During September 2015, NSW Premier Mike Baird announced a $1.6 billion strategy to build or upgrade a few stadiums in the next ten years, with a belief that “If you have better sports facilities and make the experience more attractive, people are more likely to come.”
This included a new 30,000-seat stadium to replace the existing Pirtek Stadium (Parramatta), planned to be finished by early 2019 at a cost of around $300 million; and a new 55,000-seat stadium at Moore Park to be built in the next decade to replace the Allianz Stadium (Sydney Football Stadium).
With regard to ANZ Stadium, given that a November 2014 Galaxy survey found that 45% preferred its upgrade compared to 29% for Allianz and 25% for Pirtek, government assistance could also bring around 25,000 fans 20 metres closer for rectangle football code games with the possibility of a retractable roof to weather-proof games.
This article, however, will argue that the evidence does not support any link between Sydney having better stadiums and bigger National Rugby League (NRL) crowds, beyond the reality that the ANZ Stadium (84,000 capacity) does successfully host large crowds for major football matches of various codes.
With regard to the NRL, 2015 Sydney crowds hardly indicate the need for bigger and better facilities.
The ANZ stadium hosted 26 NRL matches (non-finals), yet averaged just 19,178 with only two games attended by 35,000 or more.
Of Allianz Stadium (45,500 capacity), it hosted just 13 NRL matches (non-finals) at an average 15,199 with only one match above 35,000.
And of Pirtek Stadium (21,000 capacity), hosting nine Parramatta matches, it averaged 12,828.
With the exception of Belmore hosting two Canterbury Bulldogs matches at an average 17,884, and the Sydney Cricket Ground (SCG) hosting one NRL match at 18,217, the two biggest Sydney stadiums regularly used for rugby league (ANZ and Allianz) did draw the biggest average crowds.
Other average crowds for Sydney NRL grounds were Jubilee Oval (Kogarah) which hosted four matches at 12,826, Pepper Stadium (Penrith) for eleven matches 12,026, Remondis Stadium (Cronulla) hosted twelve matches at an average of 11,925, Win Stadium (Wollongong) held four matches at 11,537, Brookvale (Manly) had ten matches at 10,875, Leichhardt Oval (Balmain) with four matches at 10,488, and Campbelltown also with four matches at 9,444.
The reality is that few world cities can afford to constantly upgrade so many grounds as few have more than two or three modern and large stadiums. This includes cities in Germany, whose Bundesliga has the greatest crowd average of any soccer league (43,500 for 2014-15); and the USA where its National Football League has the highest crowd average of any sport (68,776 in 2014-15).
As it stands, Sydney ranks pretty high amongst world cities with regard to modern all-seater stadiums with three at 45,000 or higher capacity, with three other 20,000-24,000 all-seaters (Gosford, Parramatta, and Sydney Showgrounds).
The problems for Sydney NRL teams, and the AFL to a lesser extent, is that they are amongst the few major national sporting competitions where at least half of the teams reside in just one city. Sydney has nine of 16 NRL teams, and Melbourne nine of 18 AFL teams.
Even London, with its incredible array of sports stadiums, which also includes four all-seater stadiums ranging from 54,000 to 90,000 capacity, hosts just five of the 20 Premier League teams who averaged 36,695 in 2014-15.
To put it simply, Sydney is not London or Melbourne when it comes to hosting regular large weekly sporting crowds.
It never has been.
In 1980, when Sydney and Melbourne (with Geelong) hosted virtually all 6 matches per week in the then major leagues of their respective football codes, Sydney’s weekly matches averaged around 10,000 (about 60,000 total) compared to Melbourne with around 25,000 (150,000 total).
In 2015, aggregate Sydney NRL weekly attendance was similar to 1980 levels, despite much better stadiums today. In the late 1960s, Sydney’s weekly attendance was actually greater than today at around 72,000 for the 1966-1969 period.
For Melbourne, with longstanding high weekly attendance by any world city standards, the transition from club grounds to large stadiums was that much easier. In 2015, of the two stadiums that hosted Melbourne’s 2015 AFL crowds (non-finals) for nine local teams (and sometimes Geelong), the MCG averaged 48,329 for 45 matches and Docklands 28,318 for its 46 games.
