The AFL has had a presence in the northern states for decades, but it takes detailed analysis to see the relative success of these clubs.
There’s an absolutely huge disparity in actual members and crowd averages between the two states which of course is directly influenced by form or lack thereof.
The Suns have a better home crowd average than GWS, although GWS is hamstrung a bit by Manuka and its capacity.
If we look below the AFL level we find that at grassroots level in 2017 across the Sydney basin there were 84 senior men’s and women’s teams in Sydney, 39 around Newcastle and 19 around Wollongong for a total of 142 senior teams.
If we look at SE Queensland in 2017 it is quite similar. There are 146 senior teams playing from Tweed Heads through to the Sunshine Coast that is also probably a similar geographic spread to the Sydney basin.
Working on a football to population basis. per capita SE Queensland would seem to be a fair way ahead and if we look at the state of senior community football in 2012 there were 92 senior teams in SE Queensland.
Even without the Brisbane Lions being perennial finalists like the Swans and although the GC Suns have given a boost to football on the GC – which was always traditionally strong – it seems SE Queensland football has grown independently of the Brisbane Lions’ success or lack thereof.
This sort of contradicts an argument by some who claim that lack of Swans success would see the crumbling of grass roots football below it.
What has really boomed in SE Queensland is women’s football. In 2011 there were only six senior women’s teams, four under 18s teams and six under 15s teams, in 2017 there were 28 senior women’s teams, 18 under 17s, 22 under 15s, 31 under 13s and 20 under 11s. They are specific girls teams, although it would be fair to say many under 11s would probably play with the boys at that age, so under 11s may be not fully representative.
Eight more clubs have been allocated women’s licences for 2018 according to an AFL Queensland article. Queensland – after Victoria – is probably the second strongest state for women’s football, a great achievement.
At a junior level both areas have similar type numbers, Brisbane have around 8,000 juniors, Gold Coast claimed 2,950 this year, Sydney juniors claimed over 10,000 across its two zones (GWS and Swans) a couple of years ago, although these numbers are generally without Auskick club numbers – yes that word Auskick! – which are usually around 40 per cent of any clubs base.
Sunshine Coast as well as Newcastle, Illawarra and the Central Coast all have varying numbers through their junior associations, with Newcastle and the Sunshine Coast having good growth over recent years.
I suspect that a top four spot for either the Suns or Lions will see a grass roots interest spike in SE Queensland as it has in the last couple of years in Sydney because of GWS and the Swans. A decade ago SE Queensland was quite comfortably ahead of the Sydney area, but now particularly at junior level Sydney seem to be moving ahead.
Combined Swans and GWS membership – 79,832*
Combined Brisbane and GC membership – 33,027*
*Figures at sixth September 2017
Combined home crowd average Swans and GWS – 23,297 (no finals included)
Swans – 33,398, GWS – 13,196
Combined home average crowd Brisbane and GC – 15,059
Brisbane – 16,455, GC – 13,663
Aligee
Guest
Callan Park in Lilyfield which is basically Leichardt. It was the area the Sydney junior AFL club asked for initially, they never asked for Birchgrove Oval at any stage.
Manfred
Guest
The herald told lies about the Birchgrove Oval affair and that reporter has now left - good riddance - where do Leichardt play??
Manfred
Guest
Yes funny how rarely clubs under 20 NRL players end up playing at their club as adults. And the under 20 players come from all over the place so much so that Sydney City origin had to fudge the residency for the City Country game.
Manfred
Guest
Most of the pacific islanders in the RL grew up In Aus - RU is the big game in the islands and they tend to play in NZ or Europe.
Manfred
Guest
As if on cue republican with his anti GWS but push for Canberra/Tassie team - you are so dull
Manfred
Guest
Not so super is a RL tragic that played too long b4 the concussion rules were bought in
c
Guest
Sir Frank P. 'Lowy', AC
Aligee
Guest
Leichhardt Cygnets are the aftermath of the Birchgrove Oval affair, i am not even going to attempt to post anything about it, it is so messy, but at least AF now has a designated ground in that part of Sydney which was sadly lacking, there is a very real fight for grounds in Sydney. I also believe that East Sydney bulldogs have been turning away players in the last couple of years. https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/sport/afl/afl-has-grounds-for-concern-in-sydney-20170906-gycax1.html
Antony Pincombe
Roar Rookie
Yes and the Balmain Dockers, Drumoyne Power, Leichhardt Cygnets, East Sydney Bulldogs, Glebe Greyhounds, Moroubra Saints, Moore Park Tigers, Concord Giants and the ones you have mentioned Newtown Swans and Western Suburbs Magpies. these clubs all provide mixed boys/girls comps up until youth level and then the sexes split. There are six girls divisions in the Sydney Harbour zone.
