Tuesday set to be D-Day for Bombers

@AR. So you believe Essendon should be hung on the basis of their own internal report. More fool them for being open and transparent. That's really paid off....... other clubs take note! Let's be honest, shall we? The entire investigation, Essendon's and ASADA's, commenced on the basis of an accusation that Essendon players had been injected with performance enhancing drugs. That accusation has been the subject of more posts on this issue than anything else including governance. It's also now been shown to have been unfounded. No players will be charged with doping offences, not even Jobe Watson. The whole show was a charade. No smoking gun, no proof of banned drug use. The basis of the investigation was false. Nevertheless, it turned up issues of governance, which are probably widespread across the AFL, but despite this the club and four key staff have been charged with bringing the game into disrepute although we have not been told how this was accomplished. I'm astounded by how Keystone Cops this affair actually is. As far as I know there is not even any definition of the charge of bringing the game into disrepute. The charges can't be sustained legally.

Hey Guys I'm coming from the Sharks angle here. If ASADA actually find evidence that Sharks players took illegal substances, wouldn't that be the catalyst for ASADA to go back to Essendon for more interviews, especially if ASADA have asked a question to a cronulla player, (the breakthrough question) which they haven't to an Essendon player or official for that matter?

"On what basis has the game been brought into disrepute by these individuals?" I'm not sure what the precedent definition of bringing "the game into disrepute" is. That said, I would think this would vaguely sum up the AFL's position: - the above individuals were, in various ways, responsible for intitiating and overseeing an experimental injection program carried out on the Essendon players; - the Football Department then "lost control" of the injection program; - Ziggy described it as a "pharmalogically experimental environment never adequately controlled or challenged or documented within the Club”; - as a result of this program, the club was investigated by ASADA (and the AFL) to determine exactly what had occurred; - the result of that investigation is not presently known...however, at the very least, there has been unprecedented damage done to the AFL, its brand and its partners, sponsors and stakeholders. At the very worst, there is a real danger of physical harm which could befall the players as a result of the injection program.

Wilson said this: "Hird supporters refuse to see that the senior coach oversaw the implementation of a drug program so dangerous and reckless players still remain in the dark about what they were given and the potential long-term effects." The inference is crystal clear. It was an illegal operation. That's just one Wilson fabrication, lie, slander. There's plenty more. There is not the slightest evidence to back it up. ASADA hasn't found any. If Wilson has it why has she not provided it to ASADA or if she has why have they not acted on it? As far as AOD-9604 is concerned no charges have arisen from that even in the light of Jobe Watson's confession. Why oh why is that? ASADA and the AFL seemed to have avoided that. Could it be that ASADA handed out the wrong advice after all and wants as little discussion as possible on that point?

No action against any individual players. No proof of doping. Yet James Hird, Mark Thompson, Danny Corcoran and Dr Bruce Reid are charged with bringing the game into disrepute? How does that work? On what basis has the game been brought into disrepute by these individuals? The scandal commenced with the media going off half-cocked with claims of banned drug use at Windy Hill. Essendon responded by requesting an investigation by ASADA and the investigation found no evidence to sustain any charge of doping. So, the basis for the media claims and indeed the investigation itself was actually non-existent. Despite this the professional careers of four respected individuals is now under threat. My personal opinion is that the AFL will regret this bitterly. Dr Bruce Reid can't be expected to accept this without challenge and it's certain James Hird and Mark Thompson won't. I believe Essendon will pay for legal representation for Danny Corcoran. If the ALF Commission doesn't clear these blokes I'm prepared to bet the Supreme Court will.

Jeff, you've summed it up perfectly.

Franko, I've been a journo for a long time. I've done plenty of investigations. You might remember at least one of them. Immediately after Port Arthur I discovered the police were trading in surrendered AR 15 rifles and that one of those traded rifles had been used by Martin Bryant in his killing spree. At the time I was at The Sunday Herald Sun. I also found and interviewed the man who had surrendered that rifle. Just telling you this because I want to make a point about how journalists operate. It's my profession. Yes, it is permissable to quote a source without naming them if it's necessary. But I fail to see how this can be justified in stories day after day for months on end. When is she going to find a source who will stand up and make a public statement? I don't think she will Franko, because frankly I don't believe these sources actually exist in the vast majority of cases. Caroline Wilson is as far away from being one of Australia's finest journalists as the devil is from Heaven. She departed from any journalistic code of ethics long ago. It's not ethical to slander and defame a man as she has done to James Hird over the past six months. It's not as if if he has been in a position to defend himself from her wild unsourced accusations. Wilson in my opinion is an unethical fraud.

I'm all for making them swapping players with Melbourne for 2 seasons.

Yet your were prepared to say Hird is beyond reproach before the facts came out. Go figure.

