Australian football through Midfielder's eyes

Pippinu Redb Thanks for that information. Look forward to this initiative.

Also agree with redb's comment: "...and if one of your club’s players gets the nomination in a round it is a matter of great pride and excitement for the future. "

Thanks for the link Towser - terrific initiative - and yes, it has BB's initials written all over it!!! I would think the NAB rising star would become every bit as successful in the A-League as it is in the AFL. Why? Because part of the attraction of following your chosen club is to see the development of young players. One of the great joys of being a football fan is to see a champion out on the field, and to then think back about the day you saw that champion debut as a 17/18 year old - 5, 10, 15 years ago. In aussie rules, I still have wonderful memories of seeing champions of my club debuting as 17 years olds, as if it happened yesterday: Kelvin Templeton, Doug Hawkins and Chris Grant - all three had memorable debuts - and you remember that forever. Sometimes, like these three, you know for sure that you are seeing s future champion - it's so obvious by the way they are handling themselves at such a young age. I was just saying on another thread that I can remember the current club captain, Brad Johnson, a local Western Suburbs boy, being drafted as a fresh faced 17 year old nearly 16 years ago. This has happened yet with the Victory, but I'm sure one day it will happen - and certainly fans of clubs like yours, SFC and the Jets will get the opportunity to remember the debuts of their 17/18 year olds, because there have been quite a few the last couple of seasons for those clubs. I've harped on about Kantarovski many times for this reason. It's all part and parcel of what attracts us to the game and/or our club.

Towser, The NAB sponsored AFL 'Rising Star' is well liked by most AFL fans. It puts the spotlight on the best youngster/rookie in each round of the competition with an annual winner. This year it is likely to be Daniel Rich of the Brisbane Lions. I think it is a success for a number of reasons, it is well reported on each week, there is speculation about the winner each round by AFL fans and if one of your club's players gets the nomination in a round it is a matter of great pride and excitement for the future. I think the Award has grown each year. Redb

Tried to find an exact spot for the following article about the NAB Young Footballer of the year award. This will do. Noticed that the AFL had one. So how valuable is Ben Buckley to the FFA in knowing how to operate locally? Very in my judgement. Any AFL followers know how succesful their rising star program has been?. The impression from this article is that its been well worthwhile. http://au.fourfourtwo.com/news/108064,nabbing-the-stars-of-tomorrow.aspx

The MLS has been a successful professional league for over a decade. Only Toronto FC do anything for football in Canada, otherwise Canadians will just watch foreign football in their lounge or bar as they've been doing, apparently, for years.

The truth??? YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!!

The truth?! The truth is this perceived 'missed opportunity' has seemingly had you seething for over 30 years!! Of course, you cannot prove anything.... the whole may have died a death. Which it would have. The majority of Football supporters (at the time) would have never have gone to watch this 'new league'. And the divisions in Australian society between migrants and Australians would have been even worse. See? Its easy for me to talk about consequences as well. Why don't you just enjoy where football where it is now. It is in better shaper than American football, and ESPECIALLY than Canadian football, with which we share so much in common. Hmmm.... is this because we had a functioning (if poorly run/managed/perceived) National League for over 30 years? Its easy to revise history.

Back on topic and less re visiting of the past and in part a copy of an earlier post I made.. .........."""""""""M e I also continue my own football journey and still play in the over 35’s, am in a team in the World Masters over 50’s Div 1, my God I shit myself at times when I think about these games .. I shake my head and say how the Fark did I get myself into a Div 1 side full of players from the Prague ‘s, Apia’s etc of my age bracket … I feel so out of place with their off the ball play, movement off the ball, running in space, touch etc knowing I will be playing former internationals and yet strangely proud and feel well I can do it… (like my first game of football was when I was 24 played league before that, post that I played in the U 6 & U 7, then played league) A bit like Hal actually, hopelessly outclassed by those around me, but with a willingness to give it a go and my best shot … enough people are saying…. OK we respect you enough to watch and let you play in a Div 1 side… Like Hal is outclassed by Europe and our overseas players yet there is enough class, and players giving their best that we will go along and watch. As the money increases the youth players produce better players, the technical side of the FFA begins to take effect (I know 15 to 20 years away) but we are moving forward and at a rapid rate..........."""""""""""' I think the future is getting looking better all the time .. with yesterday announcement about the training academies .. the youth league .. our 16 ranking and so on.. Most of all we are moving in the right direction and will have a 14 team domestic competition before the next media deal... and of all the codes we have by far the best internet media ... to list some sites .. 442 / goa l/ soccernet / theroar / theround ball analysis / to mention but a few ... then traditional media sites TWG / Fox / MSN etc... My view of the future is a hugely expanded league with big budgets operating across a number of platforms.. But like I am going with all my inexperienced in the "league I level up against internationals" in the worldmasters I am still learning .. still working ... and most of all enjoying myself ... and hopefully enriching those around me with what I learn from my new team mates and playing against such class... so will Hal as players come back from Europe and the Socceroos play more at home ... things are moving in the right direction..

