In my last article, we discussed why the French system helps bring through more underage players than anywhere else. We discussed how players like Antoine Dupont and Emilien Gailleton were able to be picked up by lower teams and in time make it to the top.
In this article we will look at what the French system does once it gets these players. It’s one thing to have lots of players, it’s another thing to develop them.
For clarity, I view Level 1 as the top non-Test teams of a Tier 1 country, and work down from there. Some nations feel they have missing levels, such as Australia with the lack of a National Rugby Championship. But is it the levels, or professionalism that is important?
Level 1 is Super Rugby and Top 14. Level 2 is NPC, NRC and Pro D2. Level 3 is Shute Shield, Hospital Cup, Heartland Championship and National. We know that France is bigger at every level because they have more players, a bigger economy, more billionaires, and all the other reasons why there are only 10 professional teams across New Zealand and Australia, so we aren’t going to discuss it here.
Professional players spend their job working on the sport, be that skills, strength and conditioning, learning the playbook, or plain old training. Semi-professional players can only spend a portion of their time on the game, be that per week, month or year. Amateur players work fulltime and fit the sport into their lives with a few training sessions between games and basic game plans.
These things become important when we look at the differences between France and Australia and New Zealand.
The issue is not the missing level, but the lack of professional places and the time spent being professional.
1. Season make up
Currently the model most Australian fans want to copy is New Zealand, where players spend half a season at two different levels. A Super Rugby player is Level 1 and Level 2 while an NPC player is generally a level 2 and level 3 (playing for good clubs), while everyone else spends their time at Level 3 or below. In France, the vast majority spend their time at one level, be that 1, 2 or 3 and are fully professional for the entire year.
If an NPC player spends 10 hours a week at level 3 and 20 hours a week at level 2, is that as good as spending 30 hours a week at level 3 in the National? Most likely the National player will be fitter, stronger and have spent more time on skills and running plays. The NPC player will have played at a higher standard but the player development will be better in the National.
(Photo by Dan Mullan/Getty Images)
United Rugby Championship Chief Executive Officer Martin Anayi recently said that the URC teams were looking for two more home games via a Cup. This would bring the URC season up to 26 regular games with at least 7 possible playoff games. This is what a European season is. When we look at Super Rugby and the NRC/NPC we find there are 24 (14+10) regular games in a season with playoffs. Essentially, the Northern Hemisphere teams have rolled the two competitions into one.
If you are a slow developer in New Zealand you could be 20 before you even experience your first semi-professional setup. In France, if you can get an academy contract in any of the 3 divisions you are a professional for the next three years. An untimely injury in New Zealand could slow your development by a year, but in France once you are in it’s three years.
We only need look at France v New Zealand in the under 20s to see the difference being a professional makes. New Zealand relied on their players skills and intuition to make things happen while France was much more organised on both attack and defence. This happens because France’s players have been fully professional for 1-2 years. How they approached the breakdown was a standout for me in how professional they were.
The French coach’s job is to adjust a few small things from their foundational knowledge attained with their clubs. Yes the French pack was big, but that is mainly down to Posolo Tuilagi (18 years, 149kg).
The rest of the pack were similar size, with the smallest player by 11kg being French. Their second lock was only 1kg heavier than New Zealand’s lightest player. Often we can think it is just size but it was actually power and technique that won the day up front.
2. Coaching input
Ronan O’Gara as manager of La Rochelle knows his senior players and would have a view on any of the adult players at his club. He can ask his strength and conditioning coach about where his youth players are in terms of development. Both he and Scott Robertson oversaw the starting 10s in the France v New Zealand u20s in Hugo Reus (19) Taha Kemara (20).
The big difference is O’Gara has been working with Reus for two years, while Robertson would have had less contact. Even this year O’Gara had 10 months compared to Robertson 6 months.
