To truly understand the impact Israel Folau’s words have, you need to have lived through coming to terms with yourself and coming out in a sporting environment.
I will always maintain that sport is the most accepting environment I have found, and the perception of male athletes, in particular, is by and large incorrect and unwarranted. But, occasionally, someone like Israel comes along, and we can see all too well why the stereotype we often associate with footballers developed.
It does no one any good at all. Not the 99.9 per cent of fair-minded athletes and footballers out there, and certainly not the LGBT community or members of that community participating in sport.
When I came to terms with who I was, and then tried to figure out how on earth I would come out, I was heavily ensconced in this exact environment. I was part of a national team, playing handball, a sport that requires huge amounts of aggression day in and day out.
We toured together and lived out of each other’s pockets, and of course, this brought with it exactly what you would expect when close to 20 guys go away for a couple of weeks. All the swearing, homophobic, transphobic and often sexist jokes and comments you could imagine.
I’m not pretending to be holier than thou, I was definitely a part of it because that’s just what you did, but the homophobic and transphobic comments certainly made it much more nerve-racking and difficult to come out than it otherwise would have. This would be the same with any team you can think of; it’s not confined to handball or our group of guys.
But as much as I knew these were just comments made with absolutely no malice, by people who if you asked them certainly wouldn’t actually have any negative views towards the LGBT community, it made it bloody hard. I was terrified when I came out, not just because of that; coming out is a terrifying experience anyway, but it certainly didn’t make it easier.
I have to say the support I received from everyone involved in handball, especially with those I played with, was absolutely phenomenal. But imagine being a closeted player at the Waratahs or Wallabies right now.
If coming out wasn’t going to be incredibly difficult before, Izzy has now gone and made it almost impossible for any LGBT players to be who they are while playing there. How could you when your best player, someone who carries as much influence as he does, comes out posting the videos and making the comments he has in the past months?
But from a purely sporting perspective, the impact this could have on the field and for recruiting is potentially huge as well.
When I came out in 2015, I was in Qatar representing Australia and attempting to qualify for the Olympic Games. I was as close to useless as you could possibly be. Things had reached boiling point, I couldn’t concentrate on the court, I was getting into fights with teammates – all because I couldn’t be me.
We were essentially a player short, and it’s not unreasonable to assume that anyone else in the same situation – possibly with the Waratahs or Wallabies – would have the same reaction. A team won’t work if a member feels as though they need to hide who they are just to keep the status quo and fit in.
The other area it could affect is recruiting. Imagine for a second the Waratahs were in the market for a second rower or a centre and former Welsh captain Gareth Thomas was available. Do you really think, either prior to or after he came out as gay, that he would be signing with the Waratahs?
Absolutely no chance, and as a result, you would have been missing out on one of the best players in the world, a Test captain. No team in a professional environment can afford to have their possible pool of players reduced because of issues such as this.
It’s unfortunate because at the end of the day, when you take into account all of those scenarios, it’s the fans and members who ultimately lose out. If a player can’t play at their best because the environment they’re in doesn’t allow it, it affects the team’s performance.
The same goes with missing out on a gun recruit; it’s going to impact on results, because not only do you not have a great player, you have to play against them.
So while it may on the face of it seem as though Folau airing his views may seem like an issue around freedom of speech, in a professional or elite porting environment it can have a much, much more significant impact on not just the LGBT community, but the results on the field as well.
Neil
Guest
Wow. Do you really believe that's what Christians think and want for people? Full on.
Mark
Guest
https://www.acl.org.au/pray_many_others_will_be_moved_to_join_israel_folou?recruiter_id=3606
Dan
Guest
Kinda funny when you tear faith apart with the mindset of an engineer and ask how all this is supposed to function logically. God is all powerful and all knowing, yet he creates his most intelligent life form in his image, and creates them as basically born sinners that he demands redemption from, despite by definition not really having granted them free will to make those choices in the first places (seeing as free will is incompatible with an omniscient and omnipotent prime mover). Kinda makes god sound like a bit of a Donald Trump like character...
Dan
Guest
Didn’t realise there was a bible verse on snorting cocaine... but back to your central premise, Folau may not personally harbour any ill will nor even believe god hates gays himself, but it is instructive that homosexuality is the sin he’s most obsessed with given all the other sins mentioned in the bible. There’s one passage on homosexuality and a whole lot more on things like breaking the sabbath, and yet Folau is completely obsessed with this one issues. That tells me that this he personally has serious issues on this that may be subconscious, but are certainly less charitable than he likes to claim
Suzy Poison
Guest
Thanks Hannah. You mentioned, former Welsh captain Gareth Thomas. I found this incredibly moving video online, about Gareth coming out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFeo2epi-Lw It shows how the Welsh rugby team supported Gareth and the Welsh nation supported him, coming out. I would hope that Australians would behave the same way in the same situation. Please understand that the small minded Israel Folau and his misguided religious supporters are in the minority. They do not speak for Australia and they do do not represent our views.
Ruckin Oaf
Guest
Hey Jaf, Yeah and ?
