Why a title could hurt the Wanderers

Im sure at the start of every season, all the teams aim to come second so their attendances go up

The crowd that night from what I remember was about 9000 in what was only the club's third home game. I don't think that's a terrible crowd considering the club had only been around for a matter of months.

7th heaven matt. so how did the grand final losses make CCM yearn for a title, by their crowds this year being absolutely rubbish for a team consistently in the top 3 or 4.

how did you come to the conclusion that football crowds are more fickle than others?

If there's one team that one can that can build on a championship title it's the Wanderers. With the bulk of the squad signed on for next season and Tony Popovic at the helm, a team that is based on discipline, humility and structure is bound to do well in the future. It pains me to this but this is coming from a Sydney FC supporter.

Maybe you can explain to me why in the sport of football crowds are more and more fickle then crowds at other sporting codes? It happens in most A-League teams and it is not reserved to the city of Sydney. In fact I think this is the first A-league season no one has had a go at Sydney FC's crowds which have been great despite missing the finals. Wanderers in the first year had a core base (ones who went to every game) of around 7,000 so if that increases next year regardless of their next seasons outcomes then the club is growing. I really wish we could reach one day where win lose or draw every A-League game is a must see event no matter what team you are playing.

It's the junior numbers but also things like the move away from suburban grounds, team mergers and so on. I saw some stats recently on members attendance rates; league had by far the worst; as they say it's far more suited to tv, but this is another form of disengagement. I won't argue with you about sfc and the level and type of engagement, but there is a very strong perception that the level isn't enough and the type misplaced and that it has been expectant and tokenistic. I'm sure you'd disagree, but perception is everything. Anyway I'm off to enjoy grand final day, something I certainly did not expect at the ego Ning if the season watching bridge take one too many touches time after time in those first few games. Here's hoping a win cements a few more hearts and minds today, but I know that if it's not to be, the SFS will stillbe rocking tithe drums of the wanderers to the final whistle and beyond.

I wasn't talking about the traditional "hardcore" support though Matt which of course is always going to be there. This is what I mean about critcz not being a part of it - unless you have met the wide variety of people who have bought into the club and have experienced these things then all you can see is people following a team because of the wins. But people are coming to matches because of the party atmosphere (which is created by the hardcore support and won't go away ) and because connections are being made. Jerseys flew off the shelves and were gone before that heart match. There is a point of difference. It would be interesting to look at sport on nsw over time ; I'd argue that it was the introduction of the more commercial aspects that have come into sport that have led more fluctuations. Now rugby league clubs no longer have as strong links to the community there is less reason for people to become involved unless they are winning. Wanderers are doing everything in their power to forge these links and are succeeding.

no they won't

So Matt, to recap; Newcastle Jets had extenuating circumstances which don't apply to the wanderers Central Coast have lost 3 and you suggest that this has made their support stronger, but you don't really explain this - it's clearly not based on attendance levels as theirs went down after losing to Newcastle - and what about the plate? What effect does this have on attendance? You don't mention Sydney FC support at all, which is interesting given that their worst ever crowds were the season after they won in 09-10 which would seem to to back up your theory that winning is a bad thing. Let's just take this at face value... if we accept that the sydney public are bandwagoners and that winning early like the wanderers have might mean that the only way is down, consider the converse, which is that if the wanderers weren't winning, the bandwagoners wouldn't be there, and therefore there would have been a much lower base this season. So what would be better to have, a higher base? Or a lower base? I'm sure the beancounters would snap up your offer of losing like that if they could! I think what irks a lot of wanderers fans - and i dispute the idea that we all think people are "out to get us" (what does that even mean?) is that the comments of "the crowds are only because you are winning" come largely from Sydney FC fans and more generally from people who aren't experiencing what is happening. You weren't at the forums. You weren't at Cook Park. Or the first A-League match in the pouring rain to hear the knowledgeable crowd appreciating the early signs of promise. You haven't made suggestions directly to the club which have been acted upon within days. You haven't heard the noise levels at those early matches where attendance was still building. You haven't been here when the crowd continues singing as the other team scores. You haven't been on the road trips where families and grandmothers are also singing in the stands. This club is being built from the bottom up. When SFC was started the vast majority of fans were happy to have a football team in their town and that was the main reason for following the club; university theses have actually quantified this. This is different, plain and simple. Ok. So it's season one. But what the "see what happens when you are losing" camp fails to appreciate is that these things I have listed - and there is plenty more that could go on that list - build a much more tangible connection with people than what happened with the other clubs and even what the other clubs continue to do; it remains to be seen what this difference will mean, but there's a reason why Gorman and others speak about it being something big. Hearts and minds people, hearts and minds.... they are being won.

Matt, I do not usually react to articles in this way. What you have written makes perfect sense and if you scroll up all the comments you have generated you will find that others are in agreement. They are in agreement that your logic makes no sense, so well done on that front. You have managed to achieve what you set out to do, generate interest, comments and hits on your article. I have wasted more than enough time and energy on an article that makes no sense in both its facts and its relevance. You have presented no evidence or statistics to back up anything of what you have written. You predicted the Mariners to win in your preview. I am happy for you Matt. There are only two teams left in the competition and it is a pretty even match up. Let me guess........you also predicted the Roar to beat us in the semi. If you think anything you say will give me an anuerysm your sadly mistaken. Good luck in your writing career Matt, your going to need it. This will be my final post on said topic. "We may risk losing Wanderers fans to the live football scene permanently if they win too much, too soon." ................hmmmm mkay. The above statement still makes me laugh :)

"Well done, you’ve just described the definition of a Fairweather Fan." 5 games in are you serious. Every factor in the first few games of a fledgling season is critical. Once I was satisfied we would play good football I was immediately hooked. I looked around that day in the stadiums and knew if we kept playing like this, empty stadiums would be a thing of the past. Did you see the weather in the Central coast. If your fans had travelled on a silmilar day you would have been lucky to have got 100-400 fans turning up. "A novel concept, I’m sure everyone wants to believe everyone in their fanbase is as passionate as them. Speaking of fickle SFC fans, we placed second behind MVFC in crowd average despite not making the finals. Hmm." For a team that has ADP I was expecting a little more actually. I was very impressed with the crowd you got for Newcastle early in the season and I honestly thought you would get a few more games like that. Did you notice your crowds slowly dropping off during the season as you were losing. As for not making the finals you lived in hope right until those last few weeks, even the last round you still had a chance but you couldn't beat the roar. If your fans knew you would have no chance with 4-5 games to go just say you would have been lucky to crack 10k a match. "Or you know, all the examples I cited. The four sports franchises that aren’t the Wanderers? Jeez. Not everybody is out to get you all the time, you realise…" The examples you cited were rubbish and irrelevant. Talk to me next year when it will be near impossible to get into "Wanderland" unless you have a membership. As for your sorry excuse of a club you need to find your next big Marquee to drive your membership and attendances. Alessandro isnt going to be your clubs saviour forever..............chop chop. Times a ticking.

By your logic the Mariners also stand to lose support - finally, job done, took up too much of my time anyway! Heck why would anyone want to actually win a final?