When O’Gara picked Lucas Zamora (18) to play for La Rochelle over Christmas, or Reus for the final 6 rounds of the Top 14, it wasn’t because he had injuries, it was because they were ready. His strength and conditioning coaches had been preparing them to play since August, tailoring their plans to be ready. O’Gara and the rest of the coaching staff would have given them things to work on in the u21 league each week and while training with the first team.
It seems crazy to me the best coaches in New Zealand are only given 6 months to work with their players. Robertson spent 11 years either as an NPC coach or Super Coach but in that time he really only worked daily with players for half his time. With the current Super Rugby head coaching roles being filled with non-NPC coaches, some of those may head overseas for better money and more control of their squad each year.
Wayne Pivac is a good example of this. He coached Northland to win NPC division 2, Auckland to two NPC championships, as well as North Harbour and Fiji. Yet unable to pick up a role in Super Rugby he moved to be assistant coach with the Scarlets, which paid more and gave him more time with the players.
Maybe people can enlighten me on this, but it seems to be that if you watch any Super Rugby or NPC team they all play the same way with a few variations. I think this is because preseason is so short there is not enough time to work on new systems, and the season too short to implement change. France on the other hand can change 10% a month and be a completely new team by the end of the season.
3. Underage leagues
New Zealand have an under 20s Super Rugby league, I don’t know if Australia do but if they don’t they should. As a URC fan I was jealous that we do not have an underage league yet. Then I dug into the material and found it was 3 games over 8 days, and was more of an u20 Baby Blacks training camp, which is very Super Rugby.
France has the Espoirs league which is for u21s. It use to be for u22s but having professionals play against academy kids was not deemed safe. This is something that may end up being a problem at the u20 World Cup too as Posolo Tuilagi can play u20s again next year. He has already established himself as Perpignan’s number 5 having played 628 minutes over 16 games for them. We saw what he did this year, imagine next year after another year of Top 14.
It’s fine to have the smaller backs be professional, but professional packs may be an issue.
No player who has a professional contract can play in the Espoirs, but Miles Amatosero (1041 first team minutes) and Tuilagi can, as academy players. This is the Top 14’s version of an NPC but it is all inhouse controlled by the club. It would be like the Blues running Auckland in the NPC against other NPC teams.
This league is two divisions with all 44 professional clubs taking part. The Top 14 are in Division 1 with the National Clubs in Division 2. The Pro D2 teams are spread over both divisions with teams going up and down based on performance. Division 1 is two groups of 10 playing 18 games across the season (almost twice the NPC). Division 2 has 3 groups of 8 with 14 games, meaning less games, less cost and less players needed for smaller clubs.
It’s not really a surprise that Toulouse won it this year, or that Clermont have won it the most, when you see their pathways. But it might surprise you that Pro D2 team Colomiers finished 2nd in their group in Division 1 ahead of all but 1 of their Top 14 challengers. For these young players it allows them to be in the shop window to pick up professional contracts. It’s not a week away once a year, but 54 opportunities over 3 years to secure a professional contract.
South Africa are mimicking this by playing the Currie Cup alongside the URC. The Stormers use their Currie Cup team to be the opposition to the URC team in their Tuesday training matches and I would expect the French teams to do similar in their weekly training. This is a great time to see young players prove they are ready to be moved up to the first team squad, such as Canan Moodie at the Bulls.
4. Playing Minutes
The reason people want an NRC is they know that Super Rugby by itself can never give enough gametime to enough people. Either it gives all the test players game time or it gives 2nd choice players gametime, but it can’t do both.
Players like Mack Hansen got tired of not getting enough minutes and headed overseas knowing even as a second choice player he could pick up a lot more minutes.
Regular Season = Games (playing minutes):
- Top 14 = 30 (36,000)
- Premiership & URC = 22 (26,400)
- Super Rugby = 14 (16,800)
If a Super Rugby team played the same 15 players each of the 14 rounds, and never let a substitute on the field, the most each player could get is 1,120 minutes. If the first and second player got equal time that number drops to 560 minutes. If fringe players don’t play in Super Rugby, what can they do while it’s on?
