It was a good time catching up with the guys and girls behind The Roar last week in Sydney, and chewing the fat with a few old faces alongside new colleagues.
One of them was Tim Prentice, who I’d not met before. In a chat on numerous topics the conversation got around to columns we’d written that we were really happy about, or that were among our favourites.
Tim told me about his grand final week ‘interview’ with Johnathan Thurston’s headgear – which he wrote instead of every other NRL grand final preview for the week – and I mentioned my pre-2013-2014 Ashes column wondering what we might do if Mitchell Johnson actually bowled well.
Of course, it’s now history that both pieces proved to be rather prescient. Johnson did indeed bowl rather well in that series two seasons back, and Thurston’s headgear did indeed stay on his head. In fact, it soaked up blood from an at-the-time mysterious post-match celebratory head gash.
Over the weekend, the motivation behind my Johnson pondering at the time remained with me, a reminder that perhaps it’s time to ask the question again of another much-maligned player.
Like Johnson this time two summers ago, the expectations around Shaun Marsh’s ability to produce consistent Test-quality innings aren’t high.
His farcical first innings run out in Adelaide, for just two, only seemed to reinforce the popular perception, while his second innings 49 is an interesting one to judge. For every opinion willing to class it as a match-winning knock crucial in Australia’s chase to win the pink ball Test, there is another one only too happy to highlight a continued inability to go on with starts.
Aesthetically, there can be no doubt that Marsh during his second dig had heeded the lessons from the first three innings of the Adelaide Test. His hands were soft, his leaving was very good, and he looked to be deliberately trying to play each delivery as late as possible. Given his past propensity to nick off to the slip cordon pushing forward with hard hands, this was a welcome technical adjustment.
All the while, the man who Marsh replaced was beavering away in the background to ensure he’ll be right for a return on Boxing Day.
Usman Khawaja was first spotted back in training during the Adelaide Test, has been back in the nets for a fortnight apparently, and told News Limited this week that he felt like he was on track to be fit for Melbourne.
That in itself will be interesting, though, because the Big Bash League will be Khawaja’s only avenue of return. Not that that worries him, though, making the very valid point that, “It’s not so much the lower intensity stuff that’s going to get a hammy, it’s the higher intensity stuff – so actually pushing it in the BBL will probably be a bit harder in some respects.
“It’s a bit more of a test than it would be coming back in the four-day game in some respects.”
Khawaja’s Sydney Thunder team plays the opening game of the BBL – a Sydney derby with the Sixers – on Thursday, December 17, and then plays the Melbourne Stars at the MCG on Sunday, December 20, and you would think a Boxing Day Test squad would probably be named after that match. And if Khawaja’s already going to be in Melbourne…
But what if Marsh does well in Hobart? And what would even be the pass mark for him?
Coming off that second innings 49 in Adelaide, I would imagine Marsh would need to better that in Hobart at least once, and might even need to top a hundred runs for the Test in total. And there could be a challenge in that; on current evidence, you wouldn’t expect Australia to need a very large second innings score against this West Indies side.
So if Australia only bat once and Marsh makes a solid, fluent 75, he’ll do his case no harm at all. If Australia bat just once and he doesn’t break 50, he could just as easily be in trouble.
But it goes beyond that. If Australia did have to bat twice and Marsh made a pair of 30s, then we’ll have the ‘he can’t go on from a start’ discussion. If he makes a solid 75 and then backs it up with a low score, it’ll be ‘he still can’t score consistently’. Two single-figure scores will make the selectors’ job very easy indeed, and at 32, that could well close the book on SE Marsh, Test player.
In some respects, a couple of scores either side of 50, and with the second one unbeaten in a comfortable Australian win, could make things very interesting for Melbourne. I mean, think about that; if Marsh followed his 49 in Adelaide with 55 and 45* in a Hobart win, then the only way Marsh could really be dropped is if he’s still the lowest scoring Australian batsman for the Test. And he’d be pretty hard done by!
So I ask it again, what happens if Shaun Marsh does well in Hobart? And more importantly, are we prepared to put aside preconceptions and judgements and accept that he could indeed do well?
Just as I wrote of Johnson back in late 2013, the same applies to Marsh now. His stats are there for all to see, but only paint the picture of past performance; they’re not an ironclad crystal ball into the future.
And just of the Johnson possibility two summers ago, Marsh is just as likely to bat well in Hobart as he is to bat as poorly as many expect.
But how many of us are ready, or willing, for Marsh to hold his spot going forward?
Bearfax
Guest
Err that's ICE CAPS. Damned keyboard
Bearfax
Guest
Don you seriously need to see an optometrist. You presently would see hot spots in nice caps.
Don Freo
Guest
My goodness! Bancroft is nothing like Silk. Bancroft is batting well.
