RATHBONE: Athletes are just people, so why expect them to be role models?

I don't think you are arguing against the position Ben has taken. I actually agree with you that hero-worshipping sports stars simply because they are famous is wrong. But I referred to Ben because he posted an article some weeks back about the realisation that he personally was in a position to give back to the community and inject some positivity into the game following all last year's upheaval around misconduct of players. It's sad Hunt, who was made a leader in the team and was a player that his teammates looked up to has done the exact opposite through a decision he regrets. He certainly had the capacity to be a great role model within the community, and not just the opportunity.

http://www.theroar.com.au/2015/03/07/never-forget-sailor-says-drugs-will-haunt-hunt-for-life/ from Del: Everywhere he has been, whether it is AFL or rugby in France, he has been a really good ambassador

Clyde, Your post and the posts in this blog have caused me to question some of my views about rugby union. I was drawn to rugby union in the amateur days where I looked up to the off field activities of some of the players - doctors , students, and even scrap metal workers. I admired the genius of George Best, but accepted that he was just a soccer player with an alcohol problem. I liked watching soccer, but rugby union was special to me because I admired its players so much. Now rugby union is big business, I suppose I need to forget those views and see it more as Hollywood entertainment, where stories about the rise and fall of celebrities gets more interest than off-field achievements and good causes. Also I suppose this might attract young people into the sport, drawing them in by the seduction of the fame and rock’n’roll lifestyle. I’m old school and perhaps that’s why I have started tuning out.

Thanks for the clarity adjustment. On reflection, my preoccupation with recent events has Influenced my thinking. The issue of athletes as role models is almost a red herring. Everyone is a role model. Athletes often have a wider audience that they may influence through their behaviour, but everyone who interacts or is simply around other people models behaviour (good, bad or ugly). Is it unfair to place additional pressure on this in prominent roles? No, they make choices have opportunities and however they choose to act, others will see and ignore, emulate or condemn. It's part of the human condition. We are social animals and most of us modify our behaviour to fit in with the group with which we feel the greatest affinity. So it's not a case of saying athletes are just people not role models. They are, not because of what they do, but because of their being human. The key difference is the potential reach of their audience. Yes corporations want athletes to conform to some artificial ideal. Corporations try to influence everything to maximise profit. If an individual behaved like a corporation I would be telling my kids this is not a healthy set of behaviours to adopt. I educate myself and my kids about the pitfalls of advertising, so why wouldn't I talk to them about the behaviour of athletes who I admire while they are in the field? I'll use the example of Carmichael Hunt because it is convenient. I'll ignore the broader societal issues around drug acceptance and use. Mr Hunt did something objectively wrong in law. He acknowledged the mistake, didn't make it anyone else's problem and has accepted the consequences and is moving on. I don't condone what he did but I do admire and hope I would have the courage to face up to my actions in such circumstances. Carmichael Hunt intentionally or not has role modelled good behaviour in this. I know going from the general to the specific is a risky and error prone strategy but I'm trying in my ham fisted way to show that everyone is a role model, some with broader audiences, and we all still have personal choices about what behaviours we see are worth emulating. (I hate typing in my phone, it's difficult to reread and edit). In conclusion Mr Speaker, ladies and gentlemen. Yes athletes are role models, but we all bear responsibility for our own behaviour.

Thanks for the article Clyde. Very thought provoking -again. In a previous article (Does sport really warrant our reverence?) a comment suggested you could swap the terms "professional athlete" with anyone who is required to devote an enormous amount of time to learning their craft in order to achieve success eg a surgeon. I would suggest you could do the same thing in this article (notwithstanding healthcare is more a fundamental human right than being entertained by sport, and also an athlete serves their master in a much more public domain than most surgeons) The answer to the question re being a role model then hinges on the word "professionalism". It is clear that "professionalism" encompasses more than simply demonstrating competency in a unique skill set. Everyone expects a surgeon to be highly skilled in the same way they expect a professional athlete to be highly skilled wrt athleticism. But professionalism is more than this. It, like a "role model" is difficult to define. However, it is sometimes stated as "the habitual and judicious use of communication, knowledge, technical skills, clinical reasoning, emotions, values, and reflection in daily practice for the benefit of the individual and community being served". It is also stated professionalism is a form of societal contract. It is just as naive to think that a high IQ individual eg a surgeon, is any more likely to demonstrate high emotional intelligence with moral fortitude than someone who is gifted with athletic prowess. Surgeons, like athletes, do need a rational self interest to remain licensed to practice. However, most would also view their work as more than simply delivering profits to corporations - even though medicine too is a very lucrative business from which many individuals and corporations generate large amounts of income. In fact they are bound to such a societal contract by virtue of their professionalism Whether professional athletes like it or not, and irrespective of whether they are fallible human beings or simply primates like everyone else, their role as "professionals" is bound with responsibilities one of which includes being a role model. This is made more difficult by performing in the public eye, and is often unfair as the public expectation may exceed their capacity to meet public perception. They could, of course, just remain "athletes" rather than "professional athletes"

That's the truth right there ,personally I don't think most sports people are good role models at all but the way our society ticks that's exactly how kids see them so like it or not you are role models no matter what parents say to the contrary.

