Why the Panthers are struggling to attract sponsors

kovana You missunderstood the intent of the post. The argument is about the influence of those within and outside the game.If there were not the likes of the Packers,Gyngells,Pollies,Business people even the Crowes and Tinklers who follow the game,and professional people,the game would be a darn side weaker and less able to wield influence in the media,it currently does .As a consequence it would achieve less media coverage over a period of time. Hardly a conspiracy theor ,just a grim fact of life.

GOGWS.. The same argument can be used for the Titans,but they had the decent cowds when they were competitive and in competition with the Broncos.They are of course one of the dearest clubs to join and attend,which is plain dumb. I have to be fluffy ,as I am again under moderation by teh thought police.. You are kidding ,if you believe there are not a number of GC residents who attended Lions games ,but now prefer following the local team to get their AFL fix.So when they were flogging Lions games on the Gc ,prior to their inclusion,they were getting no one from the GC to attend.Yeah, right..No AFL fan on the GC ,made the road trip to Brisbane . And I willl give you an example.Prior to Cronulla coming into the ARL,jsut abourt every Shire rl fan followed St George.When Cronulla came in in 67,whlst St George diehards held on,there were fans who decided to follow their true blue "local club". I will cite two examples, my father in law and my better half.And St George is a lot closer to Cronulla ,than the GC is to Brisvegas.

Oh c'mon GOGWS.The Aydney media is generally more than compliant with the AFL,and have been so since the arrival of the Swans.Is there an occasional negative story ? yes of course,but that happens with all codes in this fair city and rl most of all.Pick your nose in public and someone will catch a player on phone camera. Maybe you should read stories niw and again by the likes of Wilson,Hinds, and some of the Sydney AFL scribes ,who have no qualms in having a dig at rugby league There are plenty of melbourne based AFL s ones who enjoy sticking the knife into rl at the opportune time.Smith,Healey,G Cassidy and C Wilson("how many hits can this game take"".) for starters.Trouble is the extent of their bagging. could be equated with continuing the r/roll ear to the rap era. It is not one way traffic champ.It pays at times to look at one's own backyard ,to see weeds are also growing.) No I am stating ,GWS did oK securing sponsors,the Perth Reds( not even admitted have secured sponsors and a big one in the wings.What I am stating one summer does not a lifetime of beachweather make.IOW anything new on the sporting scne has firstly novety value and publicity(even the Storm with 21,000 in attendance at their first game at the OP dump against Nth Sydney),proves novelty value can at times be ,oh so temporary. Don't remember suggesting Penrith not having a sponsor,was something to be happy about.But that is hardly the end of Penrith.

"the media would fight to the death to have the game extinct." Lol.. Is that why they show it on TV? And the Newspapers? Radio? Stop wih your 'conspiracy theory'.

So why does the NRL want a Perth Team then?

So by your reasoning for the foreseeable future the Lions will have crowds of around 20K average...might not the crowds go back up to 30K average were the Lions a top 8 side again?... there is no way to prove your theory (or mine) one way or another...time will tell...having said that if you want my guess then my strong is hunch is that the drop off is mainly due to successive poor seasons in 2009, 2010 & 2011...poor results over an extended period and the disastrous Fevola signing and loss of Bradshaw and several other long serving players - Voss made a few recruiting blunders that would have been hard to swallow for many loyal Lions fans and this wouldn't have helped their cause... so there was a time lag before the drop off for the Lions after their peak at the top of the ladder but this lag probably has nothing to do with the Suns...it's just coincidence...even without the Suns a big drop in crowds was on the cards... I think you're misreading the situation and time will prove you wrong.... wishful thinking on your part me thinks...the Lions will find success again and when they do they'll be averaging 30K again and probably more..

Brisbane Lions crowds before the Gold Coast Suns were in the AFL. 2010 - 29,933 2009 - 29,172 2008 - 28,128 2007 - 28,848 2006 - 28,630 2005 - 33,267 2004 - 33,619 2003 - 31,717 2002 - 26,895 2001 - 27,638 2000 - 27,406 1999 - 21,890 1998 - 16,675 1997 - 19,550 Crowds since the Gold Coast Suns were brought in. 2011 - 20,462 So the average for the Lions since their fall from the top of the ladder hovered around 28,000 to 29,000 until the Suns were brought in. THe club almost reached 30,000 in 2010, which saw them only win 7 games. The 2006 season was just as bad. The 2011 season brought the Lions just 4 wins. Around 9,500 fewer fans decided to not show up at each of the Lions home matches at the Gabba in 2011. At no other time in the Lions history has this happened. My question to this anomaly is simple. Why? If it's all about results and has nothing to do with the Suns coming in, then how come the only time this happened was during the year the Suns came? I'd say the introduction of the Suns had something to do with the drop off. Teams don't lose one-third of their fans in a year just because the team isn't playing well. But they do lose fans when they belong to a sport that's considered a minority sport in their city and are joined by a rival team that's within driving distance...

