England rout Italy thanks to Ashton's fab four

You're doing it again: making provocative comments and then attempting to trivialise the comment. A fellow Roarer once noted that you came across as a man trying to provoke an argument in an empty room. You don't contribute to the rugby threads you just appear to stalk/harass people. I've pointed out why what you are doing is selective, but nobody wants to argue with you, so please stop. I've asked you respectfully not to attempt to contact me. I'm finding this all very unsettling.

Its not just on this thread - the comments go back a couple of years and do show a pattern and I'm not the only one who has taken issue, but yes, its all pretty trivial in the end!

Parisien, why you feel the need to do this only you know, but if I had made any of the two or three comments I have made on this thread re: Australia in a pub whilst chatting to an Australian it would be considered harmless banter. Perhaps that doesn't come across via the internet, but I don't see the harm in suggesting that Drew Mitchell or AAC have been known to show boat. That is hardly denigration, nor is the accurate suggestion that Australia haven't 'thrashed' Italy in a good long while, and if you feel the need to question why bring Australia into it, you might want to ask Killerwhale why he brought NZ into the thread, or ask James why he feel the needs to be so sarcastic further down the thread. Personally I don't care, because it's all quite harmless. I hardly venture on to many Australian threads, so I'm sure you could better spend your time.

Quite right Pothale! All is ok. And I will not condemn your comments, as the humour, irony and (usually) subtlety are apparent. And talking about rugby "spankings", I can remember quite a few, and they are no guarantee for WRC success or failure!

"You’re not looking for a ‘feud’ but you’ll pester me, and then finish a few paragraphs with ‘Anyway, back to the rugby!’. People not looking to be provocative generally can resist the urge to behave that way, I would imagine." I would have imagined this too! "I’ve been through your England comments with you before." Ah well, in that case milord... - just as I have been through with you on your Australia comments before. Look Ben, I appreciate that people like you keep these threads alive with your regular contributions, and you often have quite interesting observations to make on the actual rugby, I'm just saying you and a few others might want to tone it down on the sideswipes of other teams' performances. i've never understood this need to denigrate other teams' performances, and despite your innuendo, I have never indulged in it, even if I make it clear who I barrack for. I wouldn't be so quick to label it as "humour", as and you point out, it can quickly turn to vitriol.

I was going to make the same point about penalties, RF. In fact some stats published by Planet Rugby (not sure how reliable they are as a source) show that for the tournament so far: Most tackles made: Italy 253 Most tackles missed: France 28 Most passes completed: Scotland 402 Most line breaks: England 17 Most points scored (team): England 85 Most points scored (player): Ashton 30 Most tries scored (team): England 10 Most tries scored (player): Ashton 6 Most possession kicked: Wales 45 % Most turnovers won: Ireland 8 Most penalties conceded: England 27 Most offloads in tackle: France 25 Most errors made: Ireland /Scotland 31 Least tackles missed: Ireland 7 Least errors made: Italy 14 Least penalties conceded: France 15 England have scored the most, and created the most penalties. Ireland lead the way with most errors, but their defence has held up with least tackles missed, and most turnovers won. France were able to win the game yesterday without hardly having to get into the Irish 22 - they punished from longer range. Whether that will tell in the game against England remains to be seen. Equally France have conceeded 6 tries in 2 matches linked to them missing most tackles. The next round of games - Eng v Fra and Sco v Ire will tell us a little bit more about England, France and to a lesser extent, Ireland.

Parisien In fairness, if you look back at the posts, it was I who put up the first humorous post - poking fun at England mostly in making a comparison about the size of the scoreline 59-13 against Italy compared to recent scorelines posted by SANZAR teams. VC disagreed saying that he'd back any of the SANZAR teams to give Italy a spanking on their home soil. You claim that 35-12 is a spanking. However, my original point was precisely about the size of the England scoreline - from which I mockingly drew the conclusion that England would definitely win the World Cup as a result of this. I take a dig at most teams - including Ireland - as do 99% of the posters on here. So in fact, I think you need to upbraid me for taking a dig at England (again) and join Ben S in your utter condemnation of me for such comments. Ok?

You're not looking for a 'feud' but you'll pester me, and then finish a few paragraphs with 'Anyway, back to the rugby!'. People not looking to be provocative generally can resist the urge to behave that way, I would imagine. I've been through your England comments with you before. I've spelt out my Italy argument succinctly. My point remains valid, as does yours in your opinion. This a site based on humour. I've never seen you rushing to involve yourself when the typical anti-English vitriol pours out. A few harmless comments directed in response to a few English comments is hardly the end of the world, and it certainly doesn't necessitate your involvement. You could just not respond to me if I irk you. Frankly, I'd rather you didn't.