Two posts the first my last on the Kerry Packer deal and the next post hopefully to bring the thread back on topic. I realise telling the truth sometimes draws from some overly defensive reactions... but I will post anyway.. Kerry Packer had shaken hand with Sir Aurthur George on a TV / Radio national broadcast deal.. the deal was in part sponsored by News limited via .."The Australian"... essentially The Australian was to have the naming rights to the new league.. essentially Kerry Packer & Rupert Murdock backing football... Now it must be understood the media at this point in time... 2UE had John Laws .. who is without doubt the most influential media person in Australia over the last 40 or so years.. 2UE broadcast over all of regional Australia and Laws had a daily audience of close to two million people.. In summary Aurthur George agreed and shook hands on the KP offer ... which was more than double what RL was getting... Rupert Murdock was the key backer ... In KP own words to many and often when Aurther George withdraw and then went behind his back with all the confidential information provided by KP .. said he is the most ..... """"untrustworthy C I have ever met"""""" and """""Soccer Australia have no business ethics and cannot be trusted"""""".... Now because of that decision a certain TV channel benefited greatly and a certain TV presenter built a career saying often the main stream media do not care ... But be under no illusion the people running Football back then where ... well .... hard to say not get sued ...but by Fark they stuffed up a gift wrapped future ....

Blacktown City is another well-established non-ethnic club that welcomes everyone.

Savvas I also respect your efforts to defend the immense contribution of immediate post world War 2 migrants to football in Australia. But some negatives were present in the split. Not all the district clubs were cesspits of racism. Some of the ethnic clubs pressured players to leave.Problem is they were only at the ones who welcomed them the most! On balance the contribution is positive but there is some historical evidence to show some district based clubs were more open to new migrant participation and may have been unfairlty targeted when their continued existence may have been in hindsight for the benefit of the game. Granville Magpies were a relatively successful club prior to the split and boasted several semi professional macedonian / Croatian and Serbian players in their ranks but were gutted by the intervention of Yugal prague /south Stydney Croatia losing their existing best players to the new ethnic clubs and "ethnic " competition. my research discloses this club with thier own ground attracted crowds of 10 to 15000 smack in the middle of a very mixed cultural community. As in life everything does not fit into neat holes. Not all district based clubs were cesspits of racism. Unlike say marconi which had good roots across the italian community and also in the broader Fairfield / Bossley Park areas clubs such as Croatia wandered across Sydney with no local ,identity. They did not care. belrose South Sydney to eventually next door to Marconi . Foreign flag and at times a blatant political agenda. You know what I think the " Anglos " as you call them may have had some objective right to reject such teams It was never in Australian football's interests to allow this club to perpetuate first a political mission an ethnic closed shop and the toleration of Utashi signs at the end of its ground . Always going to be removed but always there. The demise of a multi cultural club like Granville Magpies at the cost of yugal/prague Avala and Croatia was a loss to Australian football. There were even "wogs " on its board. Their technical skills may have been lower but we would have been better of if some had survived in the Federation or NSL. Savvas not everything that pre existed the split or indeed after the split was bad but if one had a magical wand Australian football would have been the winner if a few district based teams had been incorporated in the rejuvenated ethnic based federation especially on the Northern side of Sydney granville and blacktown. The retreat of 3 major ethnic powerhouse clubs to within 3 kilometres of each other at bossley Park seriously hurt the game.and accentuated the negative aspects of the NSL etc.

Is this bitterness any surprise? The Anglos/Brits are expected to cop all sorts of hatred, which is allowed in this Politically Correct world of ours, but you say anything critical of anything else it's deemed "wog-bashing", "racism", etc. The Brits are remarkably tolerant people considering the hate and vitriol continuously directed towards them.

I am another 'wog' who is dissociating myself from Savvas' views, and supporting the right of Middie to put his interesting perspectives - many of which I agree with. On one points of detail... Packer didn't and never intended to represent the 'hated anglo majority'. He was a pragmatic businessman. Proof in the pudding is that after reforming cricket he didn't turn to Rugby Union, and rather saw the promise in Football. We collectively, essentially, snubbed the offer 25 years ago of the very medicine that we had to take later anyway via the Crawford process, and spent most of those 25 years in between making our beloved code an inept, prejudice-ridden laughing stock in this land. Anyway Savvas I'm not saying Australia was all roses for migrants (it still isn't) but I think your view of the world past and present is overly pessimistic.