Ted, the low socioeconomic image of rugby league is one that is perpetuated by the media. It is in the media's interests to continue this. I know so many leaguieis who are academics, lawyers, teachers, accountants etc it's not funny. If rugby league did not have an undercurrent of power, the media would fight to the death to have the game extinct. they can't but they can chip away.

the main reason Lions crowds are down is not the Suns... the main reason is they can't win a game.... I think they were actually trying their best in 2011 so I'm sure the Lions would have been disappointed in their fair weather fans...

The Sydney media as a whole isn't anti AFL necessarily - these days I'd say it's more accurate to say they generally ignore AFL rather than generate negative articles....at the same time it's also true to say that certain RL commentators certainly continue to churn out anti AFL nonsense - in the last 15 years they've consistently bagged the AFL and never utter a single positive word...you know who these RL journalists are, I don't need to list their names....they can't seem to rise above constant negativity and cheerleading - these journalists are like broken records and it surprises me that they are afforded a forum for their tired and outdated opinions... call the GWS media coverage lip service..whatever...again, the GWS Giants have major sponsors and Penrith is still looking for a 2012 sponsor...that's the reality...

Wow QLD'S game is rugby league we have now finally found 1 thing we have in common. That is progress.

MrFree, "Local public support" has *nothing* to do with a conveyor belt of local talent into your code via junior clubs. It has a lot to do with having a competitive team on the park. It has a lot to do with building community links through school visits, training days for kids, and cultivating your local fans and your local media. Look at the best-run code in Australia's performance in Sydney. The Swans moved up in, what, 1982 ? In 2011, several Sydney clubs will be going into the second-tier NEAFL from the local Sydney comp, which will hopefully provide a bit more of a career path for late-developing Sydney-based AFL players.

Will I think you are sugar coating the WF's place in WA & Australia generally. With their supposedly large supporter & playing base how many locals do they have in Super 15 squads? Could you name them? Also not one, I repeat not one game involving the WF (this season) made the Top10 Lists for the Pay TV Ratings. So they are not adding any value to the ARU's national profile. They might as well be invisible.

GOGWS. But but you and i know maestro,the Telegraph and SMH,give only lip service to GWS and the Swans.But wait.....maybe we were wrong. This is where I find the irony,one minute the media is anti the code,the next we are getting publicity. Far more coverage in the rest of Australia may be correct,the AFL dominated part of the country to be precise. Novelty value ,as no doubt the first Tv game will be.But as the Swans have shown by their Tv ratings drop,that exposure certainly in the north is lessened.Media space for the Swans will be reduced by the GWS,and they are suggesting that already.Note the effect of the Suns on the Lions crowds. . Yes GWS has secured early publicity,and membership,with nearly half coming from the ACT.It may be interesting to note that the Tv ratings for Canberra (supposedly a strong AFL and ru city)showed rugby league dominated the ratings numbers in the top 10 with SOO and the NRL G/F and a RWC game. .

