Waratahs supporters vent their frustrations

When I was a little bloke I was often given posters, footballs, cards by the Swans and various rugby league teams, but to be honest they were dime a dozen, what got me excited was meeting the players. It was rarely the superstars, it was often the reserve graders or up and coming blokes, but I didn't care who they were, they were there to see me (and 50 of my classmates). They threw me a pass or kicked me a ball and encouraged me to play sport. It wasn't the posters that made me love sport it was these guys who took the time to encourage me to play. Rugby does a reasonable job with finite resources and player appearances, but for every additional boy or girl they see and speak to could be the next James O'Connor or Kirsty Giteau

pTah, Rugby doesn't have access to the same resources as Australian football - revenue, players, supporters, volunteers, etc. But as you say, rugby needs to be smarter. At the top end, it is incumbent on the Wallabies, Waratahs, Reds, Brumbies, Force & Rebels to play an attractive brand of rugby that encourage more fans to games, & more youth to play rugby. Too often, the importance of this is missed by those who shoulder the responsibility to take the game forward. At the bottom end, even if rugby can't provide every free every jersey, shorts, sox & rugby balls, it should at least be visible. Being visible shows the people leading the game care. Okay, maybe rugby doesn't have the same largesse as Australian football, but being visible among the fans shows they care.....

Your last para is the best thing said on this forum all day. The Tahs have shown they are willing to listen to the fans, it is time the fans showed they are willing to support their team. like you we've changed our plans so we can got to SFS and yell ourselves hoarse.

If you have such a high opinion of the Reds why don't you jump on the bandwagon and become a Reds fan.

Stephen the irony was that as I drove home from the forum last night a black 4WD drove past me. On the back it had a sign which read "play AFL. Playafl.com' and that car was heading straight to a rugby union heart land. On a field that Gordon practice during the week, several kids kick a Sherin to each other on weekends amongst the kids who kick Gilberts. I have no issue with AFL, but Rugby cannot compete with the money that AFL has, they need to act smarter. Jason Allan is a very smart operator. I hope his total focus isn't just the Professional team, but as you say how this professional team engages with the community. He stated that there are only 30 or so pro players in NSW who have many commitments with sponsors and travel. Fair points I admit, but more can be done and needs to be done. The Tahs can't be everywhere this is where the NSWRU and Sydney Union need to step up and get the shute shield players to interact with the kids more. The other day Mortlock was signing autographs with Gordon players at Bunnings, By all accounts the kids were ecstatic. In the long run the professional game relies on the grassroots amateur side. I hope the Tahs work closely with the NSWRU etc to ensure the game prospers at all levels.

I agree Sheek. LeftArmSpinner has said the Tahs lack 'belief' and rickety has said they are 'scared of losing'. I believe these factors have caused them to take the conservative path... But I think there is another factor at play... They are scared of the fans. The forum had some hostile 'fans' last night and a home team boos them when the lose and when they win. What does that do for your psyche? When you catch the ball deep in your 22 and you see the opposition steaming down on you, you're first reaction is to take the safe option. The Reds and the Crusaders play with confidence so when they kick it back the execution is generally spot on. The Tahs are fragile, their execution is such a situation is often poor. The running isn't working, the kicking isn't working, the fans will boo if they lose...keep it in tight and win ugly. Make the finals and hope all is forgiven. I don't like this style of play but that is what is happening. In fact I bloody well hate it... But sacking players, coaches, and management isn't going to fix this. We've tried before it hasn't worked... Just ask Link. As fans we've vented. The Tahs have heard us and they know there are issues and they are trying to fix them but there is no overnight solution. As fans we need to put aside our anger and find a way to lift the team. We need to throw away our unmet expectations. We need to replicate the Stockade in Melbourne. We need our team to know that we will back them if they make the wrong decision. We need to help them through this god foresaken never ending trough and help them believe again. Believe in themselves, each other and us. I wasn't going to attend the game tomorrow, but I shifted my plans. The Tahs need us. I've rallied a few mates and we will be cheering. We want entertaining rugby but they need our help to achieve that.. And if we give it all some voice the venue will be just as entertaining as the Stockade.