Clyde, Of course you're right to say that athletes are people, and subject to all the usual frailties. In addition they are generally very young, immature people, who are highly paid and generally the focus of ego boosting adulation, both from within and from outside their protective microcosms. We cannot, therefore, expect them not to make mistakes, and when they do make them, they generally go large! In general I'm amazed that so many of these young blokes stay on the straight and narrow; at least to external appearances... The problem is that the athletes you are talking about are professionals. Yes, this means that they get the money, and have to sign and adhere to contracts, but is also brings with it the obligation to act in a professional manner. Like Doctors, and Lawyers, and Teachers, there are certain aspects of behaviour that Professional Athletes are obliged to uphold. Doctors and Lawyers are obliged to act in the best interests of their patients and client respectively. Teachers are not allowed to cross certain professional boundaries with their students. When they transgress these obligations, they are generally hauled before their governing bodies to account for their actions. If they are found to be in beach of their professional obligations they are punished, and if it is a criminal matter they are referred to the police. The excuse that they were not aware of their professional obligations, or would prefer not to be subject to them clearly does not wash in these circumstances. Similarly professional athletes can be held accountable; because they are professionals. If they snort cocaine In the toilet of a popular restaurant, and they are caught, they will be judged and punished! Not knowing that it's a problem, or preferring that it wasn't won't excuse them at that point. That's not to say that athletes need to be automatons. They can stand up for a cause and not be discredited. In the same way that Doctors, and Lawyers and Teachers stand up for forests, so to can Professional Athletes. Some of the cases you quote are perfect examples. But if they come out of the toilet still cleaning the white powder off from under their nose; all bets are off...

I reckon it's a cultural thing. In this neck of the woods, humility is rated an admirable trait - those that aren't are usually for the chop via the tall poppy cutter.

I'm sure we'd all prefer they be genuine good buggers, like Pocock, McCaw etc, but some just are not - as is to be human. But in the least, if they agree to the big dollars that come along with the trappings of pro sport , then like it or not, athletes must be law-abiding. If we strip this back, this is actually a simple employment issue. If I publicly disgraced the company I worked for, I'd be down the road.

I had Ben Johnson and mike Tyson. They were awesome role models. Legends

its naïve to think that this incident will affect the ARU and their sponsorship anymore than Hunt missing games - which was the Red's choice.

Misbehaviour from league stars means nothing for dollars.... Misbehaviour from NFL or NBA stars means nothing for revenue... Football players, cricketers.... The list goes on and on- it is a complete misnomer that this impacts on money. People with a moral high ground roll this argument out every time- means nothing. .... And on a side note- have a look at Hunt's punishment from the courts- quite obviously means nothing in society either. I missed jury duty and received a similar fine

Totally agree Clyde...

Clyde Rathbone: Bollaux. Everyone is 'just people' so why expect anyone to be a role model? Because your chosen field is in the public eye and that's what pays for your massive wage. If you sign up to that, then you sign up to staying clean. I did 14 years as an officer in HM forces, and I was paid more for being an officer. That meant following the rules and certain standards, beyond what is expected of 'Joe Public' or even non-officers. In my opinion if you can't follow the rules of your job, get a new job, take the (massive) pay cut. My money as a rugby supporter shouldn't go to pay for you (and your friends) illegal drug habit. Even in his contrite I'm sorry the slap on the wrist really really hurt interview he was on the stuff! ;-) http://www.espnscrum.com/PICTURES/CMS/43800/43859.jpg

Fair enough mate, as I've said before in this forum everyone is entitled to their opinions, because people speak from different experiences. I just like to understand how people or why people have come to that conclusion. This subject was always going to have polarising views and opinions. I definitely understand where you're coming from though.

No, No & No, You can spin whatever financial streams you want to equalize your argument regarding the revenue of boxing as an individual sport. Elite boxing has promoters, they collaboratively work together with both the TV networks & the boxers in dictating the financial/sponsor landscape. The foundation of your campaign vehemently starts with the immoral issue, his/her behavior is the cause of sponsorship decline is just a by-product of your argument. The axe you’re grinding is with flawed athletic individuals, it just so happens and Manny (tax evasion) & Floyd (domestic violence) are going against your logic. From your logic wouldn’t it make sense for a multinational company or TV network to take a moral stand as you would suggest of the QRU & ARU, against the Nevada boxing commission or any other sanctioning body as not to support these flawed Boxers from getting it on? If so what do you think will be the reaction of the millions of boxing fans around the world would be?

Morning Nick, in South Africa there is much less "Public Profile" for players. Their personal lives remains mainly from oublic scrutiny. It is very seldom that they get in the news, perhaps because apart from DSTV (our paychannel) our marketing of sport etc is very low profile. Hence my opinion that kids (especially in SA) has an innocence when it comes to their adoration of sprtsmen and women.

Carlos and Smith were role models for many young people of less than pale complexion bugger the crowd and sporting establishment .Athletes get bazzillions of bucks to go with all the good stuff that fame brings so they should at least keep their noses clean . If they accept the money and adulation then being a decent human being isnt such a burden surely ?

Great article as usual Clive. There are a few different issues. All famous people are role models in the sense that young people (particularly) who admire them are likely to try to emulate them. The Kardashians are, unfortunately, role models for a lot of young women. Another question is whether people in that position should be held to different standards of behaviour. If they are to behave as role models, what does that entail? Views will obviously differ. For my part a sporting (or other) role model would be a really hard working team player who also intelligently engaged with trying to make the world a better place. I don't give a proverbial if they have a snort or two in the off season. Then there is the question of contractual and other obligations to employer and sponsors, which is a different question altogether and may conflict with being a role model (eg choosing not to flog fast food or chaining self to bulldozer to prevent mining).

And that is where the confusion comes. I'd say most people (boo-hooing the role model ideal) and the media, use the term role model fairly loosely, generally with the implication, that it encompasses all aspects of their life. I'd be surprised if the people who have footy players as their role models, really want to emulate every aspect of their (role model's) life. You take aspects thereof. e.g. Shane Warne, cricket of a generation on the field, idiot off it. That wouldn't stop me from saying look at these video's of him playing cricket.