Pacific Islands being shut out of Super Rugby

your right there mate. that's why the doors are opening to those countries with bigger pockets, more money. countries like Tonga, Fiji and Samoa are to broke.

it doesn't matter if Super Rugby shuts out PI players, we'll figure it out on our own and we will overcome adversity, everyday a stereotype is getting killed off because of the determination of our people, I believe that New Zealand is very lucky they have Samoa, Tonga & Fiji use their country as a stepping stone economically, to be honest it's a known fact that it doesn't matter what country we islanders go to we will persevere and we will become the best, for e.g. in the US Troy Polamalu (Safety Future Hall Of Fame, Samoan), Haloti Ngata (Defensive Line Future Hall of Fame, Tongan) Junior Se'au (Linebacker Future Hall of Fame, Samoan), That's just naming a few. Super 10s had Samoa as a team and all their games was at Eden Park.... What happened? Darren Kellet BABY!!! lol

Having a P.I. team in Super Rugby is an exciting prospect with many, many challenges as previous poster have already stated.....who would fund the team and where would they play? However this topic has something in common with expansion into the American market. Why not get USA Rugby, Samoa, Fiji and together with a private investor and place a SR team in Hawaii? The capital Honululu (sp?) is a city of over a million people with no professional sports teams. Also, the University have a really good American football stadium for the team to play in. Bringing in 40 or so P.I. and American players and they might be able to compete. I know I am dreaming but this covers all bases. It gives the P.I. players their own team and puts a team in the US market. Although for the record I am still in favour of the mainland US having their own professional domestic competition.

With every post you look more and more immature and insecure. You have failed to respond to any of the issues I have raised and resorted to childish quips. if you can't handle having your thoughts challenged kid I'd stay well away from sites such as the roar, it is quite clear from your handling of my responses to you that you are well and truly out of your depth, hence your need to falsify what I had said and shift the goal posts to suit your argument. You have tried to create something that was not there.

You simply can not in 2012 but a team in a sports comp based on ethnic lines. Look at the old NSL in football for lovers of football they would know about this. However in rugby in the UK stye have teams based on ethnic lines. London Irish, London scotish, London Welsh. But players of all heritage can play in it.

What ever you said RUGBUG....lets go with your theory then. Is that make you happy now! don't throw your toys around it's only my humble thoughts mate... Peace out :-) Cheers A former JuniorAB/SRugby/international 7's/euro club player for more than 10 yrs

Quite clearly incapable of debating in a resonable and adult manner Kiwiboii, Time to grow up I think son or just leave the roar for Adults. So what do you say about all the White boys in the NZ team Kiwi Boy are they English / Irish / Dutch before they are kiwis. I'm sorry kid you cant have your argument work one way and not the next. Ma'a Nonu is a New Zealander with Samoan parents it really is that simple. If someone turned around and said he was a Samoan before hw was a kiwi there would be hell to pay and you dam well know it. Ma'a loves playing for his country and he said that himself when refereing to his country he is refering to New Zealand, yes he acknowledges his samoan heritage however he like I know that we are Kiwis first before we are anything else. New Zeland , Australia, America and the entire pacific are built on immigration and immigrants, in your eyes Kiwiboi how long does someone have to be in NZ before they can call themselves a Kiwi if we use your theory no one is a New Zealander they are all something else! But of course not you will try and argue that it only pertains to those of the population with pacific Heritage, oh my theres that word again HERITAGE. I'll wait for you to fabricate another post and infer more untruths as well as shift the goal posts to suit your post again.

