Sometimes you hear something said in a post-match press-conference and its true meaning isn’t immediately clear.
There’s no doubt professional coaches have become very good at using the media for their advantage – and there’s equally no doubt that some do it better than others.
But when New South Wales Waratahs coach Rob Penney uttered the words, “if other people think I’m not the right person, I’m not going to stand in the way” toward the end of Saturday night’s press-conference after the record 61-10 loss to the Brumbies in Canberra, there was a little bit of discussion among those in attendance.
What was in instant agreement was the Penney wasn’t throwing the towel in.
He’d already made it abundantly clear what the players meant to him, and why the task of rebuilding the Waratahs into the powerhouse a professional team from the country’s most populous state really should be was one he is well and truly committed to.
So why would he make such an admission, especially when there really hadn’t been much talk of pressure?
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Yes, the Waratahs had conceded a record losing score to the Queensland Reds in Round 1, but this was not even an hour after fulltime in Round 2 of a season which the Waratahs have deliberately underspent, and in which they’ve shed upwards of 1500 games of Super Rugby experience.
Even now, a couple of days after the 51-point loss, is Penney really under any pressure? And how could anyone really be expected to come in cold and do better with an understrength squad now also battling an injury crisis?
His tone from the outset was one of concern.
“They’re a shattered group at the moment,” he said, matter-of-factly.
“We’ve just got to be careful with our language and how we treat them for the next period of time, because we’ve got a game on Friday night to look forward to.
“We’ve got to get back on the horse and prepare for what will be a massive challenge Friday night at home against the Force.
“From the outside in, you’d say that’s a tough challenge,” Penney said, to the question of how you bounce back from a performance like that on Saturday night.
“To a degree, it is. The challenge is there, it’s an obvious one, and it’s one we’ve got to rise to. There’s no use moping about it, the damage has been done. The performance, we can’t change anything in that now.
“We can reflect on it, we can learn from it, and endeavour to grow and be better on Friday night.”
Coach Dan McKellar, as passionate a Queenslander as you’ll find, loves what the Brumbies call ‘Tah Week’ more than a good chunk of his playing group.
He gets the rivalry, he gets the history, and he thrives on being part of the story of the contest. Seven straight wins against the Hume Highway rivals suggests he rather quite enjoys the results list, too.
But McKellar was quick to jump to Penney’s defence.
“No, I feel plenty of sympathy for them. Because where they’re at … I don’t think it’s Rob responsibility over how they’ve functioned and worked as a club over the last few years.
“He’s a good coach, he’s shown that in the past, he’s had success. He’s got outstanding assistant coaches.
“They’re a very young group, and at this level, if you’re inexperienced and get put under pressure, there’s lot less time, a lot less space, it’s hard to function,” McKellar said.
“For Australian rugby, we want a strong Waratahs side, and they’ve had a tough first couple of weeks, but they’ll bounce back.”
Rob Penney. (Photo by Mark Kolbe/Getty Images)
Which brings us to Penney’s surprise concession.
Tom Decent from the Sydney Morning Herald went down an uncomfortable – but not unfair – line of questioning about how a turnaround can be achieved, and what sort of impact can two record defeats have on a young squad, before adding the point of how he sells it to fans and supporters that he is the right man for the job?
“Yeah, well… I love these boys and I’m doing my best,” the coach said.
“If other people think I’m not the right person, I’m not going to stand in the way. What’s right for the group is the important thing.”
So what did he really mean in that moment, having already made it clear he’s committed to the job?
Well, that penny (no pun intended) dropped for me later on Sunday.
In my humble opinion, this was Penney issuing the challenge to the powers that be at NSW Rugby, that success is not going to be immediate with a playing group this young, and you’ve got some serious thinking to do around how the professional program in NSW is run.
Penney would have told them – long and hard, I suspect – that if they’re prepared to let all the experience walk out the door at the end of the 2020 season, then the turnaround cannot and will not happen overnight, especially with deliberate underspending with regard to the playing roster.
This was Penney effectively saying, ‘well, I told you so’. He’s almost daring them to make a knee-jerk reaction in search of instant success.
