It’s a subject that won’t die. It is a topic that will linger long after it has worn out the debates – but it’ll never fully die.
The ugly head of the quota system has risen yet again, but this time it’s the SARU president that has brought the subject matter to the forefront. Oregan Hoskins has stated that he has personally asked the Springbok coach to incorporate more “African black” players in the squad.
It seems as though the sports minister, Fikile Mbalula has gone behind closed doors to put pressure on SARU to include more black players.
This is the same man who called the national soccer team, Bafana Bafana, a “bunch of losers.” He has also weighed in on other country’s matters by commenting on Kenyan athletes’ ability to swim.
He is regarded as an ignorant and arrogant leader in government so his comments are usually taken with a handful of salt.
Regardless of what I personally think of him, and the majority of African media, he is still the one in charge. He is pushing a hateful agenda on the success of the Springboks.
He has continuously called for the Springbok team to add black players under a quota system.
The South African Rugby Team does have a history of white dominance.
Twenty years ago, it was the symbol of the white dominant government and people. This stigma has long changed with more and more players of colour making the squad. Some players that are ‘not black enough’ have been ignored in this quota criteria. Mbalula wants a specific type of black player in the ranks and will push hard until this agenda is met.
The problem that almost all pundits and commentators agree with is that the solution is not to force a top-down philosophy, but to build from the ground up. The divide happens early in the sporting development of a person. The majority of black school kids gravitate to football and the majority of white players go towards rugby or cricket.
Why is this divide happening so early?
I cannot answer this and would look to school development and general integration. My high school photo from 1997 had 24 European/white students and 13 students of non-white ethnic backgrounds. Granted my school was an all-boys private school under a Catholic ideology in Durban, South Africa, so this may have reflected the demographic of the time, but we weren’t divided.
We all played sport together, went to social gatherings together and there was no racial tension or divide. Of course, there were different groups of friends within the school, but this is a normal social development in any environment.
Was there a good development structure in my school to encourage involvement in sport? I guess that there was for a school that wasn’t the best sporing school in the district. We had all that we could really ask for from a school sporting structure, training equipment, fields and coaches.
What if we looked into the greater community? Rugby was generally reserved for ‘elite’ schools. Not necessarily private, but well respected schools. Once players have graduated schools and follow through with their rugby, they likely land up in the cradle of South African rugby – the university system. Some of the best players in the country attend the handful of rugby universities and this is where the solution may lie.
One of the biggest universities is the Stellenbosch University in the Western Cape. This university has been the site for law trials and holds a number of championships, but there is one glaring figure that may lend argument to the quota system. Out of the 26,000 or so students enrolled, the vast majority is white with a percentage of 68.5 per cent.
The black ratio is a low 14.4 per cent.
There is an opposite statistic from the University of Pretoria, another powerhouse in the Varsity Cup, with a total of 61,000-odd students. The black students account for 56.1 per cent with the white students making up 39.2 per cent. The differences are not as extreme as Stellenbosch but there is a larger majority of black students in the Pretoria tertiary education system.
Even with both these figures, it doesn’t truly reflect the actual population of the nation, which is 85 per cent black. Do the universities hold the key for proper development and a better quota system implementation?
If the university structure encouraged the involvement of black students in rugby and had extensive recruitment drives, they may swing the numbers in the professional leagues as students work their way through the academies and systems. How this is to be done is up for debate as each university may have a different way of doing things.
The Varsity Cup is a huge competition within South Africa and gets TV coverage and a lot more support than club matches. It’s a gateway for successful players to make their way into the national team, after hard work and dedication.
But there is a stage before this, that could also hold the key. Craven Week is the time when schools and players shine and a huge scouting opportunity for professional clubs to focus on an up and coming player. This is where the schools can develop dynamic growth in the race quota criteria. Not all schools that compete are of the ‘elite’ level, but they are good at playing sport.
They can offer black students a scholarship or some form of financial support if they meet certain sporting criteria. This may be seen as discrimination, but it’s what the government supports and isn’t meant to be a fair process.
The quota system is not a fair process, so to implement it lower in the ranks is a better solution that forcing a national team to comply.
One thing is for sure, it’s a very bad idea to force a national team to abide by this discriminatory process. This type of philosophy should have died out 20 years ago, but the ignorant and arrogant leaders persist in pushing their agendas under the guise of equality and fairness.
Things can change but there needs to be better educated and better prepared leadership to put the wheels in motion.
