Wallabies vs England second Test DIY player ratings: The results

I don't rate Foley as a test player at all and to give him 41/2 is generous. A test player has to have a better goal kicking percentage than him. He should be able to find touch from a penalty and not kick the ball dead from a restart, and when he kicks in general play not kick the ball down the oppositions throat most of the time. Nah, can't fit him into my team and would probably give him a 2 for trying.

Losing sucks but there are plenty of positives to take from what we've seen in the last 2 games. First of all, England are a bloody good team who know their strengths and play to them, plus they've had a few more games to gel. And their defensive effort last weekend was immense. But personally, I'd rather watch the Wallabies play attacking, ball-in-hand, running footy every day of the week. It's highly entertaining and if it doesn't come off every time, I'll take it. There's a time for smart kicking but I hate the grinding, smothering tactics that teams use to win. Games determined by penalties (especially from scrums) are the worst, and are not why I love the game. We made a lot of meters running the footy, but just lacked a bit of composure and structure when it counted most. The simple handling errors were a killer, but a bit of creativity also wouldn't have gone astray. Why we don't bomb to the corners for Folau is beyond me. He's the best in the business at it and it's the first thing his team will do when he goes back to league. And he'll score a ton more tries. You could drop players left, right and center but I don't think many of the replacements will be any better. I'd love to see the Wallabies stick to the 'identity' that Cheika talked about so often at the WC so my adjustments would be: Move Fardy to no.8. He'll never be a Kieran Reid but trying to be would be a good start. Gill into 6. His form this year has been awesome and we need someone on the ball without Pocock playing. Give Skelton a half. He attracts defenders and can offload which I think would help us to be more direct and open up space out wide. Folau to OC, Haylet-Petty to FB, Hodge to the wing. Kuridrani to the bench and play as an impact (he's not fit enough for 80 mins). Give Frisby a half. Our kicking out of trouble has been awful and he's been one of the best in Super Rugby. Plus his service is as good as Phipps and you can't expect quick ball from your HB for 75 mins. I also can't wait to see Quade Cooper back in the mix. He makes mistakes and can be a liability but I love watching him play. When he gets it right it makes it all worthwhile. This series will also help the rest of our season. Hopefully we'll have learnt from some of the mistakes we've made and make us hungrier for success through the RC. Bring on the 3rd test. Wallabies to get up this time.

Wonder if they've looked at training Naiya up to be a no.8. If the want a big ball carrier he could do the job. Good chance he's played in the forwards at some point in his career.

The fans have spoken, they prefer consistency. Which means they would prefer a flyhalf who consistently delivers mediocre performances than one capable of a far broader range between mediocre (despite all the vitriol, Cooper's worst games have been no worse than Foley's ones) and absolutely sublime. The Wallabies don't necessarily need two playmakers, but they do need to ensure they have at least one.

1 Slipper 2 Moore 3 Kepu 4 Arnold 5 Horwill 6 Fardy 7 Hooper 8 Housten 9 Phipps 10 Foley 11 Horne 12 Lealiifano 13 Folau 14 Naiya 15 DHP

while the players ger marked, AUSTRALIA has moved down to 4th in the rankings and England has climbed. The Wallabies drop to fourth in the rankings while South Africa improves their rating points by 0.37. The Springboks are now on 86.03 points two adrift of England (88.50) and 10 behind world champions New Zealand (96.10) but six tenths ahead of Australia (85.43).

Not a bad team Antz. Too many changes would just disorganise the team. I would punt Morahan and bring in another lock such as Simmons or heavens forbid a backrower/Lock reserve such as D.Mumm or L.Houston. That protects locks, backrowers AND the lineout. So go back to the 6:2 bench; as the problem with the 5:3 is one injury to a backrower or lock really cuts down on replacements for the final 20 minutes and forces the coach far fewer options. Most of the backline players are multi-talented and can fill/cover more than one spot so reserves are not as essential there as in the forwards. Personally I don't think it was so much of a cattle problem (yes some players under-performed) as WB attack tactics to counter the England defence were very one dimensional.

Yes they were that bad. I am generally yo Phipps fan, but he has a habit of dishing up some shockers and he had a really bad night and deserves to be dropped, as week before whilst better he must learn to pass I front chest high of his runners. That two dig scores in a row and whilst I agree the many of the poms points were wallaby gifts, the nett is we have been really bad when it mattered....no excuses or sugar coating bad performances. Too many players playing out of positionin critical areas... We have had a massive 8 problem for a few years that can no longer be covered up, we lacked puny in the forwards and at least 1 big body in the set pieces. We must get a set of genuine fast wingers, I like Horne & Hallipetty but we need big fast wingers to exploit the edges. Foley like Phips is capable of shockers every few games, he just does make those around him look good, he was very predictable, but he is the best we have for now. Locks is 6 pf one and half dozen of another literally..other than Mumm not sure the current crop are the answer, but again they are the best we have at present. Look how many have been used in past year or 2. We still don't know who the best combinations is and neithe rdoes Chek

Phipps and Foley always play like that. They're not terribly skilful. Hard working for sure. Slow, poor passing, terrible kicking and in Foleys case nonexistent defence. If they ever play with even the merest competence, they are Hales as heroes. Gregan and Larkham, they ain't.