I don't want to start another blog feud thats lasts days, but here you go again. What answer and what consistent England comments? I would describe my comments as varied and reasonable. That 35-12 scoreline is home and away, and don't forget a lot of teams struggle to put Italy away in Italy, especially recently, including England, Australia and the All Blacks. But yes, SA and NZ probably do better than most; I'll have to check the stats. My point remains valid. At any rate I 'm not sure what point you were trying to make, why you'd even bring up Australia on a thread about England beating Italy. It seems you, OJ, and sadly even Pothale (but mostly Poms and Kiwis) now and then can't resist having a dig at the Wallabies. And yes, this is an observation that goes back a while now. I don't understand it. If a team plays well, they deserve praise, and if they play poorly, they deserve criticism. As simple as that really. Anyway, back to the rugby!

I would prefer to see Haskell keep his squad because a) he has been playing well, b) as you say, he is playing well in tandem with Wood, c) France don't have a natural over the ball 7, and d) Haskell has played against the French back row regularly in France. Agree about Cole. His work rate is excellent at the ruck, but game by game he is contributing more in the loose, as if he's becoming more and more accustomed to the pace of Test rugby. He's a ferocious player.

Re: Haskell, the question is whether Johnson will bring back Moody for the France game because Wood and Haskell have formed an excellent partnership. Tindall's done a good job as captain. It's also good to see Cole contribute a bit more in the carrying stakes, he's got a bit of pace on him as well.

Good crowd of 80'010 at twicks for this match. Awesome.

My point above seems somewhat undermined by just reading that England actually gave away 18 penalties on Saturday (Ireland were blown up 13 times by comparison). To some degree, if you dominate possession then a lot of your open play stats can trend above average (save for tackles and the like). It still surprised me because I don't recall Italy having many chances to go for the posts or even hearing the referee warn England for persistent infringement. I'll have to watch the game again without the assistance of alcohol.

England will be one of the teams to watch, there's definately going to be some good match ups and it's going to be a great year for rugby. I was noticing something a bit odd with the English when I caught the match against Italy on a replay. After a set piece or break down, they have players who are no-where near the ball running through the opposition line and loitering about in what I thought would be an offside position. The ball has been passed out and gone through the hands along the back line, yet these players are 20m ahead of the ball standing out with the opposition full back. In some plays they waited there for the ball carrier to run forward generally to where they were standing at which point they linked up in support or went in to protect the ball. Anyone else see this?

Watching the Ireland game reminded me of how England's discipline has improved.Certainly, Wales had two early penalty chances which, if they'd taken them, might have set the game on a different trajectory but, generally, England haven't given the opposition many opportunities to go for goal. Ireland's penalties cost them the match yesterday. That's a turnaround from a couple of years ago when England regularly picked up yellow cards and suffered as a consequence. The Viscount mentions James Haskell above and there was a time he was a penalty machine, as Lewis Moody used to be in the early days of his career. Dylan Hartley is another who reliably got on the wrong side of referees but hasn't so far. I'm sure this has been an area they've actively tried to improve but I wonder also whether the style of play helps too. When you focus primarily on stopping the opposition rather than scoring yourself, you look negative and referees can respond to that by keeping a close eye on what you are doing wrong. When you are on the front foot, attacking the opposition more regularly, referees perhaps turn their attention more to the other team. Referees might object to that characterization, and attack-minded Ireland didn't get any favours yesterday. Nevertheless, I've often felt teams like Australia and New Zealand have benefited in the past from that kind of rub of the green, because of their attacking intent. Australia lose out somewhat because they are getting extra attention in the scrum again, and there was some evidence that New Zealand's work at the breakdown is on the ref's radar more than before. For the moment, though, England aren't getting on the wrong side of referees. Perhaps we are managing them better these days. Few international captains seemed to have a worse relationship with the on-field officials than Steve Borthwick - although Rocky Elsom appeared to make a challenge for the position in a couple of Australia's matches last season. I'm not suggesting England are now getting away with murder but we don't seem to be chief suspects quite as much as before. That could be a handy asset at a World Cup. Mind you, Southern Hemisphere coaches are pretty astute at drawing attention to areas of concern, and I say that with admiration. If England do build any momentum then I'm sure opponents will start to help referees notice where they are regularly infringing.

Don't worry about it, SB. Thanks for the apology.

Italy were abysmal, missing one on one tackles, I rate the Italian forward pack but the backs are just club level. And when you get the better of the forward pack the game was England's. That was the nub of it. However I do think that England has improved dramatically. I would rate them the "smokey" for the WC.

Apologies to Ben S - new kid, no sleep and got wound up but is no excuse for me playing the man. Sorry.

Haskell at 7 is increasingly becoming a realistic option IMO, VC. He's very disruptive at the ruck, without pilfering much ball, but his athleticism and dynamism sets him apart from opposition flankers like Barclay, Dusautoir and Zanni. Wallace and Warburton are also quite explosive, but I don't think any European flanker can match Haskell as a carrier. From what I've seen of France this 6N I've been very, very unimpressed. If England contain them in the tight as they did with Italy (no easy feat) then they should record yet another victory over the French. It seems that Lievremont has learnt nothing at all.

agreed - again it wasn't a criticism. I thought they played the percentages really well. Once they realised Italy had nought in defence they ran it more often and from further back - Bravo!