Why Brisbane City should be in the A-League

Fadida Roar is on above par regards fair weather fans when compared to other clubs: Mariners premiers 2011/12 & champions 2012/13, bottom 2016-17-18, Crowds from 10100 down to 7200 Jets top end of table 07/08 and 17/18, bottom end of table 16/17 Crowds down from 14200 & 12,560 to 8650 AU average crowd 14156 in 2015/16 when they won the double, dropped to 9565 and 9830 in 16/17 and 17/18 when they dropped down the table. You'll find the same with most clubs, crowds increase when they win and drop in losing years. As Waz's figures show, Roar has been fairly consistent until season 2017/18. There are a number of reasons for the crowd drop last season, one of them being results but not solely.

Waz If Roar can't see what it has done to lose fans then we have a much bigger problem than I thought. Win/loss is part of the formula, only part not all. Roar has to get back to good management, on and off the field, and it seems to be on that path, but it has a lot of ground to recover.

Fadida, to validate your argument you need to compare to other clubs in the A League. I'm sure you'll find that Roar is on par with other clubs re attendance and win/loss record. Take the Jets, for example, whose crowds have reached record levels this past season with more wins. In their losing years their attendance figures were way down on last season's. MV's crowds were way down last season when they were losing, and came good with a few wins. Same as WSW.

Excellent thanks for the response and I did indeed complete your survey. As a staunchly North side resident Perry park would be the dream but theres no way I'd switch from Roar. If you grew up a United supporter and then moved to the Eastern part of the City you wouldnt become a city supporter, youd just do the travel to Old Trafford for matches. Hopefully this stadium does happen. Hopefully it is good for public transport, and a little entertainment precinct is created around it. If that all happens, the trip out for game days could be a fun little adventure. As far as a second team goes, it needs to be the 15th or 16th team in due course, and it needs to be played out of a redeveloped Perry Park. If by that time Roar have come to own the South side of the City, a north side team could create a decent point of difference. Regarding Roar as it stands, I think they are on the up. An academy and training base is very promising. A trophy sometime soon to consolidate the good work would be very helpful.

“Brisbane Gladiators” right-ho ?

lol. That’s the project jb. It’s becoming bigger than Ben Hur but a definite necessity ?

Waz - If the project you speak about concerns individuals like Simon Boegheim and Peter Eddy I am aware of what they are doing,having spoken to both of them recently. I have a copy of a program I produced and wrote back in 1982 to "celebrate" Lions 25 years in existence. The info contained therein took many,many hours of investigation (and argument) but to the best of my knowledge is as near the facts as it was possible to asses at the time. Cheers jb.

I am keeping a close eye on city's bid. If they get up and do not just turn into Brisbane Azzurri but actually do as they promise and have a Brisbane club identity then I will support them.

I can’t tell you much - I don’t know which party is behind it (I will guess the LNP but I don’t know for sure) but it’s linked to the next federal election, so presumably a possibly vote-winning package? The Roar Supporters Federation were asked to consult our members and assertain their views on Suncorp and options for a new stadium; we did this via online survey receiving 600 responses which were just processing now. So I’d say it’s not even at concept stage yet but at least it’s on the political agenda (I would hope the club and FQ have been engaged more heavily than we have tbh)

jb. There is a project running to map both Roars history and football in Queensland (you’ll know the individuals concerned). If you’ve any interest in participating let me know: wazsere@yahoo.com

Here’s the Suncorp season averages: 2018 - 9,400 2017 - 13,892 2016 - 12,850 2015 - 11,660 2014 - 14,957 2013 - 13,417 2012 - 13,387 2011 - 9,279 Arguably we’re back where we started at 2011’s level. The truth is we can’t seem to grow crowds full stop (this is a League-wide problem as well), we sit around 13,000 and go up or down from there. We need to get 13k median to 16k somehow ...

Fadida - As an outsider to this city you are perhaps at a disadvantage. We have to go back in time to decide where City and Roar belong in geographical terms. Due to an attempt by the then ruling body,the QSF, to raise money, both teams were ordered to play their NSL home games at Perry Perk. (Perry Park had come to football under great expectations but soon the money ran out and the ground was never finished.) This arrangement suited City, for their own leased ground at Newmarket was nothing more than a local council ground,suitable for training but little else. However Lions did not take kindly to this "order' for they already had their own ground out in the Western Suburbs of Brisbane which for 3 years lay idle while the club served it's Perry Park "sentence" City on the other hand moved into action and used the 3 seasons to upgrade their facilities at Newmarket building a grandstand and terraces,and at the end of the 3 season "mandate",both teams couldn't get out of Perry Park quick enough. So by 1988 both teams , City and Lions,were playing at their own grounds,miles apart, but more significantly both had been dumped out of the NSL and were no longer in the national football scene. It is now we enter a grey area for with both teams playing localised football only, some of the "glamour" of national competition had gone from Brisbane. Come 2005 and nominations were called for to commence a professional football league and the silence from Queensland was measurable with only one "identity " showing any interest and that was a Brisbane Lions organisation decimated by behind the scenes goings on. For some reason or other a management team far removed from the former Dutch families was set up and, to cut a long story short, Lions were granted entry but not under that name, using the new name Brisbane Roar. Over the next 13 years much success was achieved on the field but that success could not be attributed to club management, for almost annually there were changes going on at all levels of governance,in management personnel,coaching,and geographical situation. . The rest is HAL history with which you are well versed but suffice to say there is still a team called Qld Lions playing out in Western Brisbane and City who would best be described as Inner North Brisbane. Cheers jb.