Worryingly, while the SMH reported on Monday that Waratahs chief executive Paul Doorn has said Penney is not in immediate danger, the words “but sources … told the Herald that members of the NSWRU board are already canvassing alternate coaching options, both in Australia and overseas” followed soon after.
Frankly, this would be madness.
Eddie Jones, Steve Hansen, even Scott Robertson would battle to turn around the fortune of the Waratahs right now, especially when their issues run a lot deeper than missing tackles or not making the gain line on the field.
NSW Rugby need to buckle themselves in and give Rob Penney all the support he needs to do the job they employed him to do.
Otherwise, they’re an even bigger part of the Waratahs’ problems than they were before.
Brett McKay is back writing for The Roar, and is also writing weekly rugby columns for ABC Sport.
RobC
Roar Guru
Thanks BeeMc. Agree, it should be a non-issue currently
Gray-Hand
Roar Rookie
Yeah, that is the main reason NSW suck so much. But those players left at the end of the season after Gibson left and before Penney started coaching, so their leaving doesn’t reflect on either coach.
How many NSW players have bailed out now and gone overseas isn't that why NSW is in the predicament they are?
Who would take notice of anything printed in the Courier Mail it is well known for its inaccuracies (lies to some people up there.)
Isn't it good to read an article in the Media from someone who has some idea of what is happening in NSW rugby. The measured comments are well worthwhile reading and make a change from the usual garbage one reads from the Sydney Rugby journalists. NSW administrators and fans have to wake up and stop the mutterings that will become an avalanche that the coach is to blame and he has to go. This comes from an entrenched view that NSW is the B all of Australian Rugby. Well face facts at the moment they are not and there will be more losses to come. Unless Penney can somehow pull this selection of players into a semblance of a team they are heading for the wooden spoon. The inane questions of that interviewer show the entitled view that NSW is the best and they cant take a loss. This team has not been performing for years under both the two former coaches, but the media fans and administrators still try to fool themselves NSW is the Premier side. Unfortunately, they are not and at the moment they are far from it. Take a look at how many experienced members have fled NSW to play overseas and to other franchises. If any more had gone itwould be worse There are many reasons but they can be canvassed by others. It is not Penny's fault as he has faced two devastating losses and improved showing but still a defeat. The wolves are out baying for the blood of the coach. Ok sack him and bring in someone else and you will still find that the team will struggle. It is time the media started to realize that NSW despite the days of old when NSW led the way has gone. leave Penny alone and let him get on with trying to improve the skills of the players he has been landed with, Something that the club coaches should have done before they got to this level of Rugby. Penney is a good coach and will turn this side around but it won't happen overnight. The entitlement of NSW is over and gone and the hard work has to begin. Wake up NSW and get in behind and help, otherwise, you will become the laughing stock of World Rugby. The gauntlet is down will NSW pick it up or will they tough it out. As for McCardle don't get me started. I was pleased to see Stan had got rid of "Offside," Kearns whose only comments came from suggesting the NSW opponents were always offside. I then saw that the incompetent McCardle had been reinstated and was once again leading with his usual boring introductions. As always one step forward and two steps back.
Gray-Hand
Roar Rookie
The reason the results were so poor in the first couple of seasons was because Thorn sacked his senior players. Last season the Reds managed a win rate of only 46%. And that was in a season where they got to play most of their games against Australian teams, including a semi professional team. They were 2-5 before the covid break. That isn’t a good season. It is mediocre at best. This season they have a big win against the Waratahs and they only just scraped home against the Rebels, who are a weak team. Both games were at home. The big win against the Waratahs is looking less impressive each week after the Brumbies beat them by a lot more last week and even the Force managed to beat them tonight.
ScottD
Roar Guru
I guess you are a glass half empty kind of guy. For me I see a whole lot of positives in the Reds and have done for 3 years. O'Connor couldn't have been more upfront about what he wanted to do. Kerevi was unhappy with Australian rugby and was on record about what he thought on the Folau incident(s) and frankly you don't know what conversation he had with the coach (so don't pretend you do) , Rodda and Hockings actions says more about them than it does anyone else and the team has looked improved every year under Thorne and his team. I think you need to stop beating the anti Thorne gun and judge him by the results which over the last 2 seasons have been pretty good.
