fox - you said he was never onside, the clip clearly shows at the beginning he was onside i.e he had retired behind the feet at some point.
The point in dispute is did he move early and become offside, I think so, that wasn't my point though, it was disputing that he was never onside.
I am not being biased Pk, as you say it looks like he is offside and that is what my eyes are seeing. But yes I do agree an overhead shot would be better but as we don't have one, that is all I can go by. It has nothing to do with being biased but what the camera shot shows.
PeterK– don’t be so biased, at least accept what the eyes clearly show.ing
There is nothing controversial about an offside player be penalised for being offside....Is there no off side in the U5s games you ref?
fox - don't be so biased, at least accept what the eyes clearly show.
Look at the very beginning of the clip , every single English player is onside behind the ruck with clear space.
As to is he offside from the rest of the clip it looks like it, however you would need an over head shot to show conclusively when the ball is past the feet over the ball and hence out, this is before the ball is picked up.
From the angle shown it does look like he is offside and given only this clip yes offside, but to be sure an over head would be more conclusive.
Thanks Die Hard. I think it will be a brilliant game. My main hope is that there are no red cards or poor decisions, so that we're simply talking about the rugby.
I think that he was marginally offside at the time but as you point out it was by no means clear and obvious.
As far as I am concerned the try was deserved as punishment for All Blacks stupidity from on of my favorites TJ Perenara. In fact it is one of those wins I feel a little bit shamed about.
However it is written now and both teams get to make their own statement anew in a few days. I am hoping for a glorious spectacle in which we celebrate win or lose.
Good luck for Saturday Funbus. Neil Back posted me a BBC podcast that so humanised your mob I almost want them to win to my horror. I now even appreciate your big lair Kyle Sinkler.
I can only assume you watched it once after a few beers mate. For the vast majority of the ruck, Lawes was standing deeper than the rest of the England players, and timed his run. It was far too close to be 'clear and obvious', either way. Kiwis seem to have this weird obsession with offside. Every player who manages to put pressure on a Kiwi player is 'yards offside' while the ABs, obviously, never are. It's very strange.
It was clear and obvious he was not behind the last mans feet at the ruck but every other English player was. It was offside and why the TMO didn’t even take that long to make the decision because it was pretty obvious he was offside and why the ref checked it because he clearly has strong feeling he was as well. They didn’t even bother about when Perenara had his hands on the ball because he was never onside in the first place and he wasn’t bound to the ruck…it was bloody obvious he began from an offside position…and the AB’s will put England to the sword on Saturday and England will ruin the game by slowing it down every chance they get in typical English fashion when they play the AB’s. It won’t be the game everyone thinks it is going to be except maybe the first 30 minutes.
Well i guess all will be revealed whether or not poms have got what it takes to reverse history but as it stands from that off side the answer is not but Aotearoa got lol bb
Yes it was. I must have watched it half a dozen times and I’m still not sure whether Lawes was offside or not. It depends on when Perenara is judged to have lifted the ball. My view is that he was probably just onside, but some NASA computer programme could prove me wrong.
What’s undeniable is that it didn’t meet the ‘clear and obvious’ threshold required to rule out a try.
Fox
Roar Guru
Fair enough Pk I'll accept that
PeterK
Roar Guru
fox - you said he was never onside, the clip clearly shows at the beginning he was onside i.e he had retired behind the feet at some point. The point in dispute is did he move early and become offside, I think so, that wasn't my point though, it was disputing that he was never onside.
Fox
Roar Guru
That statement about kiwis is stupid and simply not correct or do you know all 4.5 million of us do you?
Fox
Roar Guru
I am not being biased Pk, as you say it looks like he is offside and that is what my eyes are seeing. But yes I do agree an overhead shot would be better but as we don't have one, that is all I can go by. It has nothing to do with being biased but what the camera shot shows.
Jacko
Guest
PeterK– don’t be so biased, at least accept what the eyes clearly show.ing There is nothing controversial about an offside player be penalised for being offside....Is there no off side in the U5s games you ref?
piru
Roar Rookie
Apologies, I was watching from where it cut off, he was initially onside, but for mine he's off for a good few seconds before the ball is out.
piru
Roar Rookie
He's not onside at any time in the video, whether it took Perenara a long time or not doesn't really matter!
PeterK
Roar Guru
fox - don't be so biased, at least accept what the eyes clearly show. Look at the very beginning of the clip , every single English player is onside behind the ruck with clear space. As to is he offside from the rest of the clip it looks like it, however you would need an over head shot to show conclusively when the ball is past the feet over the ball and hence out, this is before the ball is picked up. From the angle shown it does look like he is offside and given only this clip yes offside, but to be sure an over head would be more conclusive.
FunBus
Roar Rookie
Thanks Die Hard. I think it will be a brilliant game. My main hope is that there are no red cards or poor decisions, so that we're simply talking about the rugby.
Die hard
Roar Rookie
I think that he was marginally offside at the time but as you point out it was by no means clear and obvious. As far as I am concerned the try was deserved as punishment for All Blacks stupidity from on of my favorites TJ Perenara. In fact it is one of those wins I feel a little bit shamed about. However it is written now and both teams get to make their own statement anew in a few days. I am hoping for a glorious spectacle in which we celebrate win or lose. Good luck for Saturday Funbus. Neil Back posted me a BBC podcast that so humanised your mob I almost want them to win to my horror. I now even appreciate your big lair Kyle Sinkler.
FunBus
Roar Rookie
I can only assume you watched it once after a few beers mate. For the vast majority of the ruck, Lawes was standing deeper than the rest of the England players, and timed his run. It was far too close to be 'clear and obvious', either way. Kiwis seem to have this weird obsession with offside. Every player who manages to put pressure on a Kiwi player is 'yards offside' while the ABs, obviously, never are. It's very strange.
Fox
Roar Guru
It was clear and obvious he was not behind the last mans feet at the ruck but every other English player was. It was offside and why the TMO didn’t even take that long to make the decision because it was pretty obvious he was offside and why the ref checked it because he clearly has strong feeling he was as well. They didn’t even bother about when Perenara had his hands on the ball because he was never onside in the first place and he wasn’t bound to the ruck…it was bloody obvious he began from an offside position…and the AB’s will put England to the sword on Saturday and England will ruin the game by slowing it down every chance they get in typical English fashion when they play the AB’s. It won’t be the game everyone thinks it is going to be except maybe the first 30 minutes.
Don Mackie
Roar Rookie
Well i guess all will be revealed whether or not poms have got what it takes to reverse history but as it stands from that off side the answer is not but Aotearoa got lol bb
FunBus
Roar Rookie
Yes it was. I must have watched it half a dozen times and I’m still not sure whether Lawes was offside or not. It depends on when Perenara is judged to have lifted the ball. My view is that he was probably just onside, but some NASA computer programme could prove me wrong. What’s undeniable is that it didn’t meet the ‘clear and obvious’ threshold required to rule out a try.
piru
Roar Rookie
Wasn't that controversial