Kiteywo
Guest
I think I tend to agree with you(Owen) about the quotas. Case in point for me is the brazillian people. The black people make slightly less or more of the total populace but you never see them in government, education, media and in the private sector. Where are they? Most of them are in jail, not by the choice but the brazillian fascist past. The current government has imposed quotas and reserved opportunities on government jobs and state universities for the black people. Which to me is a good thing because, you can never consigned one group to a ghetto while the other swims in oppulence. The quotas are necessary for averting future catastropheres and anarchy like in south africa. But I also believe the black middle class should be instrumental in holding the government to perfom its roles within the stipulations of law. That is where the electorate is failing the poorer people who are feeling the most pinch but again you can't bite the hand that feeds you.
Superba
Guest
" black kids didn't attend school until recently " . recently ? Do you mean 1994 when the Mandela govt came into power ie 20 years ago . Is that recent ?
Harry Jones
Guest
I dub thee Mr Charrington. Henceforth that is your name.
Owen McCaffrey
Roar Guru
Harry Jones seems you are still confused about racism and positive discrimination. It must be hard to live such an angry life. I feel sorry for you and the rest of the posters who are incorrectly confusing racism for what is really positive discrimination. Also called Affirmative Action. It's in no way racism to give advantages to disadvantaged ethnic groups. You're dreaming. Racism requires at the very least a net negative social impact. Increasing Quotas will have a massive positive impact! Dreaming! Apartheid? That was racism because it had a net negative impact. You need to go back to school and relearn the terms "positive discrimination" and "racism" because you are playing a victim like there is going to actually be any net injury to White people! Hell no, There will ve a massive social and economic benefit to Blacks from more Springboks from Quotas. You are living in a victimhood dreamland!
Harry Jones
Guest
Institutionalised racism always affects far more than 5-7 people. That's why blanket racial quotas are unconstitutional and illegal and nobody except the ANC proposes them. I opposed apartheid as did my family, at considerable cost. If you really want to help township kids play rugby, applications for 2015 are now open and can be submitted at www.rugbyinafrica.org/apply.
Owen McCaffrey
Roar Guru
It is called Affirmative Action not racism. You need to look the term up again. And again and again. Or just stop being angry at the world. Embrace the new reality that is South Africa and accept that you are going to have more Black Springboks and if they don't get there soon through effort then they will be put there through quotas because your government is half suspicious half frustrated with the old boys club running all levels of professional rugby.
Owen McCaffrey
Roar Guru
I'm going to surprise you and agree with all of that. But let me tell you where the real issue lies, and it is why the position taken by so many in this thread is rediculous. The SARU already has a Quota policy and the International community has done nothing. You know why? It's not considered racial discrimination. Head spinning? All forms of affirmative Action can have the charge of 'racial discrimination' levelled against them, but it always comes down to "how injurious is it to the majority of White Americans if 10% of college applications must be minorities?" That argument is often brought up, and some white folks (like yourself think of it as racial discrimination, but as a societal measure, which it is, the positive and negative outcomes are always weighed. I'm sorry, but the negative outcomes to White South Africans to 5-7 less White Springboks on the field would be miniscule to the huge benefits to having 7 or more Black Springboks on the field. That is the calculation the ANC is making. It's not racism and you are putting your mind there so I feel very very sad that you are such an angry person. If that is the way you all feel about your Black brethren then your country truly hasn't progressed at all and you are the cause exactly.
Rainbow Nation
Guest
Lies should not be posted here. Only cricket, rugby and athletics being looked at! #whitekiwiinkoreatalksnonsense
bigbaz
Roar Guru
Looks like you outlasted everyone Owen. A tko?