Horne was alright. Pulled that prop's shirt off like it was tissue paper. Let's not forget that we were missing Giteau, Genia, Beale, Toomus, Speight, Douglas, Pocock, AAC and Mitchell. Not to mention the fact that our coach is fixated on promoting Mumm ahead of Horwill, Simmons, Timani, Jones, Coleman and Higginbiotham. And he can teach Beale how to tackle and keep his shirt on but finds Quade Cooper uncoachable. No seriously, Dean Mumm? Most players don't get turned over as many times in a whole year as Mumm has in 2 tests. But he'll be picked again for the third.

Backline ratings are too high. Subtract 1 off the score for each back and you are closer to the real ratings (except Morahan who wasn't on the field long enough to evaluate).

ok except Lealiifano in for Foley

I make a mean Ragu maybe I can slot in at 8?

I was screaming for Phipps to get off the field. How we can have a #9 that can't pass is beyond me. Her was throwing them low, high, behind the player - everywhere except where he was supposed to. I think 4 is an extremely generous rating for his performance. Foley on the other hand, whilst not great, was not as bad as Phipps. Just very one dimensional.

Phipps and possibly Foley to the bench, Kuridrani rested. Mumm never to be selected again. Woeful. Moore on the bench. McCalman to start at 8 with Fardy and Hooper, but McMahon must come on for Fardy at the 50th min mark. Reece Hodge to centre with Kerevi to add some youth and flair. Folau at fullback, Haylett Petty and Horne on the wings. I wouldn't hesitate starting Lealiifano but happy with him on the bench, but if Foley has another shocker he must be put on at half time Slipper TPN Kepu Arnold Horwill Fardy Hooper McCalman Frisby Foley Horne Hodge Kerevi DHP Folau Reserves: Moore Holmes Smith Carter McMahon Phipps Lealiifano Morahan -- Comment from The Roar's iPhone app.

"Did Phipps and Foley really have that bad a game or were they just outclassed and rattled by the Poms?" I'll answer this one for the team: They really had that bad a game. I lost count of the number of passes Phipps stuffed, many of them in the opposition red zone. That has nothing to do with being 'outclassed' by the opposition and everything to do with a lack of basic skills for the position. I get tired of the apologists for him that often go 'his pass isn't the best, but he is good at sniping and cover defence'. Frankly if your pass isn't the best, you're not suitable to play halfback. Outside of that you may as well be good at cooking for all the good it's going to do.

Chris F-S might be the answer- he can perform outside an ordinary #10.

I am surprised to see such high scores.

"I don’t see how a forward pack that retained so much possession can be scored as anything lower than average, if not higher" Because the pack was consistently under pressure at line outs, even more so at scrums, turned the ball over in contact multiple times, and struggled to ever get over the advantage line with ball in hand.

I think the the majority of the ratings were fair. To "Who?'s" Comment that the average should be a lot lower and that Phipps and Foley were Poor, consider the following: The Score line doesn't tell the full story It was a close battle that ran away at the end. The English forwards rankings are 7-10 by comparison. If you put an average or struggling side up against them, they are going to look bad. Did Phipps and Foley really have that bad a game or were they just outclassed and rattled by the Poms? The England game plan was to sacrifice a man or two to shut down the 9&10 positions, and it worked! The few times Australia were able to get the ball wide there was a 2,3 and sometimes 4 man overlap. Australia didn't have the ball skills, confidence, vision, unpredictability or stamina to take advantage of these opportunities. There were at least 3 tries worth of opportunities that weren't seized. These were missed by 13, 15 and 7, yet they rated quite highly. Was this a popularity contest or an objective assessment of the players roles on the Park? Fardy, MacMahon and DHP worked their Jatz off but either went unseen or were mired by the dropsies as they fatigued near the end of the game. Arnold and MacMahon got a rest but the 5:3 Bench left an overworked Fardy dead on his feet by the end. The English press gave him a 6 and their full respect. Balanced argument aside, I wouldn't put Foley back on the field, it is CLLF's turn to shine at 10. I think Phipps did an OK job in trying circumstances and deserves to keep a spot. Frisbee does a fine job clearing the ball from the back of the Reds pack even under the pressure from the marauding kiwi sides. He has no official international experience, perhaps it's time for him to get some. Give Phipps a rest but keep him on standby if it doesn't work out.