Bearfax
Guest
Oh Don how often do I have to explain this to you. This is about the players who perform consistently best overall in first class cricket being afforded the right to be picked as test batsmen. If you like I'll call Shaun, Bert. Burt is a fine pitch hitter, and ideal for the limited over game. I've always commended him in that respect. He's got a great eye. But he doesnt have the toughness to be a top test cricketer despite loads of talent. Warner and Smith are tough. Voges is tough. You can see how they approach the job, very professionally and with a mind set from the beginning that says these guys are winners. Their averages testify to that. Khawaja doesnt quite have that mind set yet but you can sense its growing. Burns I'm not sure but he's very young and years of development. But their averages when viewed in respect of their ages says they are quality consistent longer form batsmen. Players like Bert, Klinger, Ferguson , have the talent but they dont have the mind set that ensures that they wont just score big but they will consistently score. That's what Bert and Klinger in particular dont do. When they have their eye in they are world beaters, but they play far too many loose shots in the early stages of an innings and that's why they get out cheaply so often. Its not an emotional response about Burt, its a judgement based on performance. He just doesnt have it, despite these occasional brilliant performances he shows now and then. Bancroft, as I pointed out to you earlier was destined to falter, just like Silk. You do remember me saying that when you were glorifying him. Its not because I've got precognition. Its because it follows the same pattern you see time and again with young batsmen. It happens to almost all of them. But he has years ahead of him and though he is struggling at the moment he has an average almost the equal of Burt and Klinger. For a 23 year old to have such a fine average, he has something special and being an opener, his average even looks better. Personally in longer form games I think he is already the equal of Klinger and only a shade behind Burt,. In a few years he will leave both batsmen in his wake if he continues to develop as he has been.
Don Freo
Guest
You keep saying you are not anti-Shaun Marsh but your constant comments indicate otherwise. It is strange that you say Bancroft is "one of my favourites". Others advocate him. I think he is a fantastic fieldsman but as a batsman he is just beginning to back himself with strokeplay. Others push for him. Shaun Marsh is way better and still has a 20 to 40 test career ahead of him. WA's 3 best batsmen are Marsh, Voges and Whiteman.
Bearfax
Guest
Hey I'm not against Shaun Marsh. I'm against the selectors for choosing him when they had the opportunity of blooding one of the young guns against what they knew would be a tame West Indian attack. What better time. Just plain dumb in my mind. But hey Marsh performed admirably and yes he still had to score the runs and he did. Congrats to him. My issue as I expected before this match, was that now that he has scored big he will probably get another 'life' of four or five tests, and will again perform as he has been performing for the past five years. I'm actually surprised Don because Marsh is actually blocking another of your favourites, who I think has potential, in Bancroft, from getting a game. Say good bye to that opportunity for another year because if Burns fails, Shaun Marsh will join Warner opening. Is that fair?
Don Freo
Guest
Nathan Lyon is one of our most consistent performers. How would SOK get a game? Not following much cricket, Damo?
Don Freo
Guest
Hobart not hosting a test for 3 years has certainly had an impact...How???
Don Freo
Guest
And delivered on those expectations. Others didn't. He steadied the ship after 3 quick wickets. But Bear, if you have it in for him...there's not any kind of performance that will turn around a prejudice.
Bearfax
Guest
His performance was expected against 'gimme' bowlers.
Don Freo
Guest
And bowls poorly.
Don Freo
Guest
Another cackling hyena. Just remember that when you speak of prejudice and WA bias, it is usually about your own speculations with me not a party to the conversation at all. You are making these comments, not me.
Don Freo
Guest
I'll let Shaun do the talking for me. What he did against India years ago is unlikely to affect his batting today.
josh
Roar Rookie
if Shaun Marsh succeeds than he can have nice stat in his last test, like Jason Gillespie.
Peter Mc
Guest
The only number they have in mind is Geoff Marshes phone number - 'Should we give him another go Marshy??. That would be nice just for old times sake! he replies. In quite a dangerous period where the sons of former players are known to the selectors. The continual failures of Sean Marsh leading to his continual selection is dodgy and for some reason is allowed to continue. Having said that get Lehman's son in, he is going to be quite a fine cricketer - needs to sort out the facial hair situation though before we let him loose on prime time TV.
Bearfax
Guest
I like it.
Tom from Perth
Roar Rookie
NCN didn't make the XI. Pattinson is playing.
Tim Prentice
Expert
I think you could use some headgear Brett. Know just where you can get it ..... Cheers, Tim.
Bearfax
Guest
Being selective like that Luke always leaves you open. Every player has good and bad times, good and bat wickets, luck and no luck. That is just the nature o the game. Easy to point out about Khawaja's two centuries 'on flat tracks'. But surprisingly no comment about the wickets he played on earlier in his test career, when few Australian batsman made a mark. In his first test Australia's highest scorer scored 53. In the second 95 was top score followed by 44. In his third test he was left not out. His fourth test the highest score was 88 and he scored 65. In his fifth test one batsman scored a century and next highest was 38. In the sixth test highest scorer was 123 but next highest was 36. He top scored in his 7th test. Australia batted on a series of mine fields during Khawaja's early tests. He also played no more than three tests in a row. But we wont mention that will we.
Red Kev
Roar Guru
With respect if you take out Shaun Marsh's two test centuries he averages 23. Marsh needs to do more at first class level to even justify his selection in the test side, let alone cement his spot in it.