Wayne Bennett and Mick Malthouse are two crack coaches. The Dragons’ Bennett, a seven-time NRL premiership coach and defending champion, saw his side home safely 24-10 yesterday in their Anzac Day clash with the Roosters, at the SFS.
Collingwood’s Malthouse, a three-time AFL premiership coach and defending champion, likewise over Essendon 16.11.107 to 11.11.77, at the MCG.
They are so alike as highly successful coaches and their longevity is extraordinary. But their personalities are like chalk and cheese: Bennett (61), so quiet, so reserved, giving little away, the media not one of his pet subjects – he tolerates them, at best; Malthouse (57), so easy-going, so out-going, who makes a point of befriending the media.
It doesn’t matter what personality route they take, coaching success knows no ground rules, just a “W”.
So how do they compare with their peers in the history of their codes?
NRL:
* Bennett (Broncos-Dragons) – seven premierships, 613 games, 394 wins, 207 losses, and 12 draws – for 66.23%.
* Jack Gibson (Easts-St George-Newtown-Souths-Parramatta-Sharks) – five premierships, 322 games, 214 wins, 100 losses, eight draws – 66.45%.
* Norm Provan (St George-Parramatta-Sharks) – four premierships, 180 games, 123 wins, 40 losses, three draws – 70%.
* Clive Churchill (South Sydney-Canterbury) – four premierships, 247 games, 143 wins, 100 losses, four draws – 59.51%.
* Tim Sheens (Penrith-Canberra-Cowboys-Wests Tigers) – four premierships, 625 games, 316 wins, 298 losses, 11 draws – 52.32%.
* Bobby Fulton (Easts-Manly) – two premierships, 383 games, 252 winds, 121 losses, 10 draws – 68.41%.
* Brian Smith (Illawarra-St George-Parramatta-Newcastle-Roosters) – no premierships, 560 games, 289 wins, 261 losses, 10 draws – 53.39%.
AFL:
* Malthouse (Richmond-West Coast-Collingwood) – three premierships, 644 games, 369 wins, 269 losses, six draws – 58.23%.
* Norm Smith (Fitzroy-Melbourne-South Melbourne) – six premierships, 474 games, 255 wins, 212 losses, seven draws – 55.26%.
* Tom Hafey (Richmond-Collingwood-Geelong-Swans) – four premierships, 522 games, 336 wins, 183 losses, four draws – 64.75%.
* Allan Jeans (St Kilda-Hawthorn-Richmond) – four premierships, 575 games, 357 wins, 216 losses, two draws – 62.43%.
* David Parkin (Hawthorn-Carlton-Fitzroy) – four premierships, 633 games, 367 wins, 264 losses, two draws – 58.29%.
* Kevin Sheedy (Essendon) – four premierships, 635 games, 386 wins, 242 losses, seven draws – 57.89%.
* Leigh Matthews (Collingwood-Brisbane) – four premierships, 442 games, 255 wins, 179 losses, eight draws – 57.72%.
* Ron Barassi (Carlton-North Melbourne-Melbourne-Swans) – four premierships, 515 games, 275 wins, 236 losses, fur draws – 54.17%.
The standouts:
* Most premierships – Bennett seven in the NRL, Smith six in the VFL.
* Most games – Malthouse 644 in the AFL, Sheens 625 in the NRL.
* Highest win percentage – Provan 70% in the NRL, Hafey 64.75 in the AFL.
* Longest unbroken service at the one club – Sheedy’s 27 years at Essendon, Bennett’s 21 at the Broncos.
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The other standout, the Holy Grails in the two codes, are internal: the NRL’s State of Origin and the AFL’s Grand Final.
Neither code rates on the international circuit, but it’s a totally different story with football and rugby.
The Football World Cup and the Rugby World Cup are the code’s Holy Grails – the second and third biggest sporting events in the world every four years, behind the summer Olympic Games.
So Australians are fortunate to have the choice of four football codes: each one of them has something different, and appealing, to offer.
But this is salute Wayne Bennett and Mick Malthouse day. They both thoroughly deserve the recognition.
Class acts, good blokes.
amazonfan
Roar Guru
Wow, thanks, I didn't know that. :D That's really interesting.