Sydney is also far more difficult to get around in terms of transport when compared to Melbourne given that the MCG, Docklands and its AAMI stadium are centrally located with all railway lines running directly to such locations.
In contrast, only two of Sydney’s four major stadiums are centrally located, Allianz and the SCG, yet they still require bus transport from Central train station.
For Manly supporters alone, whose residence is north of the harbour with no close railway access, the situation is worse given that the two other major grounds, ANZ and Pirtek, are 17-23km from the CBD.
Assuming that Sydney NRL clubs agree to abandon their home grounds and better utilise a few all-seater stadiums, it would make sense for clubs to be based nearest to their suburban base, especially with regard to access to railway options. For example, with regard to the Allianz Stadium option, perhaps Manly, Sydney Roosters, St George, South Sydney and Cronulla could play some games there.
For ANZ and Pirtek, perhaps Penrith, Canterbury, and Western Tigers could play there.
But even if the above option could work with more clubs playing their home games at major stadiums, assuming rental costs are affordable, there are other major problems. For example, the NSW Waratahs rugby union side needs to be accommodated, as do State of Origin matches and possible international and domestic rugby and football matches during the season.
The other option would be, in line with my preference given the current evidence, would be to leave the system as it is. After all, the use of bigger stadiums has hardly lifted Sydney NRL crowds given that the most popular Sydney club (Canterbury-Bankstown) only averaged 19,684 for home games in 2015.
Yes, build a new Parramatta stadium. A 30,000-seat stadium would not only boost crowds for Parramatta rugby league and Western Sydney Wanderers football matches, but may also attract other NRL teams to play some or all of its matches there.
But other options for Allianz and ANZ might be overrated given that seating capacity will hardly increase in stadiums that already have good facilities (although facilities can always be improved).
After all, while a November 2014 Galaxy research survey indicate 76% support for the redevelopment of ANZ, the reality is that around 60,000 spectators already have pretty good views given that the distant upper decks only account for around 23,000 of capacity, albeit not as close as at Allianz.
As for Allianz, whether or not to rebuild it completely or upgrade to increase capacity by 10,000 is a question for NSW taxpayers. In 2010, a spokesperson for the trust operating the ground (and SCG) indicated that the “master plan allows for expansion to a capacity of about 55,000 to 60,000 by “continuing the level-one deck around to connect to the eastern and western stands”, thus “providing a continuous upper bowl”.
As of 18 September 2015, Allianz hosted 30 sporting matches for the year at an average of 18,266 (range 8,265 to 35,711).
But whether or not Sydney improves its stadiums, I doubt whether NRL crowds will get much bigger on the basis that Sydney’s sporting culture has not supported large weekly club crowds in the same way that has long existed in Melbourne with regard to the AFL.
And no amount of money can change a city’s sporting culture in the short term, especially at a time when spectators now view many matches live on television and online, which makes the task of boosting sporting crowds that much harder.
Joey Johns
Roar Guru
Didn't the GWS just have a nice oval stadium built in Western Sydney that could be used for some "hit&giggle" And we sure as hell can tell everyone to keep travelling to the SCG. And we sure as hell better keep telling them this.
BeastieBoy
Guest
People don't want transport hassles. That starts when you leave your door in Sydney. People are drawn to go by seeing a quality product, in a quality way and it's proximity to home. They also don't want to get wet along the way. They don't want a diagonal view from the corner. If they are taking kids they don't want it to cost a fortune for tickets and food and to be pushed and shoved. They don't want columns in front like SFS. How do you overcome all of this if you are a league official. How do you change Sydney people to think like Melbourne. Well it will take a generation but this is what you do. Address the issues above but also make kids tickets and the cost of food very cheap so it's a inexpensive way to give a family a outing. The families will come and the kids have the tradition ingrained in them. They then pass it on to their families and become season ticket holders.
Crosscoder
Roar Guru
Sure Bart ,and your mob give away zero.Pull the other one.
bart
Guest
The NRL give away more than 180,000 free tickets every year.
