Quade Cooper: the buck stops at Super 15

Mike Pyke got injured and so had so had to retire from rugby, then was introduced to aussie rules to keep him fit because it wasnt as strenous and rough, so he could play it.... dont know what you guys are actually arguing about, but thats just pointing out why mike pyke changed.... to argue that the super 14 is there only to feed saffa pay tv is idiotic, and to say its mostly meaningless is ignorant.

cattledog, You just summarised why Union is in such trouble in Australia - it's provincial, blinkered and cares not at anything that happens outside it's own paddock. Mike Pyke played rugby for Canada, then in France as a professional. He then did something else, which you can google. This should indicate why give quality athletes what they want is such a dumb idea - it's a global, multi-sport market now. Also, remember that what they want will be different - some athletes will like jetting around the southern hemisphere to play mostly-meaningless Super 14 games to feed South African pay-tv, and others wont ... but it's a case by case basis. Me, I say fund the junior program out of selling Concord Oval for housing.

*sighs* Y'know, this is why rugby is in the state it is in Australia. Inward looking, provincial and unaware of anything outside it's own paddock. Mike Pyke played for Canada, then in France for US Montauban. Scored a length-of-the-field intercept try against the All Blacks. He then did something else, that I'll let you Google. Remember, it's a multi-code world market for sportsmen. If you dont pay them what they are worth, then they go play elsewhere. And using restraint of trade to prop up inept, incompetent, useless organisations like the NSW and Queensland Rugby Unions just doesnt work that well.

Cattledog, How does the experience of Mike Pyke change your thinking ?

Despite him being one our players (Reds) if I was Deans I wouldnt play him until he makes up his mind.

Bring back amateurism. Let them play for the love of it.

Its hard for me to feel for the retired players who end up broke, If you are earning this kind of huge money even for a few years and you cant set yourself up for life then your a moron, Lets be realistic for a second even the low paid players are on a pretty good salary, I played with a couple of guys in age grade and schoolboy rugby who i keep in touch with who now play for the Tasman Makos, i know for a fact in that team those on the lowest pay get about 30k per season, thats not a hell of a lot but the season is only a few months long. For the rest of the year they are free to get a real job if they want to. Most go overseas and play for japanese or italian clubs and pick up another salary for another few months of playing rugby. I dont know how much exactly these overseas contracts are worth but i do know that they are worth more than the Mako's contracts. At the very least they are getting in excess of 60k per year with minimal expenses, thay are well looked after and they still have 3-5 months between seasons. thats the low paid players. Its not a huge amount but its a lot more than most people get paid for doing real work. And the best part is they would happily play for free, just because they love it. Less than free! They happily pay subs and club fees every year, just like thousands do because they love it.

Interesting point cattledog the Warriors league club have been doing just that for years, part of the warriors training regime includes education and training for a career after retiring from league, they try to make sure their players have job prospects outside of the game, I doubt if it makes any difference on the feild but you probably wont see any of the current warriors players broke and dealing drugs like the former KIwi and Raiders great Brent Todd,

The best call i have ever heard on the Money vs Country debate comes perhaps from the last person i would have expected to make such a comment. Sonny-bill Williams. Up untill i heard these words come from his mouth i had very little respect for SBW. Á reporter was questioning Sbw on the huge drop in salary he was facing by turning down the millions on offer to stay in france and about which club he was going to play for in NZ, his response was so refreshing i couldn't help but be impressed. he said '' I 'll be getting payed pretty well wherever i play'' it was so good to hear a player thinking in those terms. he might only be getting a fraction of what he could in france or england but a few hundred thousand a year is still a hell of a lot of money, The media and the public was making a huge deal about the monatary sacrifice he was making just to chase his childhood dream of being an All Black, of how noble that sacrifice was and how great he was for doing so, i was impressed no end that he was the one to give everyone a reality check and remind people that a few hundred grand is still lot of money to play a game.

Nah, Cattledog - the Mighty Woods, who I watch with my adult son when I get down to Sydney - although I'm at the stage in life where a poor game of rugby is better than no rugby at all. I do enjoy watching the exhibitions put on by the current All Blacks, for the splendid quality of it. I also appreciated the Ewen Mackenzie inspired improvement by the Reds this year. I'm an expat Sydneysider who watches the local rugby here and increasingly enjoys it more than snarling in futility at the Wallabies, because you see fair dinkum blokes have a fair dinkum go at it, for nothing. Major semi tomorrow between Southport Eagles and Surfers Paradise - rugby played with enthusiasm by blokes of all shapes, sizes and ages who like to have a yarn after the game with yesterday's men (like mesself) who patently enjoy the run, who have children and careers and jobs and interest in the world around them. One can listen to the referee / coach exchange views on the field straight after, express an opinion to the tight head on how the front row performed, marvel at the appreciative grin on the face of the new young buck when you give him a compliment for his play. I like to test my camera skills as well, an abiding hobby, and they like the product of that, too. Once deeply involved, now a mere spectator back at local level and loving it.

On "superannuation" Cattledog - the players can also create their own future by using the enormous amount of down time they enjoy to study and qualify in something else, just like so many young men working full time and studying part time manage to do. There are numerous All Blacks who managed to get to post graduate level (Howlett from days past is one), the Springboks have the the odd doctor going around from time to time, Brendan Cannon completed business studies and the original Brumbies captain Brett Robinson studied to be a surgeon, completing while he played. If they can then they all can do something similarly useful. That gives the lie to the full time nanny expectations I see from some, who believe the ARU and Super 14 management is somehow responsible for stopping them being personally irresponsible, and obliged to hold their hand when they have to front court or their counsellor, "feeeeeling their pain" with them from their self imposed stupidity. It's not as if "full time sportsman" only just happened in 2007, and players aren't innately aware it can be all over very swiftly (that was one of Deans' earliest messages to them). I have a mate who says his favoured League players aren't Rhodes scholars, they're good at playing a game. Ron Coote, Alan Cardy, Reg Gasnier, John Ballesty and George Piggins weren't academic giants but that didn't prevent them setting themselves up as eminently successful businessmen. James Hird comes to mind, too. If your carpentry apprentice or accounting trainee chose to be a dill outside work hours he wouldn't get half the sympathy these nancy boys attract, or keep his underperforming job. And it's not as if they have no contact with, and no knowledge of, the benefit of hard work and discipline. They know the cost of everything and the value of nothing, and they spend their formative business years being excused for their immaturity and lazy minds.