As a Cats fan no one is going to dismiss what Bomber Thompson has done for the club during the past 11 years. It finished with 3 grand final appearances for 2 wins and as already mentioned on here an 85% winning return. The town will forever remember this period in the team's history. Whether Bomber and Essendon acted ethically is anyones guess. If he was so tired that he had to resign and couldnt possibly continue coaching it seems a bit far fetched that his fatigue would be gone in a matter of weeks so he could sign up with Essendon. James Hird also did himself no favours during the debacle that was EFC at the end of 2010. Bomber was a hypocrite in regards to the Ablett decision, it doesnt matter whether you leave for money or some deep seated loyalty the point of difference is that Ablett had completed his contract and Bomber walked out on his contract. Saying one thing about loyalty and then doing the opposite is hypocritical - that is what Thompson did. The problem that Essendon will face is that they still have the same list (give or take some trades and draft picks) and this list is not that good. They luckily made the finals in 09 and 2010 proved to be more of a reality check. Just because James Hird and Thompson will be sitting in the coaches box doesnt mean that overnight these players are going to be much better than they were last year. The teams that did not make the finals in 2010 that are more likely to sneak into the top 8 would be either Hawthorn, Melb, Nth Melb and that makes me think that Essendon wont be there again in 2011. Who will they look to blame this year?

Dons already pushing 31,200 members - pretty incredible when you consider they've been in the wilderness for 10 years - a long time in bomber terms.

There is no comparison between Ablett and Sheedy, Sheeds did not have a contract option. I have no issue with Ablett going to the GC but clearly his coach did. But please dont pretend its for the good of humanity as we know it, the money was probably just too good to knock back. People also forget Bomber was not only the one at Geelong disappointed with Ablett's indecison and ventualy decision Frank Costa former Cats president still thinks Ablett made the wrong decision.