ODI disaster means Aussie selectors must look to next wave

We'll have to hope the sun shines as I can't see Punter making runs in England otherwise. The English bowling attack is a very good one.

This is the first series lost by Clarke as captain, so this is all a bit harsh.

Actually Ponting does not deserve the last hurrah but the team needs him. Agreed that many of the current batsmen have scored runs but for Ashes the team requires Ponting. It is because tough swinging conditions will show the true class of a batsman. Warren Buffet once said that anyone can make money during the bull run but only when the tide goes out you know how many were swimming naked. Similarly anyone can make runs on a placid track but only the skilful will succeed on a grassy track. And Ponting surely is the best.

Fair enough, but I was talking about the Australia A squad.

Why does Ponting 'deserve' a last hurrah? Doesn't the team come first, or shall we all take off our shoes, bow down and get spiritual with one player's vanity project?

Well, England won three Tests by an innings here 18 months ago, so improving on that would be a stretch. Arguably, though, Finn, in particular, has since progressed and other young players on the fringes have gained more experience, so they're certainly not weaker in any respect other than the fielding Collingwood provided. I suspect you're clutching at straws regarding the Windies series. England were not at their best but they weren't really tested and Strauss scored a couple of tons which will certainly help his state of mind.

been hearing it since 2008, because it's been happening since 2008. Do you see the connection? If you want to make a lot of money for just playing sport, then you need to turn up when selected, with no excuses, and with reference to S. Waugh, have no regrets afterwards. This series, excuses were made in advance and nothing remains but regrets

Include that series if you want to. All that does is take his average from just under 20 for his last 5 series to just over 22 from his last 6 series before his injury. It doesn't hurt my argument at all. It would drop lower if I included the series before that where he averaged 18 as well but I have to stop somewhere. Of course they use things other then stats to pick players but it's a pretty important factor. Stats demonstrate performance. Ricky Ponting has had a magnificent career and this is reflected in his batting stats. His poor run of form over the last few years is also reflected by the stats. Brett Lee may have been selected partly because he offered raw pace but he has a very good statistical record as well. His raw pace would mean nothing if his average was 40. Besides, the reason Johnson has been criticised has been because his performances at Test level have been woeful of late which, surprise surprise, is backed up by the stats. I think we can safely say that if they picked the team for the England ODI series on Ryobi Cup form we at the very least couldn't have done any worse :)

It's nice to see the Clarke and coach mob have to squirm a bit and I say this as a lover of strong Aussie cricket ! However selections and blooding new players has been woeful... They couldn't have picked usman and Hughes not stepping up or Sean marsh''s meltdown but they have wasted their time with Forrest and Bailey and a few others ..

MattF playing devils advocate a little regarding the one day stats as i don't believe he should have been picked for the UK tour. i didn't pick one random series i picked the one you chose to stop at as it suited your stats just like i wanted to add it as it suited my argument. I think the selectors look at the roles required, how they will get through the 80 overs, who will bowl into the wind, etc, etc. I don't think they do it purely on stats, but it is not gut feel although that must come into aswell (the call to pick Slater over Hayden way back then must have had some gut feel as Hayden had all the stats and Slats had put in a couple of good digs on tour that hayden hadn't and it must have been gut feel that Slats was in better nick and would get the job done when begfore the tour i bet all thought hayden would be opening up with Tubby....but that is digressing) I remember Steve Waugh used to always say he loved having Brett Lee in his team as although the stats weren't always there he had Mcgrath, Gillespie, Kasper, Bichel who could all bowl long economical spells in all conditions but Lee offered raw pace and strike power and he loved having that option in his bowling line up.

