Hird to sue AFL over supplements scandal

It's the witches doing the hunting this time. But the ad hominen attacks from you keyboard warriors are the most amusing thing. No footballers amongst you even though your mouths are large enough to swallow one whole. Mrs Donohue is worse than a witch.

Yep, you need a witch to catch witches apparently. He he! The 'Journalist's Code Of Ethics' ?!! That's priceless coming from a former News Limited agent. It really is.

If he's suspended as a result of the proceedings then that would pretty much end his coaching career. No other role at a club is as highly scrutinized as the senior coach and I doubt any club would be prepared to take him on. The charges are pretty damning. At best he's guilty of negligence and incompetence in that Essendon cannot say with any confidence, what supplements their player's were given, their legal status and whether they were fit for human consumption and at worst, he is guilty of deliberately running a supplements program with the aforementioned substances.

Not sure where you are getting your "facts" from John? The status of AOD-9604 continues to be contested, but there is no debate about Thymosin Beta-4 being restricted. Then there is the alleged mystery Mexican drug...

Well, you produce what you've written in defence of James Hird against the worst, nastiest and most slanderous descriptions of him on this forum. Do that and you'll have proved me wrong.

Disagreements in the Maguire household...

'You’re not interested in a good faith debate. You’re interested in destroying the reputation and future of an outstanding Australian. That’s clear because you have not once been critical of the worst, nastiest and most slanderous descriptions of James Hird on this forum.' That is a nakedly false statement, based on your mistaken belief that you have read every word I have written on this site.

The scenario I presented is based on evidence in James Hird's affidavit to the Supreme Court of Victoria. I'm not delusional enough to believe that a man of his reputation and record would committ perjury. You apparently are. Re AOD-9604 and the debate over pharmacology. That was one of a series of legal arguments presented by a leading sports lawyer in the media. Look him up and argue with him, too. You're not interested in a good faith debate. You're interested in destroying the reputation and future of an outstanding Australian. That's clear because you have not once been critical of the worst, nastiest and most slanderous descriptions of James Hird on this forum. Finally, you don't have to discuss anything with me, nor me you. So go ahead and air your concerns, if you're genuine.

Yes, and the Nazi League in WW2 had its rules too, and people who failed to stand up against dictatorial regimes anywhere end up being condemned because absolute power corrupts absolutely. Where injustice is possible, recourse to the courts is always available and the AFL charter does not forbid that right. They just prefer to keep it in house. That would be great if it didn't leak like a sieve and have self-interest as a determining factor in destroying peoples' names, reputations and futures. We must never be meek sheep who roll over and allow ourselves to be slain. We must protect the very basis of the freedom of society and that right must also include the right to challenge any authority, in legal ways, to maintain truth justice and the Australian way!

I am one that has criticized Caro and its not because she reported "truth" or not. It was because of the emotive rhetoric and innuendo that she used. If she is that great, and had all the "facts" where are her sources. She was engaging in trial by media without the possibility of the accused being allowed to reply due to restrictions put on Hird and EFC by ASADA and the AFL. She created a climate of ever increasing hatred that has produced the circus we have now. Hird and the EFC must stand or fall on the facts, the evidence, the proof and not on charges or accusation. The charges and accusations have to be supported with evidence before "guilt" is established. Then appropriate punishments imposed either on EFC, Hird or on AD and the AFL itself for bringing the game into disrepute, not without a little assistance from Caro cs.

Spot on. The Essendon fans should be furious with what these muppets have done to the players and club. The current circus will only make matters worse. Hird's fighting words are akin to the Knight from Monty Python fighting on with only a head left.

My god. The extent of your delusion is extraordinary. You actually believe that, from the outset, the AFL were motivated by an inexplicable desire to 'get' the Bombers. You've posted some amazing things on this site, Phil. Remember your nonsensical ramblings about AOD9604 not being a 'pharmacological substance'? At some point, surely, you need to look back, take stock, and consider whether your views on this are based on anything more than an absolute, unyielding desire to accept that the footy team you support was capable of doing anything wrong. There are those of us who actually want to have a serious conversation about the issues raised. You don't. You are not interested in a good faith discussion. There are Essendon fan forums out there for you to bat back and forth absurd conspiracy theories if that's what you want to do. If you actually want to have a meaningful discussion, with genuine back and forth, give and take, with supporters of other clubs with competing views, then do so. In fact, that would be the healthiest option. But you have shown absolutely no inclination of doing that. You contribute nothing. You just absorb space that could be used for actual dialogue. For what it's worth, I have serious concerns about how the AFL and ASADA has handled this issue. But I have no interest in discussing them with unthinking zealots like yourself.

Okey Dokey but how does that effect the charges regarding what actually took place? If things unwind for the AFL the other 17 clubs can vote to breakaway from Essendon and form another league. The Essendon can do whatever it takes 'til the cows come home.

Hird came out in February - "shocked & appalled" about the "rumours" of injections and peptides. The we find out he was also getting injections. Credibility was gone from that moment onwards. The only interest from that point forward for me, was how the AFL would try and sweep this under the carpet, or whether they would in fact take Essendon (Hird) to task - and if so, what would be the penalties. Past that, we now seem to have more than the odd inference from Hird & the other major players in the Essendon football operations department, that they were merely trying to "catch up" with what "other clubs" were already doing??? Hmmmmmmm - interesting! Perhaps you would care to "spill the beans" for all of us James and let us in on who else the AFL should perhaps have a chat with!

First she's a witch, now she's on witchhunt.

everyones missing the facts none of the substances were on the wada banned list at the time of use asada has found essendon not guilting of a doping program instead asada and the afl have shifted their focus and decided to penalise essendon for "corporate governance" failures. Thats a pretty flimsy charge to base such large penalties on. the media has made this into something bigger than it is presumably because the use of needles are taboo and have sensationalised everything.(lets not forget you can get vitamin injections etc if you want. these compounds are just peptides. not steroids. they are weak and perfectly legal) clearly the afl is trying to find a scapegoat and the media is feeding it because theres no other good stories. if this goes to court hird and essendon will clearly win as the afl as pervertd the course of justice by leaking information from a world governing body. The afl runs a kangaroo court and they know it and once the case is out of their hand demitriou will have more to answer for legally than hird and essendon. its hilarious how much over site to the facts there is in this case everyone is arguing emotively and not factually. its stupid this case. and clear cut once you remove emotion and concentrate on the facts. don't be fooled by the media.

There was no implication regarding drug use: I was directly referring to similarities in terms of narcissism and selfish, high risk strategies between Hird and Armstrong-the drug programme issue itself has been dealt with elsewhere. Any *inference* probably came from the little voice of reason that still exists within you.

Innocent as the Chinese swimmers just hit the turtle soup.

Yes, but I'm not speculating on what a player might think of his mum's comments.

If you think calling her a witch is "appropriate", then I guess your credibility just plunged further.