The Wallaby scrum is the source of our woes

DJW 'Someone with scrummaging experience' has explained what happened - Scott Allen; on this website who analysed every scrum in detail and concluded England should have had one more penalty than they actually did, but concluded that the ref got most of them spot on. Ouch!

@ Chann Wee You are 100% correct. And that's the very reason why I've been in Argentina for the last 4 weeks giving talks, coaching clinics, etc.! t.

@ Enrique TOPO Rodriguez : Maybe as the saying goes , ur knocking on the wrong door. Believe me, there are many ASIAN nations looking for people like u to grow their game. There is a world cup happening in JAPAN in a few, so there are many interested parties . This is the "" HAVE QUALIFICATION - WILL TRAVEL "" era !!! all the best :)

Squirrel & Followers, Many thanks for the suggestion, not a bad idea. However, on 8/9/13 after the South Africa vs Australia test I spoke with a highly ranked ARU board member offering my services. I was advised to talk with Ewen McKenzie directly which I did, without a reply. On 14/9 bumped into Ewen in Perth at the after match function (Wallabies vs Pumas) and face to face mentioned the message I left in his voicemail. I think, he was too busy during the week to answer my call. Then it was all (as they say) academical responding "we'll see what we can do" as if they've already fixed the scrum woos and didn't need any outside help, of course! What was I thinking? The above account is 100% factual! - For "some reason" after 22 years of rugby and 14 years at international level I'm not allowed to ply my trade, work to sustain myself in the area that I know better than 99% of rugby world enthusiasts and followers. Must say, I feel have been underutilised for too long which I consider completely wasteful.

Billy Bob, Without knowing you and with due respect. My pack has 8 players. It is you talking about tight 5, this is a common falacy, a big mistake in preparation. Always said: "The credits to the 8" and "The debits to the 8". This is one of the reasons Australian Rugby needs TRUE EXPERTS THAT UNDERSTAND THE BIOMECHANICS AND THE CRUX OF THE SCRUM. End of lesson! t.

Its never just strength - , size and technique both play a big role. The power of the push esp from the locks is a huge factor. Its easy for locks to hide, whereas a guy like Bakkies apparently always pushes like a steam train. Improving the scrum is not an overnight thing, but something that has to be inculcated into the rugby culture of Australia, at every level. In SA, backs with flair have sometimes been viewed with suspicion as mavericks, but good scrummaging forwards have usually been seen as have pride of place.

Ryan I think the reds website is wrong, 375kg would have to be close to a world record for a bench press I agree that Ben Alexander is a physical freak in terms of his strength and speed, and would be one of the best props in the world but that's not enough

TOPO in Link out. If we could just fix the scrum maybe we could take control of matches. Why isnt there a Roar petition to get TOPO as an assistant.

Why reward a weak scrum by giving them penalties

Topo, great to hear from you. Boy, I wish you could answer those questions that BR asked. Mate, you were a big part of Rat and OZ rugby, as a player. No-one called you an 'immigrant' then, did they? Regarding talk of a scrum academy to develop the tight 5, I personally have been talking about a Tight Five, modified rugby game to promote, develop, strengthen and glamorise the dirty work done by the tough forwards. Played on a narrow field it would concentrate on scrums rucks mauls and pick and go. A tight fast intense wrestling match! And open to all. Not just rugby players. What do you think?

Well as a neutral fan watching the Wallabies v England game I took away two distinct points. Firstly the Referee appeared hellbent on penalising Australia for any scrum issues. I actually though the Wallabies scrum was solid on the feed and that Vunipola was boring in during England's feed. So for one of the few times in my life I felt sorry for the Wallabies. The second point is that there needs to be a review of the need for a full arm penalty for any scrum infringement. Or at least something to diminish the desire of teams to try and force scrum collapses. If you have a dominant scrum that's great, but it should be a tool to guarantee ball from a reset, rather than a tool to try and earn penalties. At present there are too many teams who are fixated with trying to collapse scrums rather than win the contest to restart play. In the end the contest on Saturday was severely dampened as a spectacle from all the scrum penalties and resets. It's just plain boring (pun intended). If you compared this game to the Japanese or Candian scrums you saw the different attitude, where the ball was quickly (and skillfully) hooked and the game continued. More of this please!