This is why Super Rugby squads are so small. Why do you need three players per position if anyone outside the first choice 23 are lucky to get a game?
The URC and Premiership can give 2 players per position 880 minutes, 320 more minutes than Super Rugby. But the Top 14 can give three players per position 800 minutes each. If they give 1,000 minutes to the first two players there are still 400 minutes that can be used on the promising u21s like Miles.
Yes the NRC will give more game time, but it’s at a lower level and with new teams and squads. Going to a home and away league gives you the same number of minutes with little extra cost.
5. Money
Super Rugby is half a season but it is competing with full season leagues like the Top 14. This requires it to pay more per match to players than they would get overseas. Yes they get more time off but most of us if offered 75% of our current income to work 50% of the time probably would not take it because we need the extra money, not the extra time. NPC and NRC are no different, where players are being overpaid just to get them to be semi-professional as life has to be put on hold for half a year.
An NPC coach is full-time but his actual time coaching players is only for half a year. NPC coaches need to be full time professionals as they are good coaches. If they were paid a semi-professional wage they would look to move to the MLR, Japan or Europe and get more money. Because of this NPC and NRC are not the most cost effective way to spent money to develop players.
New Zealand and Australia are now looking to give the top 60 Super Rugby players more Test games, which costs more money to fly them around the world. This has a knock on effect because the NPC needs to replace a lot of players in the XV squad who previously played in the NPC. All this adds up to a lot of extra costs for players and coaches.
By adding 8 more games to Super Rugby teams have 4 more home games which fans will attend. Most fans attend Super Rugby because they want to watch Level 1 rugby and have little interest in Level 2. Those who attend Level 2 are some from Level 1, some who only go to Level 2 and Level 3 fans watching their local hero.
Is NPC getting 65,000 (13,000 fans x 5 Super Rugby teams) per round (9,000 per game)? If it is, it should be able to be professional as it’s on par with the URC and above the Pro D2. If it is not, which I don’t think it is, more people care about Super Rugby and the All Blacks and not much else. This is why the Union is willing to take the best players out of the NPC and send them off to Japan for a month and then onto Europe.
6. Miles Amatosero
Miles joined Clermont as an 18 year old in 2020 on an academy contract for 3 years, in which time they hoped he would be ready for a professional contract having played games for the first team. Three years locks him into the JIFF, allows him to get fitter, stronger and smarter as a rugby player. In those years he mixed starting for the u21s and the full team often in the same season.
Year 1 he played 190 minutes over 7 games for the first team, possibly a record for an Australian lock since professionalism. He played R12 & R14 in December, a time many young players get their chance, having shown their ability in the u21s. If you include the European games this would be like playing the last 2 rounds of Super Rugby.
No Super Rugby team is going to spend 4-5 months to get a player ready for two games. He then saw out the season playing R23-26 which would be the end of the NRC season. In between both playing periods he would have been told what to work on back in the u21s team.
Miles Amatosero. Photo: Twitter
He finished off year 1 with a bench spot against Bordeaux in the quarter-finals, having received 10 months of level 1 professional rugby, twice what a player his age would have gotten in Australia. Yes the NPC players get level 2 but it’s not the same standard as Super Rugby.
Year 2 he got 263 minutes across 7 games having been injured for part of it. This season, year 3 of his academy contract, he had 588 minutes across 14 games. This is the season he would have made his Super Rugby debut if he had stayed at home, as most locks do it the year after their u20s year. The difference is he has about 20 months of level 1 training before he was 20, rather than starting off on his professional journey.
7. Conclusion
There is no right way to do professional rugby, but some ways are better suited than others. Australia doesn’t have an NRC which means they need to do something. In my view Australia should be pushing for a 22 game season in Super Rugby. If New Zealand don’t want it then Australia has to do what is best for it.
There needs to be the ability to have professional players being in Super Rugby teams for 10 months of the year. A tournament must run concurrent with Super Rugby that helps bring through younger players, be that a Super Rugby u21s or a domestic competition allowing fringe players game time and the ability to develop on and off the field.
