Roar owners dodge financial bullet

Spot on Waz. I'd like to add that while cutting a player like Broich would save money in the short term, it would also reduce revenue over the medium term as people want to see star players and quality football, both of which he brings to the table. This increases crowds and over the longer term increases TV rights. Following that approach by cutting the highest paid players puts you on a slippery slope back to amateur football and is not a solution. Same applies to coaching staff and other back room staff, all of whom are there to enable the quality and hence the value of the product to increase. Obviously there is a big caveat here though that average players shouldn't be overpaid (looking at you Matt Mackay) and back room staff need to be bringing in more value (over the long term at least) than they cost.

RBBA, surely anyone inclined to leave and play in any of the leagues that you mentioned would be almost equally likely to do so regardless of an incremental pay increase here or not? If they are going to get offered a better overall package (including accounting for the intangibles that Fuss mentioned) then they would probably go for it. Most A-League players are well paid, all things considered and none are terribly underpaid because of the minimum wage protection in place. I'm sure that they would love to get paid more, just like everyone else, but that $ has to come from somewhere and it just isn't there at the moment.

we need a mix of owners for Roar, several willing to lose a bit each. That's what Bakrie Group said they were striving for, but can we believe them?

Fair enough & thanks. Fans forum? Roar? right There are not many details around on the web. Roar have contributed a lot to FFA teams, like 7 women I think to the national womens team, plus 3 or 4 to the youth team. That ought to draw a bonus from FFA, but instead it usually is a penalty due absence on international duties as FFA still doesn't break the A League for FIFA international. Anyway, I'm proud of our women and follow them as much as I can.

No. Roar kept that in house. Several other clubs have the affiliation model but Roar are one of three to own their W League team. At the last fan forum the figure given for the cost of travel/accomodation for the team was something like $380k each season (I forget the exact figure as they gave both the NYL and W-League travel figures, one was $380k a season and the other slightly less). Someone might correct me but only three HAL teams own their respective A League team - Roar, Victory and Wanderers? Plus City now next season

RBB - you're making some valid points but when it comes to Roar you're making some generalist statements about their expenses that's frustrating me as a Roar member. Your arguement seems to be Roar can't afford McKay and Broich as marquees. Well as a paying full season member I would hope they can and I think you need to look at other cost areas as well: * Roar run a W-League team costing $500k+ a season, why? Most other clubs don't. * Roar have double the travel/accomodation costs of VIC/NSWs teams - that's about a $450k penalty each season; why don't the FFA subsidise travel to equalise the league? * Stadium rental in QLD is way more expensive than southern states - MVFC would NOT make a profit if they had to pay the same stadium fees as Roar (who pay $3m/season). So It's not down to "better management" at MVFC, it's down to cheaper stadium rent ... and Victory could afford to poach Berisha NOT because they are run better BUT because they get a better stadium deal. * Roars losses last year were $500k operating and $900k for the ACL participation ($1.4m - figures given at the fan forum) so take out ACL and tweek just one of the above and they're at breakeven. Most HAL clubs losing money could be made profitable but I would be amazed if it were as simple as tweaking the one thing so we need a more holistic approach to this topic

SFC = losing money City = losing money Mariners = losing money Jets = losing money ($1m) Nix = losing money Perth = losing money Roar =losing money City, SFC and Perth are supported by wealthy owners. That shouldn't be a problem .... inless they go the way of Tinkler and the Bakries

I thought the Roar W League team is an affiliate only, and is owned/funded by Football Qld.

Don't see too much wrong with WSW, MVFC, SFC, City and Adelaide. Perth are ok. They were just silly with their salary cap. Wellington seem to be stumbling along. I've always felt CCM's problems are overstated. They're rumoured to be folding or relocating every couple of months. Still waiting for it. Newcastle and Brisbane at the moment seem to be the only two blatantly problematic clubs. Unfortunately they used to have about 25k members combined. I think they're barely at 10k now. That's a big blow.

I definitely agree with you RBBA that Brisbane Roar have made some mistakes, with the re-signing of Mat Mackay as marquee using their entire marketing budget being possibly the best example. However there have been plenty of people calling for the clubs to spend more on players who will get people through the gate as well which is exactly what they were trying to do. It's not as simple as getting rid of Broich (or not signing him in the first place) because he's an expensive player. That would have a negative impact on revenue as he is popular and part of the 'brand' that BR try to project. Performances on the pitch would possible suffer as well and we all know that crowds are better for a winning team. All clubs, like businesses in general, have to manage a difficult balancing act between reducing costs and increasing income which costs money up front, hopefully for a longer term pay off. Having extensive experience in doing that myself (outside of football) I can attest to how difficult it can be to get that balance right. Sometimes what you think will be money well spent ends up generating nothing and there are never any guarantees. Fans are always quick to suggest that teams give away tickets to kids, reduce prices, spend more on marketing etc as well, all of which are hits to the club bottom line in the short term. If you were to make the argument that the FFA requirements for NYL are excessive and it should be scrapped, then I think we could definitely find some common ground there. I wouldn't call it mismanagement, but it is a big drain on resources.