RugBUg.....I know where you're coming from in terms of being new zealanders and the lot but whether these guys are born and bred in NZ or not they're still samoan. They are kiwi/samoan, right! Take Ma'a Nonu for example, do you think he's a samoan/kiwi or palagi/kiwi ? he's mom & dad are 100% pure samoan blood, is that make him a nzer without samoan attach to it? Talking about RWC....instead of how many nzers in the samoan team, how about HOW many samoan or PI blood players in the AB? When you figure that out then you know how lucky the AB are to have some of these guys playing the game....May be we should thanks their parents for moving over from the Islands. Over and out, and good luck with your up coming TEN PIN BOWLING Competition

Truth be told, It is obvious that SANZAR want Super Rugby to be a development mechanism for the Springboks, All Blacks and the Wallabies, after all that is there job! There is no argument about this nor should there be. It should not be SANZAR's responsibility to promote Pacific Island Rugby other that to pick the eyes out of the talent pool and develop those players into their respective squads. Not sure about you but that makes perfectly good sense to me! My point was directed at the IRB and their involvement in the development of Rugby. Now I have no idea as to the amounts of money being spent in any direction, which just quietly you seemed to enjoy pointing out, however you must have been living under a rock if you have not heard the constant reference that the IRB make to the enormous amounts of money they need to develop the game in emerging countries. This same excuse is trotted out every time there is any discussions at World Cup time about the distribution of the vast amounts of money produced by the tournament every 4 years. What I am saying is that instead of spending most of those funds on emerging Rugby playing nations, how about we spend some on the existing Rugby Nations. I have no doubt that if a Pacific Islands Team was introduced to Super Rugby financially supported by the IRB, not SANZAR, the effect that this would have on all of the Pacific Island Test playing Countries would be immediate. What ever that amount of money would potentially be, if it was spent in an emerging Rugby playing Country would take years to flow through to Test performances.

I would say at 6"3 112kg and an ex lock for Spotswood you are drawing a huge bow here Kiwiboii. Nothing wrong with my genes son and I easily match if not dwarf many of the Island boys I know. I'm not saying all Greeks and Maltese are huge at all and never have I alluded they are! No one is denying that Polynesians aren't big or fast and can tackle hard, NOWHERE EVER DID I SAY THAT!!! What I said and I am sick and tired of hearing is people trying to infer that NZ is pillaging the pacific island talent when in fact that is far from the truth if anything it is going the other way. How many of the Samoan squad at last years world cup were from NZ in 2007 I believe there were more New Zealand Samoans in the squad than there were native Samoans. This topic was not started by the Genes debate at all it was started by Terry, Kovana and the likes saying that SANZAR does nothing to help the Islands and NZ steals the talent from the pacific and that we do not offer pacific players spots in super teams. yes we all know they are big but and sporty however we also realise that there are more pacific islanders living in Auckland than there is on the islands themselves in many cases. Pacific children will be born in New Zealand therefore making them Kiwis first with Pacific heritage So before going on your little rant Kiwiboii read what is written don't try and infer things are said when they are not said at all. Leave the fabricating and manipulation of posts out of it! GET IT KIWIBOII!

Rug Bug...I get your point, but that doesn't change the fact that these Polynesian players have great built to be great rugby players which BOOM BOOM point out. Like your Greek genes you're never be naturally built for rugby i.e. BiG, Super Strong and Fast and can tackle HARD!!!! That's why the ABs are strong because they have these kiwis with these GENES GET IT RUGBUG!!!!

I never said i wasn't proud of my heritage who are you to even infer that I am not? however lets get real here it is my HERITAGE yes I have it running through my DNA but it is New Zealand that is my birthplace it is NZ that gave me an education it is NZ where I pay my taxes it is NZ that represents me. I am a New Zealander first and foremost with Greek / Maltese Heritage and I find it hugely offensive to be called anything else but a New Zealander as do most of my friends with heritage in other lands. My father and grandparents have roots back there I don't, I have never been to either Greece or Malta in my life much like most of my New Zealand Pacific friends who have never been to the Islands, yes we are all proud of our differances but we are New Zealanders first!

boom boom's point regarding to heritage is true and that's a fact...they are kiwis but they are samoan, tongan or whatever too. It doesn't matter whether they want to be known as nzers or not, it's in their blood and that's why they are solid built human beings. Hence is great for rugby without a doubt. RugBug you still a Greek/NZers/Maltese, no one take that away from you even if you don't want to be known as that, you should be proud of who you are. Like Obama, he still have a Kenyan blood in him, so as Genia he's aussie but also PNG.