Crosscoder
Roar Guru
But crowds are supposed to attend in huge numbers ,we are constantly reminded because it is a game that has to be watched live. The point is there were freebies give out for a semi , for a team on a saturday night,with no opposition from other codes.If the clubs fanbase is so dedicated as we are constantly reminded,they sure as hell are not showing it. Since AFL has landed in Sydney in 82 ,freebies have been part of their marketing set up and the media says little.Yet the NRL is bagged when they do likewise. The Sharks have put in substantial amounts to their club grounds for starters.The NRL has already indicated they will be making a contribution toward new infrastructure,and rest assured they will not diddle the local council as happened at Blacktown. Rectangular stadiums are available for 3 football codes' usage . Will the other rectangular codes be putting in?
Damo
Guest
Agreed
clipper
Guest
Agree, ANZ should've always been rectangular - it's not the Swans area, the fans don't even like going out there. That is obvious from the semi crowd, even though it is a low drawing team and tickets were double the price of NRL one's. Don't think they were the first or only ones to give out free tickets - saw quite a few freebies offered for the first week of finals for the easts game. Indeed the outlying clubs should push for grants, like GWS - providing they offer to put something in as well, like GWS and even the AFL did at the SCG. How much has the NRL offered so far for all these upgrades?
Crosscoder
Roar Guru
No AR if these outlying clubs can secure private funding ,they should be able to secure State govt grants .They will play 12 games per year and in fact there may be more games such as a league in the off season . If its good enough for GWS who use it for half a dozen there abouts on their patch of dirt,then the outlying NRL clubs have a far better argument in RL heartland.The state Govt hardly benefits form the Showgrounds.
Crosscoder
Roar Guru
There was no opposition on that day Clipper .The crowds have been dropping for your code since day 1 at ANZ. When ever NRL fans suggest they don;'t like ANZ as it is,you blabber on about excuses. Bit of negativity about the Swans who were giving away freebies at Cronulla shows desperation at its best. Maybe novelty night is becoming a thing of the past. At 10am on the Esplanade at North Cronulla last Wednesday,after walking within a couple of mates,there were about half a dozen people in Swan's attire and a couple,e of young blokes handing out tickets to the game on the side of Dunningham Park.They were there all the time, I was having coffee at the coffee lounge. No other game in town,no opposition,all teh publicity,sorry no excuses.
Crosscoder
Roar Guru
And 31,000 with freebies available at the Cronulla Esplanade near Northies on Wednesday last week, did not help boost the Swan's crowds at ANZ,with no NRL game in town to oppose.AR put on teh ignore button.
Crosscoder
Roar Guru
No AR if these outlying clubs can secure private funding ,they should be able to secure State govt grants .They will play 12 games per year and in fact there may be more games such as a league in the off season . If its good enough for GWS who use it for half a dozen there abouts on their patch of dirt,then the outlying NRL clubs have a far better argument in RL heartland.The state Govt hardly benefits form the Showgrounds.
Crosscoder
Roar Guru
Chop was correct about K Underwood,her bias is nauseating at times. Her best effort when the discussion hinged about Hayne and his NFL debut she noted in a matter of fact way"His debut in the NFL, is like a player making his first appearance in the AFL." Eyes rolled by a couple of panellists like Craddock,and the cringing could be felt from afar. Yet the telegraph announced her in the top 50 most influential people in the NRL.Nearly fell off my chair. Back on topic Facts are an updated Allianz benefits 3 codes of football not just the NRL,.ignored by some.Why the Govt did not get ANZ reconifgured to a rectangular post 2000 OPs is beyond me.The last episode where only 31,000 attended an AFL: semi involving the Swans with no other NRL game in town proves the point.And I note on Wednesday last week Swan,s people were handing out free tickets on the Esplanade on Nth Cronulla beach at 10am. ANZ needs get back to a rectangular stadium with roofing if possible.Parramatta deal looks the goods. And I might add,if those outlying clubs such as the Manlys,Cronullas can get some p[rivate funding ,they should push the state Govt for grants ala GWS.They would in fact get more usage. and indeed bigger crowds than they currently secure.