If one or two clubs were struggling and the others not then that would suggest possible mismanagement as the cause, but when almost all the clubs are struggling to one degree or another then that suggests a tough operating environment to me. I also can't buy the line that the administrators of all (or even most) A-league clubs are incompetent. If it was that simple then it would have been easily solved already.

"I know Brisbane Roars debt is at least 2-4 Million dollars. Although it is probably a lot more than that." How do you know Brisbane's debt level? Have you seen their Balance Sheet? I'd be surprised if any ALeague club has significant debt - at least not bank debt. The owners may have pumped lots of money into the club, but that would, most likely, be regarded as equity; not debt.

The firmer local owners were just as bad as the Bakries to be honest, not as unpopular but ...

I believe QEII is owned by the City not State government although the problem remains the same - lack of competition. Perry Park is the only option and could be redeveloped with political will. But again, would you invest in Roar right now?

Roars debt is reported at $1.5m, McKays Salary is $395k, and Broich's slightly less than that. Bes was being paid $375k which he doubled moving to Vuctory.

I guess where stadiums are numerous in a city (ie: Melbourne, Sydney, even Adelaide with CS and AO), a club can get a better stadium deal. Brisbane's problem is that Suncorp Stadium has a monopoly on suitable rectangular stadia in Brisbane. The bridge with QRU has been burned ruling out Ballymore. Perry Park would be too small. QE2 Stadium might be an alternative, but it is owned by the same people who own Suncorp Stadium - the Queensland Government (who manage the stadia via Stadiums Queensland). QE2 would also alienate Brisbane northsiders and the Sunshine Coast-based supporters who would be loathe to pay the toll for the Gateway Bridge. The best option would be to upgrade Perry Park (which is accessible from all rail lines with its proximity to Bowen Hills train station, a deal could be done with BCC to set up a small bus terminal on Abbotsford Road) and only play marquee fixtures at Lang Park (eg: Victory, Sydney). Or at least propose this - facing loss of stadium rent, the Queensland Government may come to its senses and strike a better deal for BRFC.

NIcholas Rupolo Mister Football Not more problems,just different problems. When the Coffee club was around and I entered Suncorp with 5000-8000 other punters every home game and Chris Bombolas was the chairman, I feared for the club far more than with the Bakries in charge. Bakries on reflection were a mistake if you check their record of fingers in many pies all paid for by large debts. Roar are but a small pie,with a small debt for them and they appear to be managing it the same way as their big business deals. Roar can be successful off the park in the stands and in the city of Brisbane, and it would have been if the Bakries were as rich as they appear to be with actual money in the bank and the club had been run with good ear to the ground administrators here in Brisbane rather than by remote control from Indonesia. At the end of Season 9 and going into season 10 I was upbeat about the Roar as a fan,(not knowing of course what was happening behind the scenes). We'd just won the double,Mike Mulvey was a local lads in as much as he learnt his coaching football trade in Brisbane and memberships had increased by 50% or so. "The Force" appeared to be with the Roar and it would have continued if Darth Vader hadn't taken it back in a not too unfamiliar way. Ange put the "Football Force" in place and that carried the momentum helped by Mike Mulvey. However the "Moolah Force" and the "Administrative force" have never really been out of Darth's hands' Gimme the Lasersword.

You may have been unaware that the previous owners of Brisbane Roar had directors that were also directors of The Coffee Club.

" Seems that since the Coffee Club has left and Bakrie Group have been introduced there have been more problems. " I would have thought there is a fair bit of overlap between the Coffee Club's sponsorship and the Bakrie Group taking over as owners.

I'm not at all surprised players choose ALeague over some of the leagues you mentioned. Apart from major language & cultural issues, the quality of life - at work and at home - would be more appealing locally for Aussie players. Heck, we know even foreigners have chosen ALeague over those leagues you mentioned. In fact Carrusca, Berisha, Broich, Ben Kalfallah, DelPierre etc have chosen ALeague over 2nd division leagues in Spain, Germany & France. I recall Daniel Georgievski, who played 11 UCL matches with Steaua Bucureşti in 2013/14 said MVFC provided better working conditions, training facilities & certainty of pay than he experienced in Romania.