1. In the three recent World Cups Manu Samoa appeared to be a crowd drawer? The data are there it would be easy for a statistician to comfirm or confound that impression. 2. Samoa could not afford a Super team based in Samoa. But all here would welcome a Manu Samoa based in Auckland or an Australian capital city. A Manu Samoa controlled from Samoa but based in any Australiasian capital city woud be financially viable. 3. A PI team does not make sense to Samoans (and maybe Fijians and Tongans). Manu Samoa is the best PI to be the ice breaker. 4. It seems so obvious that it appears the super countries believe it is in their own interests to keep Samoa out.

what none of you guys seem to realise is that NZ has 26 provinces (excluding Super franchises who don't exist for the sake of the topic). There are many PI players playing in these competitions (partly because of NZ's temporary labour visa program). What they need is development in skills. From my point of view: Having seen, and reported on, Fijian rugby from the hinterlands (Naitasiri) to the vales of Nadroga and beyond, I can tell you that there's little wrong with the game from a physical point of view. They play their rugby with a speed and intensity that would leave even the so-called hard men of the RL awed (if not shocked). What they lack is skills and discipline (ie reading the game and changing tactics accordingly, forward drills etc). Given the limited spots that exist in Super franchises at present, it makes sense to see more PI players in the ITM Cup. (I still wonder where that new Blues fijian winger David Raikuna came from!)

I think that the players are just following the money, and of course, in most sports the money for sport is in Europe. It is a real shame that the Super Rugby comp does not get these great players, and personally, I believe the Pacific Islanders should get a team in the Super Rugby.

I accept the population/crowd/corporate box/television audience in the locality issues. That is why I am wondering what the cost would be and whether the IRB could fund it. Ideally you'd be looking for a way to make the nations self-sufficient but depending on the cost compared to the current IRB grant I'm curious to know what the gap would be.

yewonk, don't you believe! In tonga, samoa and Fiji, RU has been built into their culture. That's why soccer in these countries struggles so much. For the record, I hate seeing RL in the islands, mainly because it splits and weakens these already small Island unions (financially, player numbers etc).

Your comment alone also shows ignorance boom boom. I have many friends with Pacific heritage and all whilst acknowledging their Samoan Tongan and Niueain roots all proudly call themselves New Zealanders first and foremost. They were born here, grew up here, eductaed here, got married here, had and will have children here, pay taxes here and will in all likeliness die here. To infer that they are Samoan before they are New Zealanders is absurd, out of my large circle of friends who are of pacific heritage only 2 have ever been to the islands one of them was last there when he was 4 years old he is now 36 years old. I am of Greek and Maltese decent through my Father are you trying to tell me that I am not a Kiwi I am Greek / Maltese more than I am a New Zealander even though I have never been there for petes sake my father was 2 when he and my grandparents immigrated to New Zealand. Your argument is flawed, yes they are of Pacific heritage however most are New Zealand Born and raised therefore making them Kiwis just as much if not more than they are Samoans. Does Keith Urban Claim to be a Kiwi before Australian Does Barack Obama claim to be Kenyan before American? Does Will Genia claim to be Papua New Guinean before Australian?

I don't know the exact funds but a total pipe dream jeznez i think, why . -Such small populations Samoa 170,000 Tonga 108,000, fiji about 860,000. But 50% fiji indian, so not big rugby fans. -French polynesia Tahitti quite big but still not big enough either. Hawaii USA which is very polynisean population has over 1 million people and they love rugby. -No money made from corporate boxes. Suva has a good stadium , but samoa and tonga, not decent the stadium, but do have a good training academy to train in. -PI teams would not make enough money form merchandise either, or pay tv subscriptions, or tv ratings for advertising. PI team could work in Auckland, or west sydney i would be confident of that though as big PI population Auckland , Sydney.