BA Sports. Try Tv deal monies for a start.The difference is huge,the Tv ratings differential not so. They have better grassroots programs !!! Or more likely they have better funded grassroots programs. The pathway for kids from u6 to Kangaroos is there for all to see.The code caters for girls,non contact for boys,handicapped and backyard rl for schools. Rugby league has recently won awards for the community programs they have introduced for the young. Yes i am sure that is why Telstra and Toyota two of their major sponsors continue to back the code,due to it being less stable. The only instability in the code was having the NSWRL,QRL,CRL all pulling in different directions.This will be a thing of the past with the i.C.The other instability was the financial positions of the clubs,but seeing some recent results from other codes's clubs,i hardly think the NRL is Robinson Crusoe. The previous govt decision making should be questioned on many things ,not just Blacktown.Using the previous govt for any decision is well us say dubious.The most corrupt,innefficient wasteful govt,I have had the disspleasure of living under.Two stadiums within a few kms of each other ,and the money expended on the updated one .Govt waste at its very best. I have a reasonable amount of knowledge with Nth Qlld,and I know whilst the numbers of development officers are limited,that the Cowboys and staff,and other local rl clubs get out and about a lot more than you know.In fact the Cowboys recently visted Darwin,and were involved in development work with aspiring rl players,as they do in many Nth Qld areas.The club will be playing an NRL match there June 13-16.An academy set up by the Cowboys has been set up in Darwin. Where I live there is 1 D/O yet the area has one of the highest numbers of juniors and continues to grow year upon year.The volunteers take up a lot of the slack Despite AFL D/Os running around.. You fall into the usual trap, whilst the code may not have the D/Os that the AFL does,they have a great pool of volunteers in the game in Nth Qld,who do a lot of wonderful things.I suggest you need to get around the various conmmunities involved in rl,from Torres Strait Islands down.It may surprise you.In fact people like the late Artie Beetson,David Peachey,Mario Fenech who you may or may not know got around to a hell of a lot of areas in country NSW and Qld to spread the gospel.You can have all the D/O s under the sun,but it gets down to tradition as to what people have played. For example you probably have not heard of the Remote Area Rugby league Comp,which involved teams from torres Strait and the Cape. Do not underestimate the work of the Cowboys in Nth Qld.Of course having more D/Os would be nice.There is never enough money when it comes to rl,because of the demand. The code has been able to grow the game on limited funding in the past,with 35,000 new participants this year. I take your marginal comment with a grain of salt,in much the same way as I took the comment by one of your fellow flagwavers that Qld was a football state.There are difficulties in the country every man and his dog is aware of that fact. As more people play the game than ever before(in the 2011 stats),they are coming from somewhere,maybe in places like Vic,where I read a new comp is planned for the Wimmera area involving Ararat,Stawell,Lake Bolac and Bendigo with the chance of Ballarat.Yet there is only 9 D/Os for the whole of Vic . Shocked at the number of kids,yet you have no figures to prove or dissprove.Guessing is not an answer. You better hope and pray the code doesn't get a decent Tv windfall,because D/Os will be running all around the place .You had better also hope,CQLD doesn't get a guernsey in expansion, that will strengthen the game even more up North.

Skoda do get plenty of exposure in the Sydney market through GWS....as a start-up they seem to be getting as much media as some Sydney based NRL clubs, and far more coverage in the rest of Australia than any NRL team...anyway the proof is in the pudding - Penrith are still struggling to attract a major sponsor for 2012 while the GWS Giants have sponsors in place....things could change but at the early stages the Giants seem to be going OK on the sponsorship side of things....

That's the first thing you've said that I agree with.

I defiantly think a 2nd team in brisbane or south east QLD is a must. League hearltands with mining money, and ever increasing population in next 20-50 years.

Crosscoder Why do the AFL have more funds? Because they have better structure, because to the private sector (and media) they are a more stable organisation, with a better strategy (they actually have one), they have better grassroots programs - all up they are a sounder investment. The NSW government isn't going to invest $30million into a home ground for a new AFL side unless they are given a pretty good proposal (ok the previous NSW government decision making could always be questioned) I don't doubt that the NRL expansion hopefuls aren't out their drumming up support in their local communities, like any expansion team does, but from what i see travelling the state of NSW and from what i saw living in north queensland for three years, the presence of league compared to the AFL in these former "strong holds" is marginal. In Cairns (to cover the area from Innisfail to the Cape), there is one NRL development officer (employed by the Cowboys) and one ARL development officer. The AFL have 10 plus a significant number of support staff, and the AFL doesn't even have a team within 1,500km of Cairns.... yet.... I travel all around NSW with the sport i work for (not a football code) and apart from Ronny Gibbs up in the north west i never see league development officers, but i see AFL staff everywhere i go. I now live back in Wollongong and I would be shocked if they have even a third of the number of kids playing league that they had playing in the Illawarra 10 years ago.

All a bit beside the point of your post here Sheek but I highly doubt Perth will ever overtake Brisbane’s population. Until recently Brisbane was moving towards Melbourne. In the last couple of years Melbourne has become flavor of the month and is actually (if trends remain the same) heading towards Sydney. But Melb’s is growing at roughly at the same rate as Brisbane now. No doubt Perth is booming, but the transformation of Brisbane over the last decade or so is nothing short of amazing. I spent my school years in Bris which concluded in 2000. This was when the place was not much more than (as they say) an oversized country town. I get back there these days to visit my Mum and school mates and each time I go the place seems to have taken another huge leap forward. Since 2000 you wouldn’t recognise the place. Their exposure to Queensland’s own mining boom and the trend of southerners looking to settle in the warmer climates has driven this growth to date. It will accelerate as the fly in/fly out phenomenon hits Queensland (until recently the Bligh Government has encouraged the miners to create settlements in towns around the mines to encourage regional growth) and the race for resources (gas is set to explode in the sunshine state) continues at an ever increasing pace. All ebbs and flows, booms and troughs but I’d say in the next 30-40 years Brisbane will catch up to (not over take) Sydney and Melbourne and put more distance between itself and Perth and Adelaide. Like I say, all beside the point (just got back from Bris and thought I’d share), but more on topic I think for the demographic reasons you’ve listed above Perth should be included in the next round of expansion(s).