Blues suffer record loss against Hawks

Col, Essendon won't want to be trading Carlisle. If he leaves it will be his decision and Essendon would want more than most clubs would be prepared to pay. I hope he stays but he will need to be careful if he decides to leave as he might finish up in the draft. I do believe there is plenty of talent among unlisted 21y.o. players in the VFL and other competitions but you need very good people to pick out the gems and you will have to turn over a few as well.

Aransan when it comes down to trade bait you have to look at players that other clubs want and who you are willing to give up and for me it still comes down to the two I have mentioned. I think Essendon are in a similar situation in that there may be only a couple of players you might consider trading that will attract a good pick - Carlisle comes to mind. I am sure Essendon are not going to shop players like Hurley, Daniher, Heppell and Hooker around but after that who on your list is going to attract a first round pick and by saying that I am not trying to be demeaning of your club but I believe that Carlton and Essendon aren't going to taste success for a few years. Having said that I think Essendon have a better spine than Carlton and probably their list is in better shape.

I agree with you Macca what if Hawthorn were without most of their good players they wouldn't be at their best either the same with any club and further more every team responds better with encouragement not lecturing it can take its toll on a team if they were being lectured like Mick Malthouse did but under Brett Ratten they did better because you could see how encouraging he was and that's probably why Carlton had a couple of wins in a row under John Barker because he didn't rant and rave like Malthouse.

Col, I think the world has passed the Warnocks by. Athletic ruckman like Kreuzer, Goldstein at about 200cm are the way to go, I couldn't believe it when Malthouse selected two dinosaurs in Warnock (206cm) and Wood (204cm) in the same side. Perhaps they have a place in the VFL as backup in case your mobile ruckman is unavailable. I hoped that you would have more trade bait available. The Carlton talent scouts should be looking carefully at the VFL, teams were forced to do this when Gold Coast and GWS were compromising the draft and some good players were picked up. I suspect the focus has moved away from the VFL and there will be some talent there. Not everyone is ready for the draft at 18. Give such players a year to show themselves and be prepared to move them on but there is talent in the VFL. Patrick Smith in The Australian today had something to say about your current board, it is well worth reading even if you disagree with it.

Aransan I believe that it really only comes down to Henderson and Yarran. We need to retain Murphy, Gibbs and Kreuzer as we will need their leadership for the next 3 - 4 years. Younger players off limits should be Cripps, Graham, Buckley, Menzel and Casboult. I doubt whether there is much left to attract good draft picks from other clubs. There are a number of inexperienced players with less than 10 games that we need to persevere with. Perhaps your team might do us a favour and give us something for Warnock. As far as the Board is concerned I don't know too much about them. I know the President and CEO are in their first year so that's a change and they have brought back SoS to oversee the recruiting which is an area that we haven't been great at.

Col, I am an Essendon supporter but I have strong family ties to Carlton. My concern about Carlton is that they are being unrealistic about the state of their list. I agree with you that it will take a minimum of 3-4 years to be competitive again and hard decisions have to be made. Yarran is obviously a great talent but I believe he will always be an under-performer at Carlton but would be invaluable as a trade. Carlton need to look carefully at players who won't be near their peak in 4 years time and some good trading opportunities can come from within this group. There may be some other players who you would be reluctant to lose but they should be checked to see whether they are prepared to work through the rebuild. Do Carlton need a complete shake up of their board? Perhaps the changes necessary will require this. Carlton have done the right thing in going outside their club in order to choose the next coach. Perhaps it would also help if they got outside input in what needs to be done to turn the club around -- I am sure the AFL would be happy to contribute to this, it is not good for the competition for a club like Carlton to stagnate for an extended period of time.

I undestand what you're saying but we still need the experience of these 2 players although we don't know what Henderson is going to do yet he was waiting to see who the next coach is going to be to decide whether he wants to stay and I feel Yarran may not be happy and that's probably why his form is off and on but he has good speed and good skill. So if there is any other players we could part with but not those two. Henderson if he decides not to stay well then maybe we get another experienced player from another club that can give us what we need but I like Yarran and I would not like them to part with him we still need him. If you get too many young players you've really got to wait till they've matured skill wise even though we have got some really good young talented players like Menzel and Cripps. They have proven themselves really I've been really impressed with them. We need to look at who hasn't been consistent over a long period of time and look at replacing them but not Yarran I like his speed.