To support a lot of the above comments...I went to last night’s Fan Forum, not because I wanted to berate the players or the coaches, there were plenty of others there to do that. I am rugby tragic but not a coach and I do not pretend otherwise….BUT... My question at the forum was the same question that is raised here..What are we doing for the youth? What are we doing at grassroots? Where is the effort? Where is the enterprise? Where is the engagement? Where is the representation? Because all I heard last night was excuse after excuse and a series of finger pointing that refused to accept accountability. I also coach U7 rugby and we have seen no one, absolutely no representation or engagement from NSWRU to the extent that I had to go to NSWRU head office just to get team posters to give to the kids! IT IS PATHETIC. The AFL, League and Soccer are light years ahead and are winning the hearts and minds of the youth. They visit the schools, they coach and engage with the youth. They are present and are not giving an inch. The kids have scant knowledge of union - some of my kids even arrive at practice in league tops!! The ARU, NSWRU, and every other Rugby Union should bow down and thank their lucky stars that the rugby tragic parents are keeping the sport alive in the minds of the children because no one in their ivory towers seems to give a damn. My advice? Get out of your corporate boxes and spend a weekend in the stands, or get down to a Shute Shield fixture and gauge the difference in atmosphere for yourselves. It is ironic that the photograph the HSBC Waratahs used to promote the Fan Forum was of the fans on the field following a Super 14 match last year, meeting the players, enjoying the game, autograph hunting, hero patting...but that was last year!! This year..NOTHING..and why? I am told by the Chairman that this is the fault of the SFS trust who wants to protect the grass..Well tell the SFS Trust to get stuffed and come and play your Super 15 matches at Woollahra Oval like some of the great Shute Shield matches that are full of atmosphere and yes, FUN. And as far as doing your assessments and KPI’s are involved, here is a heads up for you, get some video clips of the fans at Suncorp, Newlands, Loftus Versveld, Thomond Park..seriously, pick your stadium and you will see the passion in the fans. Then ask yourself why that does not exist and how you can get it back. But don’t try and do it yourselves, get in experts, people that know how to market a sport and how to re-ignite the passion that has all but vanished.

I agree Waugh is a team man, & that's highly admirable. But even the greats can have a blind spot. Waugh drives the team, & too often they take the conservative option when the heat gets too strong. Sometimes it takes extremely great courage to be even more daring when things are tough. There are many examples, but I'll throw this one in. In 1937, arguably the greatest ever Springbok team toured Australia & New Zealand, winning 4 of 5 tests. Their only defeat in Australia was to NSW (led by Cyril Towers) who won 17-6 or thereabouts, scoring 5 tries to one in the rain, slush & mud. They won by throwing the ball around as if it was a dry day, totally against the norms of the day (or even today). The legendary Springbok Danie Craven, who played in this game, described it as the greatest example of wet weather running rugby he had ever witnessed. As the SAS motto states - "Who Dares, Wins". And I guess that is the message from the fans to the Waratahs - "Who Dares, Wins".....

Sorry I can't agree with that, if you get the chance to speak to Waugh you'll will see that it's never about him it's always the team... And believe it or not the fans. How many of us would continue to play the season with a torn bicep tendon? I don't get out of bed when I have man flu let alone take on the might of some of the best rugby players in the world when it feels as if my arm will fall off.

KOTG, I think you are part of the problem. The fact is the Tahs play good and bad rugby, but they have shown nothing at all over the past 3 seasons to suggest they can play wide expansive in a multiple successive games, and they have shown no consistent form that suggests they can win the competition. There are three contributing factors to this: A) A conservative coach who is adverse to risk in tight games B) a captain who is very unintelligent in his on-field decisions, and is unable to keep up with a game played at width and at pace C) a 10 and 12 who lack the ability to execute passing both ways at pass, and who are devoid of intelligence in their option taking. These variables and end result are present every season, yet arrogant fans predict the tah’s to perform much better than there form and ability suggests. They are a good team that are contenders to make the finals but not contenders to win it. And until those factors above change, I can’t understand this belief that the tah’s fortunes can. With the reds throughout those bad years, they always reached the expectations in which the fans set for them. After 5-7 years of rubbish they identified what needed to be addressed and addressed it. It wasn’t some magical or amazing rise, it is the result of a long term plan being well executed and it started with Phil Mooney and a clean out of top management.