Von Neumann
Roar Guru
Some of you must be dead set kidding. Forget about the nuances and focus on the trends. When clubs moved to ANZ their crowds essentially doubled. They were getting sub 10k some of these teams, and now they get closer to 20, often more and more often. Brisbane did the same upon moving/returning to suncorp/lang park. Things like scheduling and the like play a part, but they are irrelevant for this discussion, and probably have no bearing given that they can be altered. But just look at some of the grounds clubs play at right now. Some of the worst would be shark park, brookvale, penrith and jubilee oval. The whole thing about the SFS is a bit null and void. It will be getting light rail. Whether you like it or not that area is slated as an entertainment precinct. Yes, personally I figured in the perfect world they could gut the SFS and put 2 rings or seat all the way around it, but its not as simple as that, and it would be a 2nd option. It needs a new stadium, a new site almost, new dimensions, a new foundation. I am sure there will be - just like there is on here - those who will want to throw spanners into the works; but if people think crowds will not increase in time, they would be thinking with yesterday glasses and not tommorow-glasses. Surveys will not tell you this. But the number 1 reason why people do not attend sport in sydney (NRL especially) is because of the facilities. Its normalization. All the talk of ticket prices and food prices must be weighed up against desire (not sporting popularity). The facilities are a major part of that. You need to drop the *big* pieces into place first. Its /almost/ if you built it they will come. But for crying out loud they need something worth while to goto first. No....its not ideal and its a skeleton plan in some respects, but the need has been identified and money looked at and a way forged to make it happen. There's ANZ and Alliance. Two big stones you can't just brush aside. Will be better for all this. There is parramatta which everyone can thankfully universally agree upon, and there is meant to be one new stadium (up to 40k) built sometime in the future. __ My expectation is that crowds will go past a 20k average before long, about a decade (for it to all bed in). There is a large concerted effort to make this happen. I just think that too often we think of things in past terms, instead of considering how it will be. Its not a big thing. Within 20 years (hence my future glasses thing) the average may even be 30k. At the end of the day its not about averages as much as we may like to think it is. Its about the city having stadia that can compete with major events and service existing competitions. __ The whole thing, no, it may not be ideal, but its more than enough of a step in the right direction. For comparisons sake, imagine Suncorp where the SFS is right now. A lot more attractive to attend. Im not buying into the naysayers on this. Once people see it and experience it, sure its not smack bang on a major train line, but they will see the seat and probably say "I definitely would want to sit there". And you know what, as decisions come up in your life, for a big game, whatnot, you will probably (on average/compared to a suburban ground) take *up* that choice more often than not when compared to the frequency you used to decide on. People make mention of the EPL and AFL - wake up, those stadia are modern, very capable arenas. They are not shark part, brookvale, penrith ect. As I said - the whole scheme is dropping the big pieces into place. It will make waves.
Kirk
Guest
that's not going work. Broncos fans come from all over the city, not just the area around Red Hill. Brisbane really needs a second team but it seems like everyone who doesn't support the Broncos already has another team. Anyway there is a bit of buzz around the Ipswich Jets and they way they play, could be a good time to lever off that and set them up for the NRL. Problem is it's Ipswich and no one outside of Ipswich wants anything to do with the place...
Kaks
Roar Guru
only seems fair considering NRL is the biggest rugby league league, but because you have a chip on your shoulder.. US: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Major_League_Soccer_season Belgium: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014%E2%80%9315_Belgian_Pro_League http://www.worldfootball.net/attendance/bel-eerste-klasse-2014-2015/1/ Netherlands: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014%E2%80%9315_Eredivisie http://www.worldfootball.net/attendance/ned-eredivisie-2014-2015/1/
pat malone
Guest
so you use the 3 biggest leagues in the world, congrats.
clipper
Guest
Couldn't see any free tickets - might have persuaded us to brave the ANZ stadium, especially since the tickets were more than double the NRL's. Was offered some free Roosters tickets for the first week though.
GWSingapore
Guest
Perth's new stadium is costing $1.3 billion. That is a real figure based on WATreasury allocation. Sydney will get Parramatta and the SFS rebuilt and a reconfiguration of Homebush plus a roof for $1.6 billion. That will show you how far Sydney's new venue strategy will really go. Let's all serenade Mike Baird, "the answer my friend is pissing in the wind. The answer is pissing in the wind."
Chris
Guest
Sydney (and Australia) has too many Football codes, too many teams and too many stadiums.
Worlds Biggest
Guest
Yes the new Stadia and upgrades will enhance the overall experience for all patrons, this will encourage all sports fans to attend in greater numbers. It's a very wise move / investment from the Government. Sport is a huge part of our culture, we need state of the art facilities / stadiums.