Playing hybrid rugby in a perfect world

The umbrella idea is genius hopefully people wake up and do something beforeits too late and the elephants in the room of AFL and soccor. I think any experimenting is a good thing it doesn't mean the current hybrid will be the final product. I think keep building on it.If It is actually possible to preserve what we like about both codes in union its mulit-faceted strategy, different body shapes and free flowing rugby. In league its athleticism, strength, courage and unencumbered rugby. I think a thirteen man game is the future but this doesn't mean that flankers have to disappear. I think flankers in the future will be become more multiskilled and able to be used in the backline so they could either be used in a scrum or in the backline based on strategy. The number 8 I think will become a cross between a league hooker and a union halfback Cam smith would be a good example who could slot in to the scrum if needed but be used as a halfback to give the ball out the backs. I think there will be a 1st nippy reciever(think thurston), a 2nd larger receiver(lockyer), a center, 2 wingers and a fullback(who of course slots in to centre in attack). I think what Matt argues about rucking is a great idea we create a contested play the ball/ruck situation. I like the shot clock idea but it could be extended for "positive plays" (if you watch league you LOVE it when your teams tackle count is restarted) or penalties that increase the clock. So your biting your nails watching as the teams frantically attempt to to "use it or lose it." So less numbers in the ruck, the quicker the balls is spun wide and a succcessful line break increases the clock by say 30 seconds. 7 man scrums are out I think a 4 or 5 man (frontrow, locks, no8 scrum versus) verse a 6 (frontrow, locks, flankers) would be interesting depending on whether your team needed men out wide or how confident you were with your scrum (there is no rule in rugby that says you must have 7 forwards arranged in the manner they are). 5 metres out would be interesting.

And RL 9s, with a 4 year rep calendar: RU WC Commonwealth Games RL 9s RL WC Olympics 7s

That video does not show northern england are league mad. it shows PNG are league mad, well to fair it shows they like mob violence and can pack out a stadium that looks to hold around 10K to 15K for a game that occurs once every couple of years or less.

Hybrid Rugby, I totally agree with your points about boring rugby. Rugby can be a great game. At its best, I think it is better than league at its best, but it can be so frustrating. BUT, sometimes it is terrible. I like mauls and scrums, but the problems are well documented - scrum resets, too many penalties and penalty shots at goal, the ruck rules are unclear... for a start. I don't think a hybrid game is the answer. I think the answer is to fix the rules of union so the above problems are resolved. I think this will happen, not by the IRB, but by a rival organisation. I would like to be a part of that. I'd like to see rugby in which a dominant scrum could push the opposition back 5-10m, instead of a collapse and the ref guessing who should get the penalty. Rugby with less penalties and less penalty shots at goal. Rugby in which the attacking team feels that the only way to win is spend the majority of the time running at the opposition with ball in hand. I played rugby 20 years and coached 3.

I know this is an Aussie issue but my two cents worth is that rugby is growing gang busters overseas ,it may have its issues in Australia but look at what it has achieved in sixteen years . You've got to look at the bigger picture Sanzar is already looking at expansion ,so my advice is get your next team ready . And also your playing in a comp with two other nations that have extreme player depth and hold your own very nicely thankyou . I think in some ways you guys have a bit of an inferiority complex ,why ?, when we send teams over to say Melbourne we take it very seriously .I believe League and Union will reunite but it will be a crimson revolution not a red one ,J O'N wasn't wrong about that fact but his timing might have been a bit out ,but as the rules of union are continuing to be streamlined in the end who will be the winner.

Iam sick of watching the NRL or S15 on telly and seeing the mass amounts of empty seats at the games in Australia and New Zealand.The AFL club games trumps both Rugby codes for crowds and also (now it seems)for TV ratings while the Socceroos get bigger crowds then both the Kangaroos and Wallabies. Over in New Zealand it seems people to give a damm about the S15 unless it's the Crusaders and the Warriors seem to get a bandwagon support. Both codes in Australasia needs a re-think and re-vamp.

