Australian sport must consolidate, not expand

'To build depth in rugby union, somehow they need to find a way of tearing NRL down' Rugby had it's chance to tear down RL during the following a) SL war 90's b) RWC 2003-onwards Chances are there were more opportunities to do so but I go no knowledge of it whatever but I'm sick of people like you Bludger who death-ride rugby league just let us enjoy our sport and leave us alone every single year people want RL dead and I'm sick of it.

redb considering the context of those ratings when RL has no representation in WA/SA since 98/99 it's a start so I cut in some slack but the Lions/Swans/Storm ratings on the other hand can be criticized as they been around in there respective areas with various degrees of success aka the infamous Iron chef comparison for the Swans & Storm been cosigned to midnight since day one pretty much since they do not rate....apparently.

Don't think many Swans fans came from out west, so I can't see many jumping ship to the Giants. The only fans they would lose may be in the Hills area, as it would be easier for them to get to Homebush than the SCG, although they don't think of themselves as westies. The Swans average may well drop as they're doing up the SCG which is cutting the capacity.

Hopefully the NRL can use the promise of an NRL team in Perth to encourage the WA government to fund a purpose built 25-30,000 seat rectangular stadium for all 3 rectangular codes.

I agree with you wholeheartedly p.Tah. I don't however have faith that the 'madness' is likely to cease. Sport is an indifferent force to those of my persuasion and integral to the argy bargy of the corporate world in flexing its insatiable muscles to what end, I am unclear aside to outright avarice. There certainly needs to be some consolidation in what has long been an over saturated Australasian market, to ensure quality and parity is sustained as opposed to quantity and egotistical and irresponsible empire building. In relation to expansion in the code i am most interested in, I do not believe the AFL will ever afford the nations capital a stand alone side and will instead gift NZ one in order to pit itself against competing trans Tasman codes, in the context of the war that is being waged in television alone. Saint Kilda are already reported to be planning to play four fixtures per year in Wellington, with limited scrutiny on the part of the AFL. This incredulous double standard sees them ready to turn a blind eye, in changing the goal posts of criteria used against the ACT over decades of supporting the games national cause as well as actually boasting a long and illustrious culture for Aust footy. Criterias like demographic, population and corporate support seem to be irrelevant when it comes to taking top fixtures to an alien overseas footy culture like NZ, while any merit based criteria clearly holds no weight whatsoever in terms of growing codes today. Who knows where it will all end or begin - again perhaps?

Their top side is 2% year on year. You were using this as a reason why his saturation theory is but at sub 3% it is completely invalid as a counter point. Also based on the stats you used SA and Tas whilst lower aren’t exactly miles away are they? So if you characterise their growth as “foolish” the others must at least be “poorly considered” You are using stats poorly simply to misdirect rather than inform.

Keep in mind that I have cited the low-case scenario by the ABS. It may not be a boom, but that's not what leagues are aiming for anyway. The point is, that Melbourne (Storm), Sydney (GWS) and the Gold Coast/SE QLD (Suns) are growth areas. It's not like AFL, NRL or ARU have foolishly expanded into Tassie or South Australia when growth is unlikely to be focussed there.

sorry Whites, my reply to your post is above after Bludgers reply. Not sure what happened. "Whites, I love watching and beating (on occasions) the NZ teams. When I first started watching rugby seriously I didn’t care that much for Saffas teams, but now I do enjoy them as much at the kiwi teams. They bring a different element to the game. We’d miss them if they weren’t involved. The time zone is a challenge. Similar to trying to watch the Ashes in England, the tennis or FA cup etc. I rarely watch a game in South Africa live unless it’s a final. If the game is a good one I’ll record it and keep clear of any score sheets!"

sorry Bludger this posted in the wrong place it should have been to your post above not Whites. The second line should say "I don’t actually wish Ill on the NRL." as in wish no harm on the NRL (or AFL, HAL for that matter)

That's only 0.5% year on year growth- hardly some great boom to be tapped into.

I think the AFL hoped Melbourne teams would relocate to both the expansion targets of GC and WSyd. It is not easy to convince club boards and diehard fans that their club should move for the betterment of the game. As with the Swans and Lions the process is very painful for the game's fans and it still festers underneath the surface particularly in the case of the Lions some 16 years later. The new expansion teams (Suns & Giants) have caused less harm to the existing fan base, especially also seen as they have been largely unsuccessful in luring a swag of players from tradtional clubs. The downside is these teams will struggle until the player pool expands over time. Expansion is not just about creating a team to represent an area it is also about expanding the games player footprint to increase the player pool. There is considerable lag in this and a risk the player pool will not grow sufficiently to the level required. It is too early to judge, thus the article is premature.