Tragic
Guest
Todays society, media? Are all out to save face against supposed non politically correct opinions. Life isn't lived that way but those who choose an alternative lifestyles and the better than everyone else brigade like to think so. Israel Falou has his opinion based on Christian values, part of Australian culture. The fact he did it on an open media source is how it is in this day and age. WHere the puratism and holier than thou comes from is a reality show circus. Australians are known for taking the piss, sledging, not taking things all to seriously, larrikins if you wish. Is this a tipping point where people shouldn't be vilified because they don't conform to an unrealistic politically correct value? Good on you Israel stick by you beliefs and opinions , I wish more would.
rebelpirate
Guest
Let it be. It's been flogged to death. I will say this; Folau has every right to express his views. There's a lot of bible bashers who aren't qualified to critique the verses, especially when you don't believe in a God. So what is it to you who does and doesn't go to hell? Folau is not inciting hate. He's expressing his beliefs and struggle with same sex marriage. A lot of Christians are. That doesn't mean we would go out to hurt the LGBT community. I have close friends and family who are LGBT. While I don't agree with their way of life I respect them and treat them equally. I celebrate and support their relationship as best I can. My wife and I recently supported the migration of a friend's partner to Australia. It's the same for many Christians. The Waratahs and Australian Rugby is in a bad state. There's no way to confirm that Folau's comments contributed to their horror performance against the Lions. Look at the Reds; Last week they slew the Lions and yesterday they were mauled by the Sunwolves! There's no corelation there Hannah! Australian Rugby needs to come out of the closet and admit that it's no longer a top tier 1 nation. We're a LOWER TIER 1/TOP TIER 2 rugby nation. Lastly, I am not comfortable with Transgender etc from male to female playing in women's sports competition. At the end of the day you have developed the physique and strength to compete against men. I would be worried if my daughter or wife competed against you. Before they've stepped onto the field they are already at a disadvantage. While's it's great that transgenders get to play at the top level, there needs to be more thought put into this for women's welfare. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
Joe
Guest
Frankly I'm sick and tired of all the bleating. Izzy stated his view and as far as I'm concerned he's entitled to say what he likes. He hasn't poked anyone in the eyes or taken anyone out in the air. Nothing against gays but this is becoming far too pervasive for my liking. Live and let live on both sides.
Ruckin Oaf
Guest
My limited understanding is that the DNA we are born with isn't necessarily the DNA that we'll die with
Jaf
Guest
Really? Because popular opinions are not always the truth.
Ralph
Guest
The details would be interesting Mr Oaf.
MH01
Guest
Identity politics and virtue signalling - it’s not even a discussion - it’s an agenda you cannot question or else you will be labelled as x and y . Same crap happens in media everywhere . Does anyone actually believe men’s sport is free of homophobic slurs - poor naive people that live in bubble and have never heard of sledging .... thankfully majority of the community , straight or gay have enough common sense to comprehend intent . It’s the snowflakes who have agendas , it’s not about common sense - it’s agenda politics
MH01
Guest
The low point is “expert” status on the roar. Based on what ? Making a switch .... this is getting ridiculous
Ruckin Oaf
Guest
Hey Ralph, People have been sacked for making comments that had nothing to do with their employer. (Michael Nolan comes to mind) I've worked for a couple of organisations that feel you cross the line if you are identifiable as belonging to that organisation when you make comment. In the case of Folau it's pretty much impossible for him (at this time) not to be associated with the ARU.
Ralph
Roar Guru
I think if you read my posts I never took the position that employees have absolute freedom. What I said was, if the don't speak about their employer, if they don't speak about the business or the employees. If they don't represent the company when they are speaking. If they speak on their own time in their own social media avenues and on their own behalf. Which I think was a lot of qualifiers. I think you over state RA position on justice after death. Personally, I doubt the organisation has any position on the matter, let alone a strong opinion. I am also on record as suggesting businesses shouldn't really get into politics, as it really has very little to do with why they exist. Limited liability companies as a legal structure were created as a vehicle to allow risk financial taking for the benefit of society. Not as political soap boxes. That's just my opinion of course.
Ralph
Roar Guru
No problems, I choose not to take offence Sage, I just thought you might be playing the man. Apologies if I was mistaken. I would point out that a thing can be true and not literal. There is such a thing as metaphorical truth. When we say, 'it raining cats and dogs out there', we don't mean there are literally animals falling from the sky, but that doesn't detract from the truth of the statement that the rain is very hard. So I don't have any problems not taking such things as insects on arks at a literal level, because it wasn't meant to be understood in that way. I would also venture the idea that things that are unseen can also be true. Otherwise a concept like courage has no meaning. I respect everyones freedom to live whatever way they want, but in the same sentence don't believe every choice is a wise choice. As for genetics, it clearly has some affect of many things. But the core of one side of this debate is really that to say *anything* about gay is to attack something sacred. Which is why some feel it is mean and hurtful. Which I don't think is a factually correct position. I might be genetically predisposed to stealing, but society finds that unacceptable. Simply to say that if a thing is *not* sacred then it should be open to discussion and not ring fenced away from discussion. Respect to you as well.
Mark Richmond
Roar Guru
Sorry PeterK, their DNA is not necessarily identical.... https://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/11/health/11real.html
Lroy
Guest
You admit that you engaged in sexist homophobic banter yourself.... Looks like it didnt cause you any long term harm... I think thats the key point about people claiming to be being offended.... So what? Nothing happens. The earth doesn't spin of its axis...polar bears dont spontaneously combust, Kevin Rudd doesnt suddenly appear in the latest Star Wars movie to scare the children..... Thats right, Nothing happens ;-)
Spectator
Guest
Of course none of this matters. What matters is the predicament RA finds itself in ahead of the June tests, the contract renewal, the potential switch to the Christian Reds ( somebody tell QC to get baptised) and the 2019 RWC. This is what IF doesn't get. His wife has let headstrong views impact on her relationship with her employers. Long socks and advertising. It's a very 'complex' issue as the Castle points out and if IF continues to tweet his right to free speech then things will change and that would be a shame for both IF and RA. Possibly IF won't realise this until later in life because he is a good man but a green man and he can't see that he can't win and still maintain his until now peerless standing in the rugby community. Interesting though that Pocock can triumph the cause of gay marriage and not suffer the slings and arrows. I mean, he's outspkoen too, but the stakeholders buy into his argument. You cannot tell gay people not to be gay. Not publicly, and keep your job. IF can go to NRL. They'd give Satan a second chance.