I don't barrack for Essendon, and i think she is a scandolous rumourmonger, who has no place reporting football, i agree with Phil that Emma Quayle does a good job, reporting actual football stories, and interesting ones at that. And FWIW and not related, Andrew Wu springs to mind in Sydney as a good football reporter. My previous post was directed at franko, who had replied to Phil.

The ASADA/WADA code on doping makes little allowance for differentiating between mistake and intent. If the code is breached, athletes who were the subject of such breaches are liable for penalties. This whole issue has been made to sound more complex and subjective than it is - which is quite simple.

The Switkowski Report mad mention of an exotic pharmacological environment at EFC. Seems a little unfair when you read what was going on throughout the AFL back in 2009. Richmond, Geelong, Collingwood etc were using calf blood and chicken comb extract to help their players. See http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/the-healing-game-20091124-j8p6.html This is not just an EFC thing. It is global and is WADA/ASADA approved. This is what EFC insisted on - it must be WADA/ASADA approved. So why punish them for trying to be legal. Strange indeed! Especially when it comes out that Pears and others who may have had AOD for medical reasons and therefore approved by Doc Reid on the basis that it was WADA/ASADA approved. The good doctor can't comment because he's a doctor bound by ethics. Pity journos are not bound by ethics - they can write and accuse on the basis of nameless sources - there's the shameless nature of the game! By the way Franko, EFC is already in the VFL, so that won't do. On what basis would you relegate a club when it has been found not guilty of doping or breaking WADA/ASADA rules?

How about a spell in the VFL Jeff?

For the sake of the game - and to appease the hate spreaders - EFC should cop losing all their points for 2013 and banned from 1st Round Draft at season's end. This would be to preserve the 'integrity' of the Finals, and allow everyone to get on with a fresh start next season.

Essendon's internal failings have been acknowledged. Hamilton, Dank, Robinson, Robson, Evans - all gone! And EFC have undertaken management overhaul as a result of their own internal and damning report on their management. However, no illegal drugs were adminstered, nor planned. EFC had strict protocols that everything must be WADA/ASADA approved. If someone violated that protocol they should be drummed out of the club and the game, whoever it was! But a witch-hunt based on speculation, innuendo, guesswork, and downright lies and slander id just not good enough and absolutely un-Australian. Your support for Caro is very revealing as it seems you too do not believe in natural justice, nor that the guilty must be proved to have committed a crime before being punished. Sloppy management you say, or in your words "internal failings" is very different to intent. If "internal failings" is the ground for bringing the game into disrepute, what about all the clubs whose management has produced a "loss" on their balance sheets? In business that is called "financial mismanagement" and if there was "intent" it would be called "fraud". Where there is intent and guilt in mismanagement then there must be a punishment, but obviously you do not believe in this principle which has been a basis for natural justice upon which western civilization was built. So, what's the alternative? Back to the jungle, survival of the fittest, and maybe in that environment the black swan may find it too difficult to survive.

Not prepared to speculate.

Phil, I fear that the media whip up, innuendo, slander etc is creating a generation of hate. I hate drugs. I believe drug cheats should be exposed and should be banned and driven from the sport. I believe that coaches who create illegal PED programs should likewise be driven from the sport. However, EFC, it's players and officials have been cleared of these illegalities. Was there someone else 'doping' and 'lying' and conducting 'illegal' activities I guess will have to wait for the final report as it's not in the interim report. So what are we left with? A public whipped up, stirred up, enraged on the basis of innuendo etc on alleged "bringing the game into disrepute". What's the result? A culture of hate and believing the worst about others rather than allowing natural justice to take place - innocent until proven guilty, punish the guilty, acquit the not guilty. But no! Caro cs have created a culture of hate and this is what has brought football into disrepute. Such journos should be held accountable for they have caused stress, depression, hate (I know of cases in EFC members where there is medical treatment being given) - what will be their legal redress? That's why I say that they have created a generation of hate and that's why the AFL must allow natural justice and not just its own pride to be the dictating force. An avid enemy of Essendon - for more than 30 years - Leigh Matthews - gave a great analysis of the situation in his comments about the AFL seeking a 'scapegoat'. For the AFL's sake, I hope they don't, as they will bring the game into disrepute and help create a generation with a culture of hate worse than anything else we have seen to this point. Let it end today, otherwise it will be the start of a terrible generation.

In your view, what "whack" does Essendon deserve?

Clearly this is not sinking in, ASADA can only penalise individuals who have breached doping regs. It is only the AFL that can impose club sanctions.

The sources clearly do not want to be revealed, this may be hard for you to comprehend, but it is quite a standard practice....if you have a read through today's paper you'll notice a few more articles where the source is not revealed. It is quite sad that you consistently, and personally, attack Caroline Wilson for reporting on a drugs program run at essendon during Hird's reign as head coach. Blaming the media for essendon's own internal failings, is pretty desperate.