See, everyone has a different view of how to improve rugby. If you're going to reduce players to 13 & reduce mauls & scrum resets, penalty kicks, etc, what do you have? Rugby league. So people who don't want those things can certainly go & watch rugby league. I keep coming back to NZ. Rugby league hasn't impacted in that country to the same extent as Australia, because generally speaking, the Kiwis play a much more passionate & expressive game of rugby union than found in Australia. NZ rugby league kicked oiff in 1907 with the All Golds, one year before rugby league kicked off in Australia. And irony of ironies, rugby league used the 1905/06 All Blacks Originals to Britain, Ireland & France as their template when considering changes to make their game more attractive. Based on the breathtaking play of the 1905/06 ABs, British rugby league reduced the number of players to 13 & introduced the play the ball. If you want to watch rugby league, then watch rugby rugby league. Rugby union, when played the way it can & should be played, is a far superior spectacle in my humble opinion. The problem however, is largely the timidity of players to chance their arm in all countries, except New Zealand & to a lesser extent France. And occasionally Australia. For most countries & most players, the challenge to test their abilities to the edge is too frightening for them.....

It might result in an all round better game though. Sometimes Super Rugby is great to watch. Sometimes it just so boring I switch to the weather channel. Super Rugby is great when it's played similarly to league - wide and open, like the Reds do. These trialled rules are a joke - but there are aspects of league that rugby could adopt (13 players to open up the field, reduce boring slow moving mauls [yawn], get rid of tedious scrum resets, penalty kicks, and reduce number of players in the scrum, get rid of boring kicking to get out of defensive pressure etc) that would ultimately make the game better. In all honesty - the ball is in active play alot more in league than it is in rugby. We know this yet our bosses are two anal to improve the rules. At the moment it's only money that keeps League from developing overseas but our coffers are full because of our benefactors. If our game became faster flowing like League and we put our money behind it we could seriously start to rival soccer. I say this as the former assistant coach of a Shute Shield team that fears our game in Australia will always be behind AFL and League unless we make it more entertaining. A merger with League and its rules could make us the dominant code in Oceania. Imagine the current 16 NRL clubs, plus the 10 Aus & NZ super rugby clubs, plus Adelaide, Central Coast, Sunshine Coast & Central Queensland in a 30 team comp.

Damo, There are plenty of hybrid demonstration games from the past - but what do they prove? Anything resembling characteristics of union is dominated by the union guys, & anything resembling league is dominated by the league guys. Another point, alluding to something I said in an above post, Australia is the only country where the union/league divide is an issue. Australia is the only country where league is dominat over union (if you exclude PNG) so it's not something that occupies the thinking of folk elsewhere. If anything, union will take over league. Union, apart from Australia, has little or nothing to gain elsewhere by entering a hybrid offshoot.

Accepted Sheek more or less but can't we have a friendly 'test' between the best of both to prove you right? Or wrong? I personally don't hink there could be a hybrid COMP but a one off test and a combined umbrella of admin and cultural cooperation would be good for both codes.

oikee. I think that's one of your best and well-rounded comments I have read. Well said!

There is often this perception that by joining union & league the sum of the whole would be greater than the parts. While that might be the dream, it ain't necessarily so. In fact, the hybrid game might not satisfy enough people & lead to greater disenchantment. As for the total being greater than the parts, it was obvious even before union & league split that Australian rugby had a problem with producing huge, tough, tight forwards - your props, hookers & locks. Even before the union/league split of 1908, we struggled for dominant forwards in the period 1899 to 1907. And it shouldn't be forgotten that before 1963/64, the Kangaroos had won only two series, EVER, against the Great Britain Lions. The first series win was in 1911/12 & the second in 1950. The Kangaroos won 3 series in a row - 1963/64, 1966 & 1967/68, before losing in 1970. They then won again in 1973 to begin their huge unbroken dominance against the Lions. But it was a long time in coming. The win/loss register for the Kangaroos (against the Lions) wasn't in our favour until either 1984 or 1986 from memory. Johnny Raper is one of the 5 greatest players to represent the Kangaroos & play rugby league. Yet, had he been a rugby union player, he might never have achieved such a Godly status. Where would Raper have played in union? Most likely the backrow. But he was too short for either no.8 or blindside flanker, & not fast enough for openside flanker. His exquisite ball skills & demon tackling might not have been enough to take him to the highest level - consistently - in union. Arthur Beetson is the greatest ball-playing prop ever seen in rugby league. But unless he could dominate at scrum time, he also might have been another who would have struggled at the highest level - consistently - in union. And here's another thought for Roarers - why hasn't rugby league had the same effect in New Zealand as Australia? There is obviously more than one answer to this, but one unpalatable suggestion, in light of the dirge currently served up by all the Aussie super rugby teams bar the Queensland Reds, is that NZ rugby union teams have usually played a consistently better, more passionate, more entertaining brand of rugby than Australian teams. Rugby league has evolved in Australia as a philosophically different sport from rugby union, & we should just accept & appreciate the different forms of rugby on display.....