Gray-Hand
Roar Rookie
The first guy Thorn made captain immediately got stood down for disobeying police instructions. The second captain Thorn appointed turned down a million dollar contract to stay at the Reds. Kerevi had too little respect for Thorn to tell him that he had signed a Japanese contract at the beginning of the season. Two of the players that Thorn brought into the team - Rodda and Hockings abandoned the team mid season. No other Australian coach suffered that humiliation. Vice Captain James O’Connor attempted to worm his way out of his contract to play for a more competitive New Zealand team. Reds culture under Thorn.
Gray-Hand
Roar Rookie
I rate Thorn higher than Graham, but not any better than Stiles, who coached against much stronger opposition.
ScottD
Roar Guru
good point but would previous coaches have stood him down? :)
Gray-Hand
Roar Rookie
One player has already been stood down this season for striking a security guard in the face. So let’s not get too excited about the standards of behaviour that Thorn has set.
ScottD
Roar Guru
Gray-Hand Obviously some of that is a difference in opinion (which is the whole point of this site) but to address your last point, Thorne may not have achieved anything out of the ordinary but I think we can agree he has achieved significantly more than the two coaches that preceded him. Can we at least agree that?
ScottD
Roar Guru
Well we can agree that it isn't toxic now and that they are performing well :) I'd prefer to look forward to be honest. I like where they are at at and where they are heading. cheers mate
Wheelbarrow
Roar Rookie
Was the culture toxic and need to change? Not too sure it so toxic. The issue was the coaching and recruitment
Mark
Guest
Yeah - and why I was annoyed when the Crusaders didnt take him the Blues didnt either - instead we got stuck with a long line of less the successful coaches shall we say
Phil
Roar Rookie
Good point and I don’t necessarily agree with getting rid of Penney. But the outside backs defensive structure and defensive reads was terrible. Is that the players being poor or the coach? Mark N is an attacking threat but a terrible defender. His selection is the coaches so again who’s to blame? I’d like to hear more from experts about why their backline and edge defence was so poor against the Brumbies. Was this raised in the midweek show?
ScottD
Roar Guru
You haven't addressed my question but I guess that is because there is no answer. He has fundamentally changed the Reds culture. Yes there have been casualties but as the guy on the spot I back his judgement.
Wheelbarrow
Roar Rookie
he has been blessed by young talent. nothing more thorn's record as a coach is anything but successful! calling a finals loss in 5 team comp isn't something to sing about - Western force pulled together in 1-2 months and NSW barely playing suitable rugby.
Wheelbarrow
Roar Rookie
Courier mail - may as well read the new idea articles - same amount of substance
Gray-Hand
Roar Rookie
Because: 1. The team has not had any success as yet. In fact it has maintained a dismal record, never once winning more than half its games per season. 2. he has gone about doing so in an unethical way. The circumstances surrounding the dumping of Cooper speak poorly of Thorn’s character. 3. He has acted hypocritically. He sacked Slipper and Hunt due to drug use, then turned around and hired James O’Connor. None of this speaks well of Thorn’s character, so his ability to build a positive culture are suspect. And any claims that he is a good coach are highly suspect. The first two seasons were dismal, largely due to Thorns poor decisions. His third season started disastrously with 5 losses and two wins against easybeats. He probably would have been sacked had he not had the good fortune of only having to compete against Australian teams for the remainder of the season. Let’s put the second half of last season in context - the competition consisted of one of the weakest Waratahs sides of the professional era, a weak rebels team and a semi professional Force. The only team that wasn’t actually poor was the Brumbies, who could only be described as an average super rugby side at best. The Reds couldn’t beat them. So despite being gifted the luxury of being able to beat up on substandard opposition for half a season, Thorn still failed to achieve a win rate of 50%. While it is good to see that the reds appear to be improving, this is hardly anything for Thorn to crow about. A team that is stacked with young inexperienced players should be expected to improve over the course of 4 years. Players get better with experience. The young reds players certainly haven’t improved any more quickly than would be expected if they were at any other team. Thorn has not achieved anything out of the ordinary.