Cat
Roar Guru
The best clearance player in the league is an 'outside receiver'? Some people ...
Antony Pincombe
Roar Rookie
Yes like Jesaulenko
Antony Pincombe
Roar Rookie
The suns drafted dreadfully and the Gary Ablett move was stupid. He has always been a receiver and still is. They keep saying is he or Franklin the best player in the AFL. I wish they'd get over it. I have always thought Ablett wasn't even fit to do up franklin's bootstraps. The suns needed a Marquee player who would give them a profile but all they got was the bible basher. God never lifted any footy team's profile except Cats. What Suns should have done was draft well instead of building a team around an outside receiver.
Antony Pincombe
Roar Rookie
I don't believe soccer will be as successful as people seem to think even though most of the immigrants are from Soccer background. Most our immigrants originally came from Soccer background, that is Great Britain, Italy, Greece etc. Either that or they came from RL or RU background, New Zealand or the Islands. Yet none of those sports have overtaken AFL. In fact while grassroots Soccer is suffering under the prop up the A League policy AFL suffers no such thing. The A League attracts an average of 14,000 people per game. The junior footy subsidise the A League clubs through junior player payments. Parents are getting a bit sick of paying thousands every year and getting nothing for it. Not only that if a player reaches 14 yo and the coaches don't think they have the chance to make the A League or similar they are basically not given game time. In soccer only the so called potential star players get any time put into them. They stop developing players well before their bodies stop developing. In AFL we don't do that. A gangly awkward kid could end up developing into a star ruckman or key forward when they start developing a body. The switching of codes or sports at about 13 or 14 away from soccer is quite large. In fact AFL has benefited greatly from this policy of trashing players who soccer Coaches think have no talent and are not coordinated enough for the game at 13/14. So has basketball recently. Add to that the infighting and corruption that pervades Australian Soccer and Soccer worldwide and Australian people are getting a little suspicious of the sport. The recent fight between Lowey and the clubs is not helping. The sub standard football in the A League is not helping either as most clubs are too broke to be able to attract the real marque players. So they get Has Beens. The wanderers are broke and if something doesn't happen soon they will be foreclosed upon. Several other clubs are in a similar state. The television deal doesn't help the clubs and it is bad because nobody watches the a League on TV. They rate the lowest of any television sport during their season. So to sum up I can't see them taking over footy in this country. Not in 10 years, not 20 years. They don't have a good enough infrastructure. They are divided. They don't have solid, successful, financial clubs. They don't have good junior programs. They charge far too much at a junior level. They don't encourage developing youth, they can them. They don't put money into junior development programs, only corporate sponsors do that and even then it is double ended.
clipper
Guest
I would argue that many of the 30% are Polynesian heritage, which is also holding up league grassroots in Australia from declining further as well.
clipper
Guest
I would equate the Storm more to GWS than the Swans. I think, even after continued success, GWS will still be a niche market, much like the Storm. It will be interesting to see what would happen if they dropped out of finals contention for a few years.
Republican
Guest
........I would'nt say its easier but there is less physical contact to be sure. In Ireland the Gaelic games attract large support at fixtures, especially the Hurling. Soccer is also big there but moreso in the north I believe. Like our code, the Gaelic equivalents are an acquired taste and as such cater only to a domestic market which is enough to sustain them due to their respective cultural status I reckon. Gaelic Footy would never compete with Soccer outside of Ireland, participation or other, while our code wont either. The codes are very similar as we all know while I believe the spectacle of our game is superior, though my Irish family would probably disagree with me on that......
republican
Guest
........I hold your reservations as well.........
republican
Guest
......the NT has by far, the largest support for the indigenous code in the country.......
republican
Guest
.......this is why a continued domestic focus is essential for our codes longevity. I do worry that the bankers at AFL House are intent on expanding to NZ in order to compete for the tele dollar. This would be at the expedience of the yet untapped and viable domestic markets that are meritoriously deserving to be included in their expansion plans, certainly compared to a heathen market of contempt i.e. NZ. Once you try to appear international, the expectations and demarcation between domestic and international, devolves quite convoluted and blurred at times, undermining any domestic DNA........
republican
Guest
........very true. This is also why NZ does so well at both Rugby codes, courtesy of the Maori..........