Sherrin-Burley-Faulkner
Guest
Actually his father is Scottish, and mother Irish, however, in all probablity, his father's ancestry is most likely Irish, how many generations back, i have no idea, but my understanding is that most Scottish Catholics are largely descended from poor Irish immigrants, and are still largely working-class. Yet they were still known as 'Irish' up until around the Second World War, and marginalised untill quite recently. ,
amazonfan
Roar Guru
Thanks, I just saw. However what do you mean by "if you ask the family, they would probably call themselves more Irish, if you know what i mean"?
Sherrin-Burley-Faulkner
Guest
Worked it out, see above, you are right about Eddie.
amazonfan
Roar Guru
Sorry, I was actually referring to Ed. I should have been clearer. "Are you talking about Eddie, yes you are right, he is of Scottish background, but i reckon if you ask the family, they would probably call themselves more Irish, if you know what i mean." I don't understand what you mean. If he is of Scottish background, why would the family describe themselves as more Irish? (I'm asking as someone with no UK connections.)
Sherrin-Burley-Faulkner
Guest
Well it would seem like that, with a name like Jock, but his father was Irish born, his mother was (nee Gibbons), is Gibbons a Scottish surname ?, maybe that is the Scottish connection. Jock was a nickname, it was really James Francis. Are you talking about Eddie, yes you are right, he is of Scottish background, but i reckon if you ask the family, they would probably call themselves more Irish, if you know what i mean. Sorry, i confused myself.
amazonfan
Roar Guru
Are you sure? I thought he was of Scottish descent.
Sherrin-Burley-Faulkner
Guest
Cheers David, Mchale died when Collingwood won the GF in 1953 to end a premiership drought of 17 years, McHale was overwhelmed with emotion. Sadly, he suffered a heart attack the next day and then died on 4 October. Another great Collingwood born idenity John Wren, also sufferd a heart attack during the same game and died a month later, Wren would become one of Australias richest men on the back of illegal gambling in the back streets of Collingwood. John Wren was the central character in the classic Australian novel Power without Glory, these 2 sons of Irish Catholic immigrants would make Collingwood the most powerful club in the VFL. Interestingly the current Collingwood president, is also the son of Irish Catholic immigrants, no need to mention his name !!.
Ken
Guest
'they aren't NRL' Well there was no NRL back then. The QLD premiership, while never as rich or quite as big as the NSWRL (which became the ARL, then the NRL), was a top grade competition with players occasionally being selected directly for representative duties. I'm not a Queenslander bleating for equality of the records (I'm not a QLDer at all actually) but it's a bit harsh to say that records earned there previous to Brisbane's inclusion in the NSW comp are not worth anything. Also SOO as the code's Holy Grail - nope, SOO is awesome and I love it when the Blues win but it's not in the same league as my mighty Dragons lifting the premiership trophy
amazonfan
Roar Guru
He beat me to it as well! :D
amazonfan
Roar Guru
"Malthouse is not in the same class as Bennett. The stats do not lie." I think that is a little unfair; Malthouse is a truly superb coach. Still, I do agree that Malthouse isn't as good as Bennett, but not because Bennett has more flags. They coach different sports, and so I don't think you can compare them that way. Rather, I think you can compare them by contrasting them to other coaches in their own sports. So just as Pele can be compared to Bradman as both were the greatest in their respective sports, you probably couldn't compare Malthouse with Bennett as Malthouse was an all-time top 10 VFL/AFL coach, while Bennett was a top 2 or 3 NRL coach.
Andrew Leonard
Roar Pro
Just saw that SBF beat me to it... :)
Andrew Leonard
Roar Pro
Hi David - A clear ommission from the atticle is Jock McHale Collingwood (1912–1949) 714 matches, 8 premierships (467 wins, 237 losses, 10 draws) win% 65.4% So he trumps Hafey in win %, Malthouse in games, Sheedy in most games at a club. The Premiership coach in AFL also receives the Jock McHale medal. Yes he was pre= WWII but a legend nevertheless. Malthouse coached Footscray and not Richmond, he played at Richmond and St Kilda. Having said that on face value Bennett has a better record than Malthouse and would sit on a higher pedastal in his respective game for feats achieved.
amazonfan
Roar Guru
The fact that Malthouse coached West Coast to the finals ten seasons in a row says it all. He may have inherited a very good team there, which isn't entirely accurate, but to coach the Eagle to finals ten straight years showcased his consistency and brilliance. Not to mention he has coached three different clubs to top 3 finishes, and two to flags. He is a magnificent coach, and truly one of the greatest of all time.