France are producing professional under 20s on and off the field, we either adapt or we get left behind. It’s only a matter of time before an underage Champions Cup happens, which with the u20s 6 Nations will force the URC and English teams to get their house in order. Super Rugby does not have that mechanism to make things happen.
If I were a forward just about to turn 18 I think I would be looking to follow Miles Amatosero’s path, and I think more people around the world will feel the same way too. If France and Georgia’s u20s continue to improve, they will sell the French system themselves.
Clem
Roar Rookie
I agree with your point about average attendence, there isn't a problem with fans turning up, the problem lies with RA renting or booking out bigger than neccessary venue's, by taking the game local we already have venue's set up to host the average amount of attendee's which on camera will look FULL. I've watched some European matches and thought "Wow, that looks like 30k fans", when really there were only 5-6k fans crammed into an airtight stadium bringing the game alive with every cheer or boo. NRL is proof more teams are better then less teams, because it's just not Aussie talent that is choosing NRL over rugby but it's also the best of NZ talent as well, and this aids NRL to have the 2nd highest athlete registration behind AFL because they are bolstered by all the rugby boys. Australia still have more registered rugby players (270k) than NZ (150k), but it use to amaze me how NZ keep churning out talent after talent, but that pipeline seems to have stopped producing as we've evidently seen over the past 5 years the Junior Wallabies have been more dominant than the Junior All Blacks, so then why does that not transition into our Senior National Team? Like we both mentioned before, our kids are being limited to just 5 SR clubs compared to France U20's who's kids are thrust into 1st grade as soon as they turn 18, a competition with more teams and more games spread amongst a long season including champions cup games meaning there will be an opportunity for these kids to play.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
The big reason players choose League over Union in Oz is you have more chance of making it, you will be a professional quicker and you generally don't need to move to far to be a professional. In Union really only the top 5 each year will make it into the SR pathways while in league it is 16 so three times the chance. Most of the top players in both codes come from a small geographical area, most of the league players can stay in that area but for Union 60% will need to move out from it. If you are 18 and can move to Perth or England they both seem far way from Sydney. RA are blinded by the idea that people will only show up to watch SR teams but fans will show up to watch the top teams. URC average attendance is 10k, Pro D2 is about 5k, both are professional leagues but SR has skewed the mind down South that teams need to be filling 25k+ stadiums for it to be professional which is madness.
Clem
Roar Rookie
I feel SRP is a dead concept, especially for Australia. I remember Twiggy Forrest (Owner of Western Force & FMG) brought up the idea of breaking away from SANZAR and creating our own competition by making Club rugby professional and doing away with franchises, which in the short term will hurt (Financially) but will be beneficial long term (Growth, Development, and Increase in Interest). He was willing to invest $50 million to get this project up and running but as we know now RA board are too scared to swim into unchartered waters. Eddie Jones believes less teams will produce better individual players, but I believe that will kill rugby as a sport in Australia knowing you only had 2-3 teams to cheer for and to play for. You could have a 2-3 tier promotion/relegation system, if you believe this 18 year old is not ready to replace your current senior player you can always loan them to teams in lower tier's just so they get senior rugby experience in a professional environment. The point is they're not wasting away in some useless non-professional local club or just waiting in the wings for an opportunity to warm the bench. Kids can't develop if they don't get game time and telling them to wait it out in the shute shield or QLD cup is not helping their development, even worse they lose confidence that they may never crack it. Australia don't lack talent, just look at how many we filter through to NRL, we just lack the capacity to create a system to keep them playing top level footy in a pro environment, so in my opinion we should make club rugby pro and invest in a tier'd promotion/relegation system.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
And that is the challange for both NZ and Oz compared to NH and SA. Its fine to say that there are less people and less money but they need more support for younger players. Meafou would have eventually made it to SRP but how many years of Professional development would he have missed out on. Miles is coming back to Oz with 3 years of professionalism under his belt while if he had stayed as a lock he would have go his first professional contract most likely this SRP season and would only have been a bit player. As Paris XV has said France is not the best but it gives the most spots so more players are professional. All the European players are much more involved with their professional team then it appears they are down in the pacific. Brain Glesson (Ireland u20s No. 8) as a example played rugby for his school much like an Oz player would have. He played in the U20s 6N something that Oz does not have and from their has pick up an academy contract with URC team Munster. He is likely to pick up game time in the URC this year for a few cameo appearances against teams like Dragons and Zebre. This is where the Oz player is at a disadvantage. SRP must be SR ready the year they sign of the squad as the squads are small and the seasons are short, by contrast Munster will have 50 players who could all be getting game time over the season which last year was 26 games. Alongside his cameo appearances he will likely play in the Munster A games. Munster this season had 48 in the senior squad, 14 in the A squad and 11 in the academy, that's 73 players all in the Munster team setup and overseen by the Munster staff. Most of the academy and sub academy are playing AIL (Irish version of the SS/HC).