Gee Savvas good grasp of Australian history. I will get the violin out for your parents( yes provocative but really Anglos insulting you and spitting in your face and most countries majorities gleefully accept newcomers ). Must have missed those Irish who had it so easy compared to your parent's stuggle let alone our indigenous people. Narrow self interested horizons are the bugbear of Australian history.. I am not Anglo but I have studied Australian history and some of those Australian families here before we arrived suffered the highest per capita casulties of any country in WW1 and may have had a profound stuggle themselvesfor ageneration or so. The war memorials in many country tons will tell you of this struggle. My father always reminded me with pride where we came from but also of why we left and your provocative "spat on us " was mild to what we left. We sometimes forget why we leave and recall with irrational sanctimonious sentiment of how great it was. My father a teacher worked as a funeral labourer in his first job here . He eventually realised his dreams to teach but it took a while Yours and your parents struggle was admirable just as the previous and post efforts of parents in each wave of migration that hits our shores . you know as well as I that there were railways hospitals industry here when we arrived . The food was terrible but somebody had been doing something not to ever forget the contribution of aboriginal land. I do not seek to demean your struggle only to highlight the perception of some that the immigrant's struggle did not began in 1950. This is just plain ignorance. I loved the NSL and it profoundly contributed to Australian football but it was always going to be a medium term endeavour APIA always then APIA Leichhardt (belated attempt to become more community based) then sadly skull duggory at the social club and demise. New italian migrants looking for social connection just ran out. Italy had recovered and prospered. Few more came. Australian Italian children left the neighbourhood. There was a split in the football community that had to be addressed for the future of the game. That is all. I know you are proud of your family's efforts and so you should be but take care in making that struggle exclusive to one time frame or group or to exclude even the conglomerate "Anglos " Some may say the real heroes of our country are our indigenous people who have hung in against great odds and whose culture has never condoned wanton acts of communal violence practiced by my and other Australian's forbears.

Ok savvas now you have lost the group. Not one comment has supported you as “this is a wogbash” article. I say this as I am of ethnic origin myself. Your stubbornness is getting the better of you. This is not a wog article as you have made it be. one day we will look back at the nsl and smile at all its beauty and colour it has given football culture in this country, like no other on earth. we will celebrate everything the ethnic communities has given us and continue to give. But one thing we will NOT celebrate and hopefully laugh at (one day),is the absurd way it was run. Please do yourself a favour and read the “the shootout”, it is a superb read. One thing is for sure…and that is Football belongs to No One. That is the one thing that is really holding back football in this country.. old Socca mentality and unable to let go of the past or are even too sensitive too even speak of its existence. If you are part of an ethnic community and it dosnt matter where you are in Australia, I will bet you my house that, that community is less supported now than when it was in the 70s/80s. Ethnic communities celebrated who they are through football, they succeeded. These days the message is spread through other forms, mainly internet. Savvas you said that you predicted that football will take off in this country. Strangely enough the man that is making this all possible is a refugee himself. Whom also walked out on the nsl board for its insular thinking.

Football belongs to everyone, not just a particular nation or ethnic group.

Savvas Tzionis Football started in 1870 in Australia ... the truth is it is the associations that created football the player base ... not the NSL teams.. you seem very eager to write off the the time between 1870 & say 1955... The ANGLO's in FIFA banned Australian for years did they... Kerry Packer wanted to loss money and take control of the immigrant population.. Get over it ... saying the NSL where bad is simply true ... its not my fault ... its theres ... Question what race owned football BTW ... you posts appear to say that immigrants built the game ... maybe a lot of truth in that BUT do you actually think the same immigrants would not have played football if the team was called Fairfield and not Marconi ... also the 85 years of footballs development is that not counted ... Finally at any time in Football history from around 1960 the player base of football has been around 60% or higher with ANGLO players ... sorry a long way from wog bashing ... bashing incompetent pricks who set themselves up as little lords... These three youtubes may be of interest to you ... Football does have a ANGLO history as well .. Be interested in what you think. Note how accepted football was with comments like "Joe, Nosey and Robbo"...& "Of course Blondie thinks everyone's yelling becuase the ball is tangled in the net" Teams like Auburn & Granville (association clubs) got crowds near what wests got in RL around the early 1960's The first one is Victoria V Indian in 1938 ... small crowd and played in Melbourne.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTd0f...eature=related The second one is Australian V Palestine in 1939 ... ground packed to the rafters .. not sure were this is played I think it could be the old Sydney Sports Ground.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YkwQ9...eature=related The third Australia V Hadjuk Split 1949 .. Sydney Showground ... packed to the rafters... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmJFK...eature=related

This is still all a load of ethnic bashing. This so called missed opportunity in the late 70's is ridiculous. Midfielder expects that every major soccer club of that era should give power to a man that represented the hated Anglo majority who spat on us, insulted us. You really expected us to trust him? Especially since he was going to relegate the major clubs of the time. Wogs had so little power then in the broader Australian society. They were NEVER going to let go of something they could finally describe as theirs. In the end, the sons and daughters of these ethnic power brokers have not needed the crutch of a soccer club as they have had the opportunity as a result of their parents sacrifice to create a niche in the broader Australian society. Hence the metamorphosis of the game here into something beyond a 'home' for the migrants of Southern Europe. At the time. the parents of people like me had NOTHING to support them except each other, and their instinct to survive. Midfielder, your views are so full of ignorance, its not funny anymore. They are views of people in power who create their own reality, as a major figure in the Bush presidency once said (or in this case, create their own past).

Realfootball It seems we have much in common...agree with all you said. l did go to some NSL games to give it a go however have been to all but 2 MV home games in 4 seasons and recently became a member for the 5th yesr.