Jean I understand you not wanting to trade players but unfortunately in the modern game you have to give up something to get something. We need to be looking a few years ahead not just year by year. With the list we have at the moment a top up of one good player is not going to achieve anything. Our future is in the hands of the Cripps, Graham, Menzel, Buckley era and not in the Henderson and Yarran era. We need to be injecting 2 - 3 quality young players over the next 3 - 4 years to build a list that can compete at a high level for a number of years - just as the top sides have done. I have been a Carlton supporter for nearly 60 years and in that time I have seen them win 8 premierships. Unless they rebuild for the future I fear that I might not see another one.

Don't even think about it the thought of trading Henderson and Yarran I don't think GWS would let Patton go any way.

I agree he should not be traded but at least maybe they should give him the option as to what position he wants to play as to where he feels comfortable. Then maybe that might bring the best out in him again.But he is too valuable to lose.

Don't think I would take a chance on Patton with 2 ACL injuries. Don't give up on the Brisbane offer. They have a good midfield and young forwards with potential. They have been hit hard by injury. Their backline is their problem and Henderson and Yarran might be just what they need.

For a first and third round deal for both in this draft I would say no as the third round pick this year doesn't look to be worth much, I might be tempted at 1st and a swap of second round picks. I think it will be a moot point anyway as I can't see Brisbane giving up pick 1. How about Henderson, Yarran and pick 2 for Patton and GWS pick 1?

What would you say if Brisbane offered up it's first round pick and maybe a third round for Henderson and Yarran. That would give us first and third pick as it stands. We could possibly pick up Schache and Weitering. You could build a good side around those two with Cripps, Graham, Menzel etc.

Col - I agree with you to an extent but I just don't see it justifying getting rid of him for a draft pick - especially in what appears to be a shallow draft. I think he needs to kick more goals but he does play fairly high as a half forward and Darcy Moore wasn't playing against the Hawks. To me if the blues could use Henderson, Everitt and Menzel as high half forwards and then look at Casboult and Foster or Schache or who ever deeper it looks OK - however if you take Henderson out of that equation it looks ordinary.

But no goals Macca and he has only kicked 16 goals this season. Young Darcy Moore had 4 marks,9 kicks and kicked 5 goals. It is no good Henderson getting those stats and not kicking goals. Don't get me wrong I think he is a good player and he doesn't get the delivery that other forwards do but if he is getting that many kicks and marks as a CHF he should be kicking a lot more goals. I would say that 75% of his stats on Friday night was when he drifted down back.

Col - I agree on Henderson but if we keep him and play him forward next year with say Casboult and Patton (Yarran and our second pick to GWS for Patton?) or Foster or Schache and then move him back when we can we are better off than getting rid of him next year and having no one up forward. Also he did manage 14 possessions and 8 marks on Friday night - that isn't terrible in a side that was beaten by 23 goals.

Macca, I just don't think Henderson is the forward that is going to take us up the ladder. He gets beat too easily in body contests and seems to only run in straight lines. I think he would be a great CHB and if Carlton were to say that they are going to play him purely as a CHB then I agree, keep him. I don't think Geelong are chasing him as a forward. We just have to hope that in the next couple of drafts we can pick up a good young forward - I think there are a couple that might be top 5 in this years draft. Hopefully young Foster might be ready next year and young Silvagni (if they take him) could be something in a few years. Our development as a team needs to be done with the aim to be like a Hawthorn. It may take 4 or 5 years to achieve this buti they need to get rid of the previous attitude of just trying to plug holes.

Conchie I agree that Yarran would be better at Hawthorn but you could say that about most players. As a senior player he should be giving 100% every game regardless of the situation. Surely if another side is looking at him as a potential draft they wouldn't be liking his current attitude. I am sure Alastair Clarkson wouldn't be wanting a player who only gives his all when he feels like it.

@Col, Yarran in the right team would be an out and out champion, he obviously needs a strong culture around him, he would be as good as Hill in a Hawthorn ( run and carry) , probably better actually, his attitude is a direct result of what is happening and has happened at Carlton recently. Trading him would be a mistake, but perhaps ATM must happen.

Col - Yes there were unforced errors and skill errors but that is to be expected with young players. On Buckley I thought he was pretty good overall but just let himself down with a couple of errors but that is the beauty of playing these young kids they get to learn. I have been saying for a while we should trade Yarran and I agree his demeanour was terrible on Friday but Henderson must stay - there is no point us getting a KPP in this years draft if we lose Henderson. He is still relatively young and he can go back if we find another forward but at this point we need to get a quality forward to take Jones' spot and I like playing 3 talls so Henderson would be needed plus Casboult. As for damaging the confidence I agree it is possible but I think we will rebound over the coming weeks - especially as we get the likes of graham back in.