That's not the start of last summer that's the 2010/11 season. He was injured last summer. I've pointed out that his 5 most recent ODI series have been very good and you respond with "oh but one time he averaged 128." Picking his last 5 series isn't "twisting stats," it's showing his most recent form in the format. Picking one really bad series out of numerous good ones around it is twisting stats. Maybe we should include the one before that SL series when he averaged 18? Or we could go with his career average of 25.47? If you don't want to place emphasis on stats what do you judge someone on? Gut feel? The vibe? I know they don't always tell the full story but taken together they do show that he has been a pretty good ODI bowler for Australia and was doing well in the format before his injury. His Test record over that same period of time has been awful, there's been no question about that, and I wouldn't have him anywhere near the test side at the moment. You could probably throw a few more bowlers on that list before Johnson. Cutting for example. I wouldn't have picked Johnson in the "A" squad.

It was really bizarre to watch. The team mostly consists of players with hard hands who can't work the ball around to save their lives. Warner at least can have a slog now and again but Wade and Forrest were just blocking the ball over after over. In a 32 over match. I couldn't even understand why, considering the shortened state of the match, Forrest was sent out at 3. The tour went from floundering to bizarre with the final match.

I think we are better placed that we were 2 years ago. We have found a half-decent spinner and a decent group of seamers. In our conditions, I'd be bullish about us doing enough to beat England, or anyone side for that manner. I watched England play the West Indies a month or two ago and no-one can tell me that England has improved since 2010. I think Swann is losing a bit of zip - he holds England's bowling together. The West Indies pushed England at times, especially in the 3rd test. As I said, a lot can happen in 12 months, people are writing our chances off far too soon.

Ponting may have been struggling but he deserves one last Hurrah in the form of the Ashes. I'm sure he'd be charged up for the series and perform to the max. Hussey has to be included as well. Aus don't stand a chance without these two stalwarts.

Scott,I was refering to Australia,so not so much utter nonsence as well ,yeah you're right, I have little knowledge of England.However I know English cricket grounds are much smaller, more intimate, and therefore more suited to cricket. The capacity of Australian grounds(in thousands) ;MCG 100 ,ANZ 84,Sydney 47,Gabba 42,Adelaide 37,WACA 24 The capacity of English grounds(in thousands); Lords 30,Egbaston 25,Old Trafford 22, Headingly 20. What I was getting at is that I would rather be sharing a pint with you in a smaller English ground, than the concrete cavern that is the MCG . Of course there is a caveat .A packed MCG is a mind blowing experience.But by and large it only happens once,and that is the first day of the boxing day Test match.Therefore on other days, a crowd of 15K at Lords is more intimate than 45K at the MCG.Imagine if you will a crowd of 15K at the MCG. One more observation;ground capacity in Australia can be deceiving when making comparisons with English grounds .Australian grounds are built for AFL football. And so a spectator can be a long way from play.This is not the case in English grounds because they are considerably smaller in playing area. What we are collectively saying then is, so long as we can get tickets to the game,it will be a far more pleasant experience in England,even if Australia lose.

Sorry, I meant to type 'incumbent Test bowlers', referring to Siddle, Hilfenhaus and Pattinson.

Quite the rebuff to those who seem allergic to the notion of replacing the "experienced, proven middle order". After Hobart, I suspect Arthur bowed down at Ponting's feet... same as usual.

McKay's been pretty good. At least compared to the rest. Again a quick look at the Ryobi Cup stats from last season show bowlers like McDermott, Starc, Haberfield (surprised me) and Jon Holland (though 6 of his 10 wickets were in the one match) all averaged under 20 with the ball, and bowled enough overs to make it a genuine statistic. Over the international summer only Starc was given a shot with the ODI side, and he was already in the national setup anyway. Krejza and Faulkner both picked up a fair few wickets as well, though their averages were closer to 30. I'm sure Brad Hodge will be happy to tell you about how just how closely the selectors follow the Ryobi cup!

Significant though, that one-day cricket is the form of the game in which Australia was meant to be superior to England. There's yet to be evidence Australia has improved considerably since the 2009 Ashes, but we'll get a better idea in November when South Africa come here.

Yawn, being hearing this since 2008,