Harry Jones
Guest
It’s odd you cite the Olympics to support your quota argument. The International Olympic Committee’s Olympic Charter forbids any form of racial discrimination. The Charter’s Fundamental Principles of Olympism specifically provide that “any form of discrimination with regard to a country or a person on grounds of race, religion, politics, gender or otherwise is incompatible with belonging to the Olympic Movement” and “Belonging to the Olympic Movement requires compliance with the Olympic Charter and recognition by the IOC”. South Africa’s membership in the Commonwealth also makes it subject to the rules as provided for in the Constitution of the Commonwealth Games Federation. Here, Article 7 of that Constitution – with regard to discrimination – expressly provides that “for the Commonwealth Games and generally in respect of all activities of the Federation and events under its control, there shall be no discrimination against any country or person on any grounds whatsoever, including race, colour, gender, religion or politics”. The International Cricket Council (ICC – of which South Africa is a member) condemns racism of any form in itsAnti-Racism Policy and section 6 (a) and (b) of that policy state that “the ICC and all of its Members should: (a) Not at any time offend, insult, humiliate, intimidate, threaten, disparage, vilify or unlawfully discriminate between persons based on their race, religion, culture, colour, descent, and/or national or ethnic origin; (b) Adopt appropriate policies that it is clear to all employees, officials, commercial partners and other participants and stakeholders that inappropriate Racist Conduct (including in any public statements) will not be tolerated by the ICC or by the Member”; The International Rugby Board (IRB) prohibits discrimination of any kind in the game through By-Law 3(f) that expressly lists one of the functions of the IRB to be the prevention of discrimination of any kind against a country, private person or groups of people on account of their ethnic origin, gender, language, politics, religion or any other reason. Imposing racial quotas in South African football would also not be reconcilable with Article 3 of FIFA’s Statutes (in which the international football regulatory body subscribes to non-racism): “Discrimination of any kind against a Country, private person or group of people on account of race, skin colour, ethnic, national or social origin, gender, language, religion, political opinion or any other opinion, wealth, birth or any other status, sexual orientation or any other reason is strictly prohibited and punishable by suspension or expulsion”. Quotas are also at odds with South Africa’s Constitution and the core values of equality, human rights and non-racialism it embodies. Section 9(4) of the Constitution also prohibits unfair discrimination on grounds of inter alia race and ethnic origin. Any move to implement racial quotas would contravene the Employment Equity Act 55 of 1998. The Act authorises numerical targets, but specifically prohibits quotas. Players and other athletes usually have contracts with unions or companies and are as a result undoubtedly employees and this makes the Employment Equity Act applicable to them. Also, there is simply no basis to prove that a race-based quota system will contribute to the development of new players. On the contrary, it could only serve to disadvantage talented sport stars all over South Africa, regardless of their race. Sport (and specifically professional sport) must be accessible to all South Africans, but this needs to be done through development and not quotas. A blanket racial quota in all or the most popular South African sports negates differing cultural tastes and interests of many South Africans when it comes to their participation in different sports disciplines. Perhaps that was “logical” enough for you.
Harry Jones
Guest
It's odd you cite the Olympics to support your plan to discriminate against white, Coloured, Indian, and Asian South African athletes in favour of black South African athletes, regardless of individual merit. The International Olympic Committee's Olympic Charter forbids any form of racial discrimination. The Charter's Fundamental Principles of Olympism specifically provide that "any form of discrimination with regard to a country or a person on grounds of race, religion, politics, gender or otherwise is incompatible with belonging to the Olympic Movement" and "Belonging to the Olympic Movement requires compliance with the Olympic Charter and recognition by the IOC"; South Africa's membership in the Commonwealth also makes it subject to the rules as provided for in the Constitution of the Commonwealth Games Federation. Here, Article 7 of that Constitution - with regard to discrimination - expressly provides that "for the Commonwealth Games and generally in respect of all activities of the Federation and events under its control, there shall be no discrimination against any country or person on any grounds whatsoever, including race, colour, gender, religion or politics". The International Cricket Council (ICC - of which South Africa is a member) condemns racism of any form in itsAnti-Racism Policy and section 6 (a) and (b) of that policy state that "the ICC and all of its Members should: (a) Not at any time offend, insult, humiliate, intimidate, threaten, disparage, vilify or unlawfully discriminate between persons based on their race, religion, culture, colour, descent, and/or national or ethnic origin; (b) Adopt appropriate policies that it is clear to all employees, officials, commercial partners and other participants and stakeholders that inappropriate Racist Conduct (including in any public statements) will not be tolerated by the ICC or by the Member"; The International Rugby Board (IRB) prohibits discrimination of any kind in the game through By-Law 3(f) that expressly lists one of the functions of the IRB to be the prevention of discrimination of any kind against a country, private person or groups of people on account of their ethnic origin, gender, language, politics, religion or any other reason. Imposing racial quotas in South African football would also not be reconcilable with Article 3 of FIFA's Statutes (in which the international football regulatory body subscribes to non-racism): "Discrimination of any kind against a Country, private person or group of people on account of race, skin colour, ethnic, national or social origin, gender, language, religion, political opinion or any other opinion, wealth, birth or any other status, sexual orientation or any other reason is strictly prohibited and punishable by suspension or expulsion". Quotas are also at odds with South Africa's Constitution and the core values of equality, human rights and non-racialism it embodies. Section 9(4) of the Constitution also prohibits unfair discrimination on grounds of inter alia race and ethnic origin. Any move to implement racial quotas would contravene the Employment Equity Act 55 of 1998. The Act authorises numerical targets, but specifically prohibits quotas. Players and other athletes usually have contracts with unions or companies and are as a result undoubtedly employees and this makes the Employment Equity Act applicable to them. Also, there is simply no basis to prove that a race-based quota system will contribute to the development of new players. On the contrary, it could only serve to disadvantage talented sport stars all over South Africa, regardless of their race. Sport (and specifically professional sport) must be accessible to all South Africans, but this needs to be done through development and not quotas. A blanket racial quota in all or the most popular South African sports negates differing cultural tastes and interests of many South Africans when it comes to their participation in different sports disciplines. Perhaps that was "logical" enough for you.