Interesting point: Genia was feeding into the second row, quite blatantly. One of the scrums was hilarious, about the 50th minute - Genia sends the ball like a rocket straight through and out the back - I doubt that any of the pack touched it! Presumably Genia realised the ref wasn't policing the feed and took advantage (which is not a criticism). So far as I could tell, both Dickson and Youngs fed pretty much into the centre tunnel. What this emphasizes is how poorly Clancy was refereeing the scrums. He wasn't checking out one of the primary areas which the IRB has focussed on. Mike Cron won't be impressed. All the more reason why the ARU should put in a strongly worded complaint (but NOT a public one) about the referee's performance.

Definitely they are all connected. The line-out also - if you are getting dominated there it will affect the rest of play. And I do not for a moment suggest that we can afford to ignore our scrum woes. But I believe that the primary area where the top teams see us as vulnerable is the breakdown, both attacking and defending rucks. Just sayin'.. On the positive side, its possible to critique both at the same time, and work on them separately. I believe our current scrum woes are unnecessary and that Australia can be good at scrummaging. But its going to take careful analysis and some hard work.

Duh........you've just stated the fallacy in your own argument! Moore is the only man who clearly owns his position in the front row & can be considered of world class. Fainga shouldn't ever get on the field IMO.

Some guys are born being able to lift boulders, others have to train for it. We need more of the former and less of the later. The ability to lift weights and the ability to exert pressure in a scrum are two different things. Benchpress only gives you strong pectoral muscles, which are largely useless in most sports. In fact having big pecs really limits mobility so is a liability and can lead to injury. As

The fact it happens against all opposition is the problem. It also happens in the Top 14, Aviva championship etc. Forget the Wallabies. Any front row which purposefully causes the scrum to collapse or pop up must be penalised not rewarded.

Agreed. Having re-watched the 2001 Lions Tour again a few times this year, even then the Wallabies scrum was being destroyed. But apart from a stronger lineout, the place they were definitely not being beaten was at the breakdown, where they came at speed and in numbers, ensuring quick front-foot ball for the backs. Talk of the Wallabies scrum woes over the last 10+ years continually laments abandoning strong scrummagers in favour of mobile forwards. Yet we constantly see the Wallabies pack losing as a result of being soundly beaten at the breakdown, often outnumbered by the opposition by ratios upward of 5 to 1, meaning we do not have strong scrummaging or mobility. So what do we have? A weaker scrum can be balanced out by strength in the other aspects of forward play. But apart from some individual brilliance from guys like Smith and Pocock, or one-off performances where the players finally step up as a unit, I can't remember the last time the Wallabies forward pack had any aspect of forward play as a strength over opposition teams.

it is pretty simple to select a front row. Get every super rugby prop in australia into the wallaby gym and have a weight lifting competition? alexander will best everyone so he will be in the team no matter what. I feel that benny robinson isnt the greatest man and would be bested by kepu and then for hooker my money would be on saia fainga who apparently can bench 375kg according to the reds website.

Ben alexander was the one shining light for mine against the english so not sure what everyone is on about? yeah look the ref saw otherwise but in my eyes alexander got the better of the english scrum. You (look not all of you) fair weather fans need to take a good look at yourselves before trying to harm someones career with your assumptions. alexander has been a constant in the wallabies since 2008 and he isnt going anywhere anytime soon because he has proven to be one of the great wallaby props of the modern era, yeah his form at the moment isnt the best but class is permanent form is temporary.

I don't buy into this "We have to have an Australian coaching" bit. In my mind I want the best people coaching the Wallabies whether it's a "local" boy or a migrant. Anyway you played for the Wallabies so you're a local boy in my eyes. I can't believe the ARU is so blind to reject the services of someone who has every front row position for three countries.