please your full of shit http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgfXMiSFJSM Northern England are league mad.

Jeznez 8 man scrums are not very fun for the fans who watch it at the ground or on TV.

I know what you blokes are up to - you are just trying to depower scrummaging. Tighthead props love a good flanker angling his drive in to help him keep square. Six man scrums are not real scrums. I've played 7s and 10s with their reduced scrums and they are just not as much fun.

Just for the record Wall Nut I love the idea . I just think it should be developed carefully before some league exclusives start getting defensive. Axisofsense do you have any sense of irony? I am sure no one is really 'scared'. Mine was a deliberate overstatement to make a point. The excitement is great fellas but there needs to be a few more baby steps before you are going to challenge two multinational multimillion dollar footy codes to bend their rules. Let's start with a hybrid test friendly and see if anyone salutes.

Scared! Damo why would anyone be scared about a discussion/argument. That's all this is. As for the people who put the hybrid together, I don't think they intended to do anymore than what Wall-Nut is talking about. As for fan driven, what do you think drives this site. Don't get scared enjoy! It looks like and sounds like a fun challenge in an imperfect biased couple of codes. As usual the youth show the way by participating instead of crawling back into the safety of their respective codes umbrella of biased protectionism. There is more chance of this hybrid pulling people together than any cooperation by the codes heirachy. They didn't show any interest in this experiment, they knew it was on though. If there was ever a chance to take step forward they should have both at least put forward access to their resources.

The big English sides in both Union and League operate under a salary cap, if the smaller clubs weren't competing they wouldn't need one and would be spending a lot more. Leicester's turnover for example is around £18 million, they could outspend all the leading french sides except Toulouse and Stade Francais if they didn't have to adhere to the salary cap.

Just trying to open people's minds to it. Fans can vote all they want, let's just say League ended and Union ended with no vote, Hybrid exists now, would league/union fans watch it? Of coarse they would, unless you want to watch AFL or soccer, but your satisfaction would not be reached. I'm pretty sure the article I wrote was simply "A perfect rugby hybrid scenario". I know better than anyone hybrid will not gain momentum and I'm not trying to change the game, but simply open people's minds to something that could be better than what we have. -- Comment left via The Roar's iPhone app. Download The Roar's iPhone App in the App Store here.

Wall Nut - I appreciate your sentiment and excitement but hang the gloves up champ you're scaring people. The hybrid game would only work if the fans voted for it. So it has to be fan driven. No amount of blOg writing will do it. BUT we could at least have one game between the stars of both codes. Start there. Then we may have tomleave it there if it doesn't have legs It's premature to talk of a hybrid COMP after one schoolboy game. Remember this what happened when some footy folk made some rushed decisions in 1908. We got a 103 year code war. Let's lay down the defenses and talk about cooperation for the good of both codes. Most league exclusives probably think they have nothing to gain frOm RU. But there are numerous advantages on offer. International money for one. Venue cost reduction is another. Poaching control of things like Hunt / Folau debacle. And market power by combining forces against AFL and soccer. By the way a poll on Fox website has a majority in favour of Wallaby/Kangaroo game. Hey what about a Wallaby kangaroo Kiwi All Black game? Now you've got me doing it. I'll stop now.