David Lord
Guest
Many thanks SBF, we can always learn something new every day, and I'm very grateful for the input.
Sherrin-Burley-Faulkner
Guest
I liked the article, but i would throw in one more coach. Collingwood coach Jock McHale 261 Games as player including being Captain coach (1903–1920) including then record of 191 consecutive. 714 matches, 8 premierships (467 wins, 237 losses, 10 draws) (1912–1949) as coach. He was at the club as a player or coach from 1903 till 1949
jamesb
Guest
I know that this sport doesn't get much attention in this country, but whenever i think of coaches in NBL basketball, I straight away think of Brian Goorjian. Check his record: NBL championships: 6 with 3 different sides, South east melbourne magic (2), Sydney Kings (3), and south dragons (1) Playoff appearances 19 in a row Grand Final appearances 13 Goorjian has also coached over 400 wins with 70% success rate. Info courtesy of wikipedia I remember with the kings, Goorjian virtually had different sides when he coached the kings, with players coming or going, but still he had the kings competitive and therefore won titles. It'd be nice if he came back in the NBL
Todd Slater
Guest
What about 1987 ? The year Bennett co - coached Canberra to a grand final with Don Furner - the last one played at the Sydney Cricket Ground, only to be done over by a great Manly team & in particular a great English front rower in Kevin Ward who produced an outstanding game in heat wave conditions. As for the Souths Brisbane comparison - nice try, but it was only the one title 1985 & it was a pretty hot team, Meninga, Belcher, Jackson etc. Sure they beat a star studded Wynum Manly but he had also lost the 1979 Brisbane Grand final to a rampaging Valleys team lead by Wally Lewis & Ross Strudwick & Chris Close. He then spent three years at his alma mater Past Brothers & took them nowhere despite having a host of good young players. Bob McCarthy coached Souths to title in '81 over an Arthur Beetson led Redcliffe. Bennett is an all time coach no question but a bit of perspective on his Brisbane years certainly helps. I believe his defining year was '87 with Canberra as there weren't a lot of household names in that team outside of Meninga, who came back just before the semis from the first of his three broken arms to play. They beat a pretty hot Arthur Beetson coached Easts in the preliminary final. Bennett talks about all this in his last book 'Man in the Mirror' Another coach who deserves a mention , purely as a great coach (but not a football code) is Ric Charlesworth.
mick h
Guest
how you could say that rl is on par with afl internationally. rl has a 4nations plus world cups,pacific cup,european cup rl has the following comps overseas 1. rugby super league 14 teams including 1 wales 1 france professional 2. france 10 teams participation over 34,000 3. png 10 teams national sport participation over 15,000 4. nz 6 teams participation 24,000 in 2010 also top level domestic competitions in 1. cook islands - 7, fiji-12, wales- 16, ireland -20, usa-13, samoa-12, tonga-12, lebanon-7, jamaica-6, catalonia-9,scotland-11,south africa- 19,italy- 4, russia-10, serbia-8, scotland-11 and germany 4 all expanding nations. world cup qualifiers this year involving serbia,italy,russia and lebanon. yes rugby league is behind soccer and rugby on the international stage but a mile ahead of afl which is non-existant overseas. i am looking forward to this years 4 nations involving aus nz eng and wales and the world cup in 2013 which i will be attending.
Desert Qlder
Roar Rookie
What a subjective comment - "International Rugby League is on par with Super 15". To you this may be but you are obviously not a true Rugby League fan. You see, this is a tremendous problem for RL fans. We have so many people that wish to comment on and write articles about our game but do not seem to show the least amount of respect, or understanding I might add, for our game. A result of this, as exemplified by your article, is a compilation of facts and figures that do not tell the whole story of Wayne Bennett's career. It's not RLs fault that aussie rules has no representative level with which to compare. Perhaps that is to the detriment of their game. I'd suggest asking Wayne Bennett himself whether his premiership with Souths or coaching record for Queensland is worth considering. It's in that answer that many would find illumination. The point stands however that even at first grade level, Malthouse has a far inferior record to Bennett. I applaud you for trying but you've approached this whole subject poorly.