Where to next for English rugby in turmoil?

sorry, words keep getting changed why I post...odd.

Truth is, they just didnt have the players in NZ. Look through their RWC team sheets position by position and honestly think how many of their guys would make a world 3rd XV or above...not many. The good news is Foden, Ashton, Youngs and Tuilangi seem to have a good future while Dan Cole looks like he has what it takes to be a front line international prop for years to come. They really need some goods in the backrow to link their always strong tight 5 and back line that might be brilliant in soon enough. The look great with Flood at and quick ball. The crop of loosies they had at the RWC were poor compared to all the teams that finished above them and even some below.

Shock , horror . English rugby players caught drinking beer in N.Z. Obviously the winners write the history . England for 2015 to defeat the Puritans and re establish whatever it was ,maybe.

' and they pretty much out-played the Baby Blacks in this year’s final. " I thought that the young english team excelled with a big,mobile forward pack and hard-running backs...assisted by home-ground support....but the best team of the tournament managed to hang in there to the end and come up with the victory.

The highlight of Martyn Thomas's reign must be threatening to sue someone in order to suppress a damning report into his conduct over the sacking of Chief Executive John Steele. I just hope that with the 2015 tournament coming up this gives the government more influence than usual over who runs the RFU.

Thanks HP will have a look at it now. They can do whatever they like post game in my book as long as they don't start playing in a manner that will make best use all of their talent pool.

Potty mate - I am after the early hit, I know what these pomies are like if you give them an inch etc etc Still you are Irish and had a good RWC along with the Welsh and the French (in the end) which leaves only the Scots who tried hard, Italy who had a poor one and ENGLAND who seemed to look the goods right up to the start of the game.

You have to laugh at John O'Neill's chutzpah. The ARU barely has two farthings to rub together and yet he thinks he's in a position to offer advice to the financial powerhouse that is the RFU from the other end of the world. The cheeky chappie really ought to pipe down for once. As for the England team itself, it's perfectly simple: they need better coaches and better players. I have my doubts that they will hire the coaches, but the players coming through are excellent: the England U20s have reached three of the last four world U20 finals and they pretty much out-played the Baby Blacks in this year's final. So the signs are promising - we just need to hope that all this young talent doesn't get lost in the boshfest that is the Premiership.

Restruture the RFU even more, appoint a head coach with experience eg(Grahame Hnery ,Nck Mallett, Jake White, Richard Cockerill even), and i would not get clive woodwrd involved either move on from clive woodward to, and i would appoint martin johnson maybe as an assistant not a high performance director but as an assistant probaly to forwards, or send him back to club rugby if any clubs would give john a head coach position.

It is an amazing thing that England still think of Rugby in terms of the Boys Club where you played the game then got pissed and mooned the presidents wife and thought it was fun etc. It smacks to me of living in a time warp, the English side just hasn't moved on from the amateur days. In today's modern professional set up the type of behaviour that was roughly acceptable is no longer palatable and is not tolerated. But somehow the message doesn't seem to filter through to the English side, me thinks that this is management problems, not player problems. Players will get away with what they can, it is up to the management of the team to show them the boundaries and to enforce some discipline. It seems obvious to me that this is not happening, the solution may be to change management. I believe that Henry is making some noises about being employed in some capacity within the England structure. they would IMO be wise to employ his services to instill some discipline with his teaching background. In saying all this I do not want to denigrate England too much as other countries have problems from time to time with players doing the wrong thing, however in the instances of the recent WC it would seem that England should bring their house to order.

we have our challenges but dont have 130 clubs signing a petition to axe our national chief executive. thats drama in another league.

I can recommend the Guardian: http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/rugby-union it's usually my first stop for news from my homeland, and provides a nicely impartial and balanced view of events rather than the "Strung 'em up!" type of attitude displayed by the UK tabloids and the right-wing broadsheets. As for the England team, I can't see much being done, the team will remain as is, but with a few notable retirements, the hierarchy will remain, and they'll still be propping up bars on their next international tour. It's about time they started behaving like professionals and left this ridiculous attitude of "what goes on tour, stays on tour" where it belongs: the 1970s.

Glasshouses and stones come to mind, stillmissit. Is the ARU in such healthy fettle to be jeering another union? Or are you getting your poke in early? :)

Love to see the pommies in disarray - nobody does angst better than the poms. Lets hope it rolls on and they never get their act together because as Moaman says above they should be at the top or near it . Bring on the big whinge and the political stoush, we just love to observe it from the southern hemisphere. BTW any links to Pommie sites/papes who are discussing this situation?

Firstly let me say I was hugely impressed that the Clubs,off their own bat,issued an apology for England's deplorable off-field antics in NZ.I see out-going skipper Moody has come out with some more ruminations regarding that in his new book.Pity he and MJ didn't act at the time instead of letting the England campaign spiral into a kind of free-fall.The least-publicised(but most-disturbing) baiting of a female Hotel employee by three (bullies) really crossed a line imo. So those same clubs(presumeably) uniting to oust Thomas carry a lot of weight.England's sloppy record on the field over the past 8 years probably is unforgiveable given their resources.The most players and the most money.Really they should be a permanent fixture..if no at #1 then certainly in the top 3.Definitely time the Old Boys' tree got a good shake,in my view.