It is interesting that when the shoe is on the other foot how small tv ratings sample numbers are 'impressive'. #justsayin

I think the gold coast are simply not supporting the teams that are coming to them. It should be a golden area with both home support and heaps of fans willing to travel to games (this is indeed happening in the AFL). The western Sydney giants are not going to get this, I have been tosydney only once, and I have to sa that it is the worst city to live in all of Australia. Even though I live in the 2nd biggest city in Australia, I felt like I was like some rural tourist, or I was in a different country. West Sydney Was a complete hole. Parramatta Westfield is the only reason to go out there, and the only place that would be worth living at is bondi. I am serous, I could only put up with that place for 2 -3 days max

Whites, I love watching and beating (on occasions) the NZ teams. When I first started watching rugby seriously I didn't care that much for Saffas teams, but now I do enjoy them as much at the kiwi teams. They bring a different element to the game. We'd miss them if they weren't involved. The time zone is a challenge. Similar to trying to watch the Ashes in England, the tennis or FA cup etc. I rarely watch a game in South Africa live unless it's a final. If the game is a good one I'll record it and keep clear of any score sheets!

Bludger, many in Union would like it to happen, but I don't think League has to fall over for Union to build depth. I don't actually wish I'll on the NRL. The beauty of Super rugby is that we don't need huge playing numbers. We only have 5 professional teams. Currently they have squads of 32 each so thats 160 players. That isn't enough. We need at least double that. If each team continued it's academy set up and they played in their own competition we'd have enough depth IMO. Australia is fortunate we are surrounded by the best rugby nurseries in the World: NZ, Fiji, Tonga, Samoa and South Africa. Many of those relocate to Australia and continue to play and support rugby so there will always be a supporter base. We don't however have to rely on expats. The maligned private schools in Sydney, Canberra and Brisbane (and now Perth and Melbourne) are very good nurseries for rugby. The top rugby talent usually gravitate to these schools where they play each other from when they are 13 to 18. That interaction is very important. The schools have very good sporting set ups, better than some professional clubs. They are seen as defacto ARU academies at times. In the last 10 years we are seeing more and more players emerge from the non-rugby schools make the Australia school boys, so the rugby net is widening. It will never be cast as wide as the football, Australian rules or Rugby League net, but it doesn't need to be. We don't need as many professional players as the other leagues. The ARU and the state bodies need to ensure they capture the right players. This is difficult because young players develop at different rates physically and mentally. They have the right idea by setting up a telent identification program and nurturing talent. I think there are around 800 kids between 15-18 in the program. They'll miss players and some will slip through the net but the concept is a good one. There is debate as to whether the implementation is correct but they'll improve it over time. I think the ARU wil het there eventually with the player base. It's working on the spectator base. Not every viewer has to have played rugby. If all Australian teams play like the Reds of 2011. It'll be fine, but at the moment they're not. They have some work to do there! But the Super rugby competition in 2012 is the best it's ever been. It's amazing to watch.

Very good article p.Tah. Australia has the most diverse saturation of professional sports in the world. Every sports body wants a slice of the pie in every market with western Sydney being a particular target. What happens out there in the next five years will be a very good litmus test of the dangers and advantages of expansion. The AFL is creating a team from the top down and currently has bucket loads of money to prop it up but there are inherent dangers in the model they have set up. Soccer has a groundswell of community support and a huge junior playing base but these factors aren't a guarantee of success for a professional A league team in the west. The long term success of either is a gamble, pure and simple. Rugby League clubs and organisations are crying out for more money from a new broadcast deal that hasn't even been done yet. If that deal dosen't meet expectations any expansion will be dependant on the whims of another mining billionaire or crazy Hollywood actor. Ditto Rugby Union, they've got enough trouble propping up the Rebels and Force. The best bet could be 20/20 cricket teams in the new national comp. The game is exciting, quick and kids love it. If it gets a FTA deal as well as its existing pay TV deal it could be a goer. After all, cricket is, and probably always be, Australia's only true national sport.

Good article. As a round ball fan, and an overall sports nut, i get your points, they make plenty of sense. There's only approx 25m people in Oz, and there's only so much sport people can spend their hard earnt on. However, in my code, the world game, the FFA made a huge mistake by not having 2 teams in Sydney from start, and having a western Sydney team in from day 1. It was a massive oversight on their part. That's like having only 1 NRL club in the whole of Queensland. In Western Sydney alone, there are over 90k registered players at club level, and in the old NSL there was Marconi, Sydney United, Sydney Olympic, Northern Spirit and a few more, all from that area, most of them at the same time. The FFA has tried to get a A-league club going there in the last few years, but because the league is still in its infancy, things like TV money and sponsorship are still quite low, they've been waiting for a white knight to come along and bankroll the club. This of course hasn't happened, and here we are today. Now there's 10 teams, to agree, they should consolidate, for at least 5 years. I'm not sure if 8 clubs are enough for the A-league, I think 12 might be just right, but will have to wait and see. Also will be interesting to see how GWS goes this season, on and off the park, and where the NRL will be expanding to next.

p.Tah, as a fan of Super Rugby and a Waratah's do you have more of an interest in the NZ teams or the SA teams as rivals? As an outsider to rugby union I've always thought a competition with say 8 teams from Australia and 8 from NZ would work better. The main reason is simply the time-zone difference with SA. It's feasible for fans of the AFL, NRL or the A-League to watch an entire round if they desired. You'd have to sleep during the day on weekend to achieve this with Super Rugby(No doubt some people do that).

I thought I got that right - though I've said suggested instead of "suggesting".

Agree, that surprised me also. When do you think Rusty will relocate Souths to Adelaide ;) Not much of a rebranding exercise to the South Australian Rabbitohs. You could stil call them Souths :) ... Just stirring