Owen McCaffrey
Roar Guru
Vic still hasn't come up with any logical arguments against a quota that haven't been shot down rather quicklyvin the light of day. Like I said. Your irrational arguments may sound great in those dark All South African hate blogs. But in an open debate with people from other countries your ideas lack credibility and sound ludicrous. Put up a sound argument and let it be judged. Of course I and others would love to hear it. You are not interested. You are only interested in keeping the social status quo. Or prove otherwise? Quotas go hand in hand with grassroots support in all kinds of industries all over the globe. Financial Investment is yet anothet I need to give you the economics 101 on as if you have never been to school. Government regulated pensions are usually directed to put certain percentages into certain "socially desirable" fields. This is true from China to USA, from France to Australia. At the same time the government gives GRASSROOTS support to those industries. What that ANC is aiming to do is not unusual or strange. Rugby is big business in your country. Getting Black people involved is good for social unity AND good for them economically. But you have precisely ZERO perspective on how backward your thinking is and that virtually all of the international community will support Oscar if he made the case it was in South Africa's best interest. You have the World's highest inequality 20 years after Apartheid ended meaning legal apartheid was merely continued in a form of social and economic apartheid. If you are looking for someone to feel sorry for the rich which rugby players from the best schools...there will be no international support coming. Everyone is waiting for South Africa to integrate and it's to slow. YES target grassroots development for Black communities. COMBINED with higher quotas to put more Black players in pro teams and start to filter the $ millions of Supersport dollars out to their families and communities. More Black players in the Springboks will give more hope to Black people in the ghettos after 100 years of being beaten down.
Vic
Guest
It's called cognitive dissonance Harry. Some people can't handle the mental stress created when they are confronted with information or ideas which conflict with their own beliefs or what they want to believe about themselves. They then choose to ignore the information which cause them to experience stress, and will use confirmation bias to only accept information which confirm their beliefs and which reduce their inner mental stress. Generally not adaptable to huge changes in the internal or external environment, such as we've experienced in South Africa. Here I also suspect other, more superficial motives. Not worth trying to have an argument with, I would suspect, as there's obviously no intention to take on board different views.
Owen McCaffrey
Roar Guru
You do realize don't you that the ANC have proposed quotas for the South African Soccer team Bafana Bafana too. There is a problem in both teams rugby, soccer and ...I haven't looked at cricket lately. Ntini was the only colored guy I ever saw in that team. They might put quotas there too...
Owen McCaffrey
Roar Guru
Rainbow Nation you maybe don't know the difference between a popular sport and a national sport. You should look that up. While soccer is the most popular sport by participation in NZ and the USA nobody would call this the national sport. Rugby is the National Sport of NZ and SA. National sports include the political influence, money earned by the sport, profile of the sport, Ability of the National Team... So you can see you are wrong again.
Owen McCaffrey
Roar Guru
The Olympics is the biggest sporting event there is. Quotas mean that some competitors are hardly competitive. There have been many cases of large losing margins in events. That's because the Olympics has a social and community goal of inclusiveness. Nations coming together. You are trying to cherry pick examples. Olympics refutes your argument quite nicely. Keep trying...
Rainbow Nation
Guest
Lol Owen thinks rugby is the national sport in south africa...obviously never been here
Harry Jones
Guest
The question was whether any NATION STATE, in picking it's best team, disqualifies anyone because of race.
Owen McCaffrey
Roar Guru
The Olympics has a quota system. Only a limited number of athletes from a certain country are eligible to enter a certain event. If the intent were to simply invite the best in any event, some events would be dominated by one country who could send the top 6 athletes in the world. But that's not the olympic spirit.
Harry Jones
Guest
Does any nation have sports quotas other than SA? I'm actually asking the ROAR universe.