Paris XV
Roar Rookie
In Ireland, the A matches tend to be used to ease senior players back from injury rather than develop young players. Instead, many (but not all) of the Irish 20s squad have cut their teeth in the top two divisions of the All-Ireland League, which is the highest level of Irish club rugby, and a decent place to learn the game. Henry McErlean and Hugh Cooney, for example, played in the Division 1A final for Terenure and Clontarf respectively. UCD and Dublin University provide seven U20 squad members between them also play in the top divsion. Most of the squad have featured extensively for their clubs over the season in the league's many divisions.
Clem
Roar Rookie
I think the more teams we have competing in a professional environment the more options our young and upcoming talent have. Most of our kids either choose NRL, go overseas, or stay with their local club (when they have potential to be playing pro), but most just stop playing. There just isn't enough pro teams for them to play for in Australia, the ones who stick around for their chance wait around 4-6 years to debut in Super Rugby, that derails and hurts their development, look at France, as soon as their kids turn 18 they thrust them onto the pitch against Men and come out the better, their U20's winning back to back Junior World champs (probably 3rd after this year) is evidence, and that filters into their senior mens national team who probably world cup favourites and has been the best national team for past 3 years. But that's just my opinion.
fiwiboy7042
Roar Rookie
Well, the rights tend to be all bundled as a way to share the funding between the partners, due in part to Australia unable to offer a viable domestic rep competition. But the SRP rights, the story says, were unbundled. SANZAAR rights in Europe was obviously done by their European subsidiary. Expect extra revenue to come to Australia from the 2025 Lions tour even if it is just 8 games (which NZ may share in if that Anzac game goes ahead) and possibly the Lions women's tour of NZ that same year (?)
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/128082356/sanzaar-signs-new-deal-with-sky-uk-to-cover-all-blacks-super-rugby-npc says it was SANZAAR that sold the rights and included the NPC & Currie Cup. Previous deal was £20m with Sky Uk this one was done after RC rights were sold but SRP etc was not able to get any deal in the UK. SANZAAR's solution was to bundle everything together but it was unclear what the deal was other than Sky agreeded to show the other games in the bundle.