So long as Phil Waugh is involved at the Tahs they wont change there philosophy unfortunately. The fast expansive game will severely expose him hence why they play the boring, methodical style with Carter crashing it up etc... Waugh is a warrior however if the Tahs are to adopt a Reds approach they need a quicker Number 7. Until they unearth a flyer at openside I would expect to see the Tahs continue the status quo despite the fans voting with there feet. They might throw it around tomorrow night and out bully the Lions however what about doing it against a top team.

You are not alone Willy. I go to a Rugby match to see the team I support win. By winning I would prefer to see a good contest for the ball, however if a few successful penalties and well judged kicks (please no low percentage kicks) win the match.....bring it on. Rugby league is all about advancement and none of the thrills & spills that occur when the ball is contested. If the Tahs keep winning the fans will come back. I was at the forum last night and at times it was hardly a "Q & A" more like who could vent their spleen the loudest. Yes there were a few interesting and valuable points made by both sides but I would reccommend that the Tahs do not give in to the mob mentality that was evident at times last night.

The Tahs may need him but i dont think the Wallabies do. With Horwill in top form, Sharpy playing soem of the best rugby of his career, and the emrergence of the lieks of Hugh Pyle and Rod Simmons, Australia's second row depth is looking the best it has in years.

the other frustrating thing, is that we then watch the reds. a team totally opposite to the Waratahs. a team you would be proud to support. a team that cares. that really amplifies what we are missing with the Tahs. Two years ago they were a team of no bodies. byt with self belief they have won over legions of new fans. even when the Reds were cellar dwellers, they were still a better rugby team to watch then the under achieveivng and often arrogant tahs.

Not so simple. They could *ask* the concession holders to lower their prices, but given the smaller than expected crowds, which means the concessions are not making as much profit, then I would expect the answer to be "sod off". The problem is, the Waratahs management need to create a plan which improves attendances and atmosphere before they can afford to make price cuts. I suppose if crowd numbers go as they are they might go back to Concord where they can control the gate, the concessions and all of that stuff that adds up to making the experience "value for money".

This is off topic but seems to have dropped off everyone's radar ..... Where is Vickerman and what is he doing? We were told he would be back at the Tahs in May. Well, it is now halfway thru May. What is happening with him?

"paying $25 just to park, $8 for a beer, overpriced seats" Apart from the Rugby the Tahs are playing.. I can live with that. My village club team is sh*te.... and we have not had 1 player selected for our NPC side... But i will still support them. However, the prices you stated.... hmm.. Yep if you add that to the mix, i will get pissed off. Sorry about that. Solution is simple.. Lower the prices.

"If fans think 2011 is a bad season they obviously didn’t watch many of the Tahs games in 2007!!" Geez - I agree with this! Or even go back to the late 90s and early 2000's... Scary stuff.

No point in comparing NZ teams with Aussie teams Johnny. The simple fact is we probably don't have the depth here to produce five top quality squads of 22 players... and once you start losing some of those key starting players that lack of depth is brutally exposed. In New Zealand it's the national game (national obsession) and there are literally hundreds of top quality players running around in the NPC to choose from. We don't have that luxury unfortunately.

Good to hear your belief in the team Willy. While alot of so called Tah fans cry into their hankies and stop supporting the Waratahs it is people like yourself that are out there barracking for the team through the good & the bad batches. If fans think 2011 is a bad season they obviously didn't watch many of the Tahs games in 2007!! I'm glad no punches were pulled at the forum, I'll be out at the SFS on Saturday night yelling myself hoarse & hope to see an improved performance by the boys in Blue! 2 things i want to see improve this week - when the Tahs kick, kick with a purpose & execute well, forward runners hit the ball at pace & in pods.