Ground-Dog Day, just another Dessie smokescreen

I think in both then and now a big part of the mistake the Dogs made was moving on a veteran player who should've been kept (Price then, Pritchard now) which took some much needed maturity out of the side.

Hasler just hasn't figured out that the Dogs Lemon has been squeezed dry.... As a dead Man walkin...its only a matter of time until the Executioner comes knocking on his door Such is the fate of most NRL coaches...think of Toovey,Sheens,Cleary,Henry,Cartwright,Griffen,Taylor,Smith,Beale'McFadden,Stone,Potter,Furner,Stuart,Anderson, etc etc etc

You're right. Dogs in mid 2000s is a good example. Good team originally with great spirit but it grew into a sense of entitlement and a toxic culture. Dogs had a major clearing of the decks and really struggled for a couple of years in 07 and 08 including a wooden spoon. The Bulldogs have regularly moved players on but maintained the culture. If you think of those great teams of the 80s a lot finished their careers elsewhere.

You are ignoring all the times coaches like Hasler have been greatly rewarded for sticking by players who the critics have endlessly bagged. Hasler was bagged endlessly for sticking by players like Jason King and even Steve Matai early on. Barrett has been bagged endlessly also for sticking by Api K in particular as well as Curtis Sironen and others. Some players have very ordinary patches of form and based on history it is not always the best option to drop them. To me it often seems that a coaches loyalty to a below average player performance wise is rewarded greatly at times. Just presenting the other side of the equation. Manly has suffered a couple of terrible losses this year but Barrett has dropped hardly anyone from memory , probably because he figured the best players were already in the team and by sticking by them he has helped the confidence of some players who are trying to establish or revive a career. The Dogs are a different equation and maybe a shakeup is needed . Frawley at half for the dogs looked like the saviour for a while but now it just looks like another false hope. Where do the dogs go from here? As I said at the time Hasler needed to depart the scene because they are just slowly spiraling down and I think a new coach is essential . Ironically the loyalty shown to Hasler might pay off but I reckon it won't

The comments are over the top, the way you all are talking you would think des has a list better then any other team. The list Des inherited and the list he recruited is middle of the road and on any given Sunday is capable of winning like most other teams. The team reached two GFs under Des and is likely to miss the finals this year for the first time. Many teams would love this record but as usual the media only focus on the most negative parts of life and blow everything out of proportion. Missing the finals one year is acceptable in a comp with salary cap restrictions but two years could be a stretch Des.

The ethos comes from playing groups adding to it each generation I think, Manly for me has always been obvious, there style, Dogs no different with there ethos, while it looks like it's affecting the dogs with Des, the player turn around at manly during Barrett coming in may have helped the Eagles.

I talk a good game...my dogs a scoundrel

completely agree. Thoroughly enjoyed the Dogs game against Penrith, especially with the cameras panning onto the coaches box and the look on Des' face.

The future of the team is all with Des at the moment...if he doesn't turn this team around in 12 months from now he will be gone or close to it. As I see it he is the one picking the new players and letting others go so he will be totally accountable if it doesn't bring success. On the other hand if the Dogs make the grand final (and even win it) next year I am sure all will be forgiven......

Nev Nev - I think you're on to something. One of the things I've always respected about Manly is that like the Dogs they've maintained and protected their culture over an extended period of time with it being handed down from generation to generation. I don't think it's a coincidence that these two clubs have been up there with the two most consistently successful clubs in terms of semi final appearances, grand finals and premierships for the past 40-50 years. I'm not sure how things are going at Manly under Baz in that regard but I have concerns about the Dogs direction. Someone like Pay or Dymock would be ideal to come in post Hasler.

Jason, I remember seeing a piece you wrote around the time Trent Barrett took over at Manly that touched on the great record of success, including premierships, during years the coach had actually played for the club - think Des, Bozo, Biscuits, Ron Willey. Do you think the same might be true for the Dogs? Guys like Steve Folkes or Chris Anderson who bled berry might have been better equipped, or perhaps more credible than Des when it comes to days when standing in a huddle behind the posts waiting to kick the steeden off again and fading away to embarrassing defeat becomes a habit, rather than gritting teeth and pushing on through pain to compete for the full 80. I suppose the legion of frustrated Dogs fans, and perhaps Dean Pay or Jim Dymock, now have to wait a few more years to find out....

Yes . Don't think the coach appreciated when a fan brought up about Lichaa and Ennis comments re shackles . His response to a question on Klemmer playing at lock rather than front row was quite bizzaare too. Expect more short drop outs. Tolman and Castle where all class at the forum, but Dib and Hasler didn't exactly do themselves any favours .

I don't think it's over complicating the message. The Dogs game plan is simple to the point of being painful. Of course I'm on the outside looking in but I think it's s confusing message rather than a complicated one. I also think there's s lack of accountability within the squad. Poor performances are tolerated again and again. Lee and Holland are the only blokes in recent memory who have been held accountable. Young blokes basically have to wait until someone keels over to get a shot in the side. That means there's no genuine competition for spots. Clubs thrive on that competitive tension. How good is Elliott going? How long did he have to wait behind Eastwood? Serving an apprenticeship is one thing. Getting stuck behind deadwood is another. The Dogs have some talented forwards in the lower grades. Giving some of these guys a crack every now and then will keep players on their toes. The older I get the more I believe a lack of accountability is at the core of standards slipping. Whether it's at work, in the family, a footy team, training a dog, whatever.