Cheika unfazed by overseas exodus

Are you confusing Sydney with Australia again?

So sensible to even further erode the game in Australia. Eventually you'll have nobody to pick from. And it's not at all sensible to think that you will have access to players anything similar to like what you have when you fund the team they play for.

Bakkies, Profile is relative to the market. To be the highest profile player in Australia you have competition from 4 other teams. In France there's 13 other teams. Look at all the Australian players who have progressed well into the business world. You think that Australian rugby was just blessed with a lot of people who progress well on merit? Or perhaps their profile helped them? Compare this to France, your national profile is smaller, plus it's a moving feast with rosters. There just isn't opportunities for every player who ends their career there. Whilst in Australian rugby due to the more stable nature of rosters, and their longer connection and identity the better profile in the corporate market and better opportunity to transition. I understand there are excellent perks in France. But just because some of the best players in the world have been getting them, it doesn't mean every player in every team gets them. The very best will do well no matter which route they go, but for the majority of players, a pay rise for a couple of years in France at the back end of their career may see them lose a lot of post career opportunities in Australia. Yes they are there in France too. But they don't have enough to go around for every mercenary who stops by for a 2 year pay top up.

Seriously Bakkies ??? The Badge would be 6 th choice Wallaby winger in 2015 and Ioane is 30 .. Houston could never hold on the pill when he played at the REDS, It was like a bar of soap to him. .Blair Connor ( Another RED??) This fellow cannot tackle to save his life . I Remember a game against the chiefs 2009 or 2010 where thy scored about 8 tries down his wing, he makes Kurtley look like THE AXE GILLMEISTER..... Move on.. P.S .Ill give you Hooper..

Bakkies i,ve watched most of his games i believe played approx 7/8 won 5 scored more tries already there, then in his super career ,playing very good football , been out for approx 5-6 weeks with hamstring injury , back this week , whilst being out injured they have lost last 6 games until last weekend,s win

The realities would be some what different. the clubs in Europe do not care about international Rugby, they have no compulsion to release players except if it is in the test window which is after the club season. Your coach would only see these players at the end of year tests with no time to meld them into a cohesive unit and impliment game plans. You would never have these players for Bledisloe games, nor any of the mid year tests. The Wallabies would become more of a second tier nation and drop in the world rankings. Given this scenerio how many supporters would continue to support them, what revenue stream /sponser would want them. Ultimately you would destroy Australian Rugby. Is there a solution, i dont know except to continue relying on the pull of the Wallaby Jersey and the local competition and restrict your selection to local players.

I see your comment on NZRU player management, Mr Hat, and raise you the following nonsensical rant. If only the toffee-nosed Welsh Rugby F.U. stepped out of their ivory towers for a second to see what their importing of Pacific Island rugby players is doing to the markets in NZ and Aus. Wallabies have been nearly losing to Wales so much recently because of Cheika’s dispute with his former Welsh club which has destroyed his relationship with pacific island players as a result. It all goes back to when Alan Jones failed to establish an independent board in ’84, then Garrick Morgan joined the Crushers in ’94, and it has been downhill ever since.

Sage words Daz, the approach of the ARU to pricing the player market is crucial. I've always thought that the loyalty you speak of exists within a margin of price, depending on the qualitative aspects of the product. Say it's 20% for example, i.e. that as long as the price of the product is within 20% of the market standard (could be 75% for a car) then people will accept this as a premium they are willing to pay for a product to which they are emotionally invested. The trick of course is identifying the edge of this margin, so you don't scare them away, but can leverage every last drop to monetise goodwill. The relevance this has to rugby is that the ARU need to be proportionally connected to world market prices, but sit off it at a parallel margin of about 20% less. That's not 20% off the very top end of the market (e.g. Carter), but the mean. Those who still leave should have clear pathways to returning that don't involve a full year of SR or even a SR contract, but some sort of written contractual arrangement that can coexist with a foreign entity arrangement. A clearly articulated pathway would mean that expat Wallabies or up-and-comers alike can have their release written into their foreign club contracts at the front end, reducing uncertainty later. And we lobby to get the government to accept "rugby player" on the 457 visa skilled occupation list even if an amateur. But that's probably left to when the ARU goes cap in hand to the Federal Government looking for a private/public partnership in 5 years time when they're bankrupt.

huh? what on earth are you on about?

What's a good name then MT? Maybe the team would come to be known simply as the Dragons. In the same way Wasps are no longer London, just Wasps. I agree it would take a while to be successful in Singapore, and I have my doubts about it. But there is significant private investment behind that team along with government support. And there isn't much competition there in terms of the professional sport market. They almost got in ahead of the Japanese team for 2016 and their plan is to be a team for the South East Asia region and Pacific Islands. For now you could take the negative view and say the Japanese team and the Pampas are token teams. The other side of the coin is that they are step 1 to further expansion in those regions and that they won't be token teams for very long.