Please see above LH to realise the "nonsense" is actually a valid argument.

Roar crowds were averaging around 14k for each of the proceeding 2-3 seasons LH. In each of those seasons they were a big chance of challenging for the title. This season it was all doom and gloom before the season even began. It was clear straight away they were going to struggle. Average crowd 9k, though crowds did pick up at the end as they started to win. Is that not evidence enough of "fair weather" fans??

Waz, in a previous article you alluded to a stadium for Roar on the south side being potentially in the works. Can you elaborate?

I’d hope Roar as a club would be supportive of any second team coming in, and the AAFC’s plan for a second division and eventually pro-rel. City though won’t garner grassroots support from many local clubs, my kids junior club has 1,600 kids playing in it and we’re only 9Km away from City and there’s no love lost between us. City’s reputation in junior football is not a good one. Then you get to NPL level and will fans of clubs like Strikers and Lions and Pen Power support City? Highly unlikely imo. So where are City going to draw their fans from? The answer to that has to be mobilising the hundreds of thousands of football people in the city - Roars got about half (75,000 ish) but can City galvanise the rest?? AFL stuffed up with the Suns, it just weakened Lions; NRL has tried and failed and is now actively avoiding a second team in Brisbane. So there’s lessons there from other codes too. And yeah, of course Ballymore might work but can you imagine getting there for a 6.50 Friday kick off. Or worse still getting home after a game finishes at 9 PM? And I just can’t imagine going there in heavy rain. But we need football infrastructure in this city, if football gets funding Ballymore loses out, if Ballymore gets it football loses out. That’s the stark choice. $60m would transform Perry Park. That’s what we need imo.

I'm pleased you're back Waz, a pity you didn't come in earlier with some of the nonsense fired above. We've disagreed about Ballymore before, and I admit I haven't been there since 1969. But you make a good point here that if there is money available to help build a football home in Brisbane, the opportunity would be lost if Ballymore gets the $$. I would prefer an inner city option - and there is room if there is a will and that's where the work's needed. Brisbane, or QLD anyway, has to have a second team. With a population greater than 5mil it's got to happen. I wouldn't be too hard on City, they've been very friendly to Roar over the years but seem to be on the receiving end of it since they announced their bid. Roar needs to fix Roar - rebuild our identity and work to our culture, stick with a couple of young players (local if possible) and plan their future, start with some friendlies at Logan and build an atmosphere for those games (like Olympic does apparently) and do it on academy home days occasionally. There's a lot Roar has to do to build its support base - whingeing about potential other clubs in Brisbane isn't one of then, lest they've already lost.

The irony is the author professes to be a Roar supporter but says he would switch to City if they came in but then admits he’s not sure who he’d support between Olympic and City. Have we found the problem with some football “fans” in Brisbane? And how long before the author - and others - switch allegiance once again, maybe to the cricket bucket heads next time?? Roar have averaged 14k in their A League history, comparable with any other club bar Victory. The question is - is there room for two teams in the city? I don’t know the answer to that but unfortunately I doubt it Ballymore is an awful location, it just is. Local transport can cope with crowds of between 5-7,000 with only normal delays getting home. Bigger crowds will clog and swamp roads, rail and busses. And when it rains the hill we all love so much will close, thems the H&S rules. And if $60m is given to upgrade Ballymore what chance has football got of getting investment for football stadia in the next couple of decades? Nil, zero and none - yet City are prepared to sell out football for their own selfish needs and will be shunned by large swathes of the football community as a consequence (they’re already the least popular club in the city as it is .... they will not find popular support in the city - and certainly not from Lions/Strikers base, both north of the river themselves and both with A League aspirations). Perry Park has to be upgraded, Roar have to be part of that equation or it wont work financially, and whether Strikers, Roar and City all share the place doesn’t matter - football needs a home What I can agree with the author on, is Olympic FC .. it’s proving an excellent outing.

Admittedly I've got my NRL goggles on here, can't really speak for Lions/Suns rivalry but again Suns sort of fall into 2nd team status for me

Roar have given me too many unforgetable moments, and City were always the team-to-beat/silver tails of Brisbane junior football to ever consider jumping ship. That said, it would create a genuine Brisbane/qld rivalry which wouldn't really exist outside football (I mean, sure there's the Broncs/Cowboys/Titans rivalry, but really Nqld/Titans are the 2nd/3rd favourite team, all the players are fairly matey, NSW/Sydney present the real enemy there), and for that reason I kind of hope City gets in, realistically though I think Wollongong/Sydney III/Melbourne III will present better options