fiwiboy7042
Roar Rookie
Remember that those games were on during the lockdowns and became new competitions. The clash in 2021 between Crusaders and Highlanders attracted a TV rating of 100,000 off its live telecast into the UK; not too bad for a game that was shown live over there at 8am! I've also discovered something in the NZ 2022 annual report but I'm still trying to make sense of it except that NZ made more money in 2022 off broadcast rights than in 2021. Will get back on that hopefully later today.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
Regarding the Italian system it was doing great (copied the Irish I think) but I think the Top10 clubs pushed changes through that undid some of the work. It’s sad really but it is where Ireland are lucky as the Union has complete control while in Wales, Italy, Oz and NZ the level below their top tier hinders them. Ireland need to still do it consistently at u20s Championship but Covid seems to have hidden alot of the progress Ireland have made at that level.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
Appreciate the comments as I know you went through both. Agree Ireland is producing well and has been smart in how they have looked to constantly improve the system. Ireland has the under age provisional matches and at times provincial A sides that help bring players through. Reason for using France as I think they are bow ahead of France for top u20s and in the previous article I went through the vast difference in u20s playing T14 compared to the other leagues especially in the pack. Ireland has these things too as does England but bringing through as many players is there problem and its harder to dig up information on Ireland and England than France. England have the most final appearances at u20s but with the loss of the championship due to RFU v PRL v Championship during covid has hurt England while France has added a 3rd level meaning an hooker who is under 21 who is in the top 60 has a contract at a professional team. Ireland may have 8-12 being overseen by the provinces while NZ are luck to have 5 near a SR squad or coaching staff.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
Read up on the rights around SR Ao and SR Au. Both competitions ended up struggling to sell rights and in some regions it was put on for free. What you miss is it is better to have the game given away than not on. If you can find be any values of any NPC rights I'd love to see it. If it can sell rights OS it should be professional simple as.
Paris XV
Roar Rookie
Excellent comment: the article creates the impression that the French espoir system works efficiently. It doesn’t but so many players come go through it that the the talent eventually rises to the top. In terms of S&C, diet, coaching, France is a well behind Ireland and England, and to a lesser extent the other Six Nations sides, but sheer weight of numbers ensures they are very competitive. Despite very small numbers playing the game, the Irish system is relatively efficient in producing well-rounded professional rugby players and much more relevant to the Australian and NZ rugby systems. In Ireland, the best young players emerging from the provincial schools system and a separate clubs systems enter the sub-academys at each of the four professional sides. In the sub-academys, they receive all the support they need to develop as rugby players, and after two years the best progress to the academy. Only then, at the age of 20 or 21, they enter the three-year academy programme and become trainee professional players. Very few of the Irish 20s in SA at the moment are even in the academy system but many will progress. Interestingly, the Italian system is also worth looking at.
fiwiboy7042
Roar Rookie
I don't know how much the rights are worth but there would be no way NZ gave away the NPC rights in Europe given that they sell it elsewhere. And yes; if the games are shown on a regular basis on a foreign network, that usually means the rights have been sold. But you may be right about the NPC being semi-pro -- which reinforces the point that NPC rights are sold overseas.
Paris XV
Roar Rookie
Soccer is the dominant code in the UK but not in Ireland. Gaelic games tower over rugby in terms of participation levels. While soccer is more popular than rugby in Ireland, the two national leagues (NI and IRL) are both largely semi-professional.
Paris XV
Roar Rookie
I agree: there are, for example, around 21,000 male adult rugby players in Ireland and about 80,00o under the age of 18.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
For how much. I don't think they are sold in the Europe but rather given away. Just because they are shown doesn't mean it cost money. NPC is semi professional as players get paid to play in it. Until players don't get a fee its semi-pro. In alot of places professiinal rugby players are banded from competitions with amateurs for health and safety.
fiwiboy7042
Roar Rookie
BNHF, the NPC rights ARE sold overseas; sold to Japan, Australia, France, UK and South Africa (?), among others. I'm not sure if the SS/HC is onsold overseas, maybe NZ? Last time I went to the US, the competition was shown and had American commentators. The NPC is basically an amateur competition; they tried semi-professionaliasm a few seasons ago (figures were small) but it was not sustainable. As for the majority of NPC viewers coming from outside the NZ region ... welcome to NZ, population 5 million. The majority of AB jerseys sold are outside NZ. NPC still gets decent crowds outside the cities and you can see that in the Ranfurly Shield competition.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
Stats are always flexible. I think it says Georgia only have 3k
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
I think workload is down to the player. Both players like to be in the middle of it all so coaches adapt to it and adjust how the team plays to them. As both are good jackalers you see them more as the breakdown is contested more up in the NH so it appears they do more but Cane would be just as busy.