Bakkies, you're missing my point. Leicester is doing great - it's the biggest club in England, yet its crowd averages are still less than a number of Super Rugby teams. And because it operates in a relatively small population it's pretty much hit its ceiling in terms of support. My point is that it's a myth that European club rugby is this great beheamoth that SANZAR can't possibly compete with. The Average crowds in the Aviva Premiership have been flat for about 5 years around 12-13k each season. Not much more than half the Super Rugby average. TV ratings have reportedly gone up on BT compared to Sky but the numbers are still small. Around 100k for most matches. Again, this is much, much smaller than the average Super Rugby game when you combine all its markets. The Top 14 is much bigger, and the greater threat of becoming the sort of EPL of rugby. But I feel it's still overstated. The Top 14 is no more popular in France than the NRL is in Australia. Top players can earn big money there because there are a few multi-millionaires that own clubs and throw their money around. But there's only so many places for players. And it's not like the salaries are 4 or 5 times bigger. The league itself doesn't generate as much income as the NRL - which Australian rugby has had to compete with in a much more direct way for ages. As for the Pro 12, it averages 8,000 people per game. That league and its teams are not threats.

Already happens. Very few European players are available for November Baabaas.

Ioane, Badge. Sure Badge is in Japan I can see him going to Europe where a club will pay him what he is worth and market him much better. He also needs the money. There are uncapped players who are doing well. Salvi is better over the ball than Hooper but chose to walk even after Smith left the Brumbies. I rate him higher than Hodgson. He plays in a more physical league and he outplayed Armitage the other week. Houston and Hegarty are playing good Rugby. Blair Connor has been outstanding since he arrived a few years back and he only had a fistful of Reds caps. Mowen has played a less restricted style since moving. He leads by example unlike Hooper.

Douglas has underwhelmed so far. Lack of games after Super Rugby hasn't helped.

Toulon regularly take games to Marseille and Nice. Racing and SF have moved some games including low profile ones to small cities and got good crowds. La Rochelle and Castres have extended their grounds recently. Toulouse own their stadium and have quiet a few clubs in their vicinity that take potential support away from them Albi, Brive, Colomiers, Castres.

Some head in the sand stuff from Eddard. Leicester's crowd averages are bigger than most Super Rugby sides. Leicester also would get much larger crowds to watch their reserve sides than say the Shute Shield, NPC, etc. They are probably the most self sufficient Rugby club in the game. Their local rivals are really close to them and Wasps have just moved up. Leicester City FC are back in the Premier League. I say they own Welford Road which generates good income. They make profits nearly year despite pumping loads in to local development. The AP's ratings have gone up since they have moved to BT. Bath can't expand their ground. Exeter are going to extend Sandy Park, Northampton have got approval, when Bristol do go up they will probably have the highest gates after Leicester. Wasps first game in Coventry is approaching a sell out. As for the Top 14 they get about 1 million viewers per game on Canal. Crowd averages will go up when teams move from small grounds to bigger stadiums. Bordeaux play most of their games at Chaban Delmas and have the highest gates in the league. Lyon might get Stade Gerland if they can maintain Top 14 status. Grenoble have already moved to the bigger stadium and boosted their attendances. Racing Metro are building a 30,000 seater. The FFR have plans for an 80,000 seat stadium of their own in Paris which will long term pump more money in to the game. Unlike the ARU they have no problems attracting sponsors as some of the world major banks, pharma, food processing and manufacturing companies are based in France. The Pro 12 ratings have to have gone up since the Irish coverage moved from Setanta to Terrestrial. Sky are also broadcasting the league now.

"Asia-Pacific Dragons", singapore don't even like Rugby bar expats. With a bland name like that, you can ensure they won't go near it. But keep dreaming, it's a total fantasy that super rugby will overtake europe by putting token teams in Asia and South America

Yep great words by Timmins couldt agree more. Just shows the void between the aru and the rugby ppl in this country. IMo, that's the kind of topic the aru should talk about with clubs' administrators before implementing it. Top down approach again.

yep, agree jez, I think its the least bad solution for oz at the moment. On top of that making expats eligible means they will be less attractive to other nations as they might think twice before paying a player who will miss August-September (RC) and November. That's potentially 8-10 games/season. I think the aru should 'encourage' players to move to Japan during the off season the way Jacque Pot is doing now in Fukuoka. Keeps fit, make money, experience something different and will be back in time for the beginning of the SR season. That's a win win for me. Not perfect to miss the pre season but still better than losing him to Europe. I would make aussies based in japan 4-5 months/year eligible too if they commit to SR after the end of the top league season.

Also interesting to see the battle brewing between the grassroots Subbies and the top tiers of the game. I'm quite a fan of this letter from Paul Timmins the chairman of NSW Subbies. He makes the very valid point that it is these grassroots players who are the rugby fans in this country. We need to be reducing the hurdles to getting them on the pitch rather than potentially sending a large number of these clubs to the wall. http://www.espnscrum.com/australia/rugby/story/251185.html The fact that the ARU are threatening to withhold the funding of development officers is telling. Strong arm tactics coming from the ARU. http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport/rugby/aru-and-nswru-on-brink-of-war-over-player-levy-and-insurance-scheme/story-fnii0ksb-1227162481415 All of this stems from the trouble the ARU are in financially and we are in that trouble paying players to try and keep them on shore and to be competitive in Super Rugby.