A big week of footy is done and dusted! Plenty has happened to spark discussion over the weekend, so check out these seven talking points from the round and let us know what you think.
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» NRL talking points from the weekend
Yes, the top eight is locked
I’d say ‘never in doubt’, but I’d be lying if there weren’t a few flushes of panic for us North Melbourne fans over the past few weeks.
With the Roos’ win over St Kilda on Saturday night, however, the top eight door looks closed.
Port Adelaide, St Kilda, Melbourne and Collingwood are all still mathematically capable of making it in, but the scenarios in play would need those teams to go undefeated in the last month (or Port to win at least three), and then for other results to fall their way in a highly convenient manner.
The difference between the top eight and the rest generally this season has been consistency however, and those four teams are lacking in that area to the point where any of them getting the job done doesn’t seem plausible.
Just when you thought your job was safe
After last week’s win by Brisbane over Essendon I was 99 per cent ready to concede my bet with Ryan Buckland over whether or not we’d see a coach sacked mid-season in 2016.
After this weekend’s results though, where Richmond coughed up a an 88-point loss to GWS and the Lions took a 94-point thumping, it feels like there’s just a little bit of life left in the wager still.
Hardwick is still contracted for another two years, Leppitsch for another year. So odds are they will probably still be coaching till the end of the season, and likely in Round 1, 2017.
However, the question has to be asked how many more results like this these clubs can possibly endure, and if this is not enough to sign their papers, what will be?
Richmond, by the way, recorded their lowest score in a game in 55 years and, not that anyone was checking, are now mathematically eliminated from the finals race.
West Coast are out of the race, and the Bulldogs may be too
If you could combine West Coast’s relatively fit players list with the Bulldogs’ excellent attitude, spirit and work rate then you might have 2016’s premiership team.
Unfortunately you can’t. West Coast have been laughably poor the last three weeks running despite their list seemingly in a much better position this year than in 2015. Yes, they’re missing Nic Naitanui, and he’s important – but he doesn’t even nearly explain the difference between what they were, and what they are.
The Dogs on the other hand showed some really fight and as Seymour Skinner would say, ‘stick-to-it-ive-ness’ on Friday night but it’s hard to be competitive when you seem to have a long-term injury every five minutes.
They will still comfortably make the top eight but with Tom Liberatore and Jackson Macrae now sidelined for possibly significant amounts of time, it’ll take a truly Herculean effort to do any better than a first-week finals exit.
Cheers to the milestone men
Brent Harvey, Matthew Pavlich, Corey Enright, Jimmy Bartel. All absolute legends of the game, guaranteed future hall-of-famers, all marvellous careers.
What more can you say really? This week we celebrated arguably the greatest collection of milestones we’ve ever seen come together in a single round of footy.
The Cats got up for Boris and Jimmy, as did North for Boomer. Fremantle fell well short of celebrating Pav’s milestone with a win – in fact it was Ross Lyon’s biggest loss ever as a coach – but in the end it’s not about the winning, it’s about the respect, and there was plenty of that all around.
The Dockers’ only aim over the remaining four weeks of the season must be to get Pav five more goals so he can hit the 700 mark before he finishes up at the end of the year.
They are some of the most memorable footballers of this era and when their time to hang up the boots eventually comes, the game will be lesser for having lost them.
The Saints still need some class
As you might have heard Brian Taylor mention roughly six or seven hundred times on Saturday night, St Kilda are a great pressure team with real defensive ability, and that’s excellent to see.
Teaching your team to work hard is the first and most important building block of any rebuild and Alan Richardson and his team have done that, without a doubt.
Now it’s time to teach them to work smart – they desperately need some more class amongst the side. Right now it feels a bit blue collar, and their 8.14 scoreline on Saturday night reflected that.
Jack Billings hasn’t had the season many of us thought he would, with injuries part of the reason. He along with the likes of Blake Acres, Jade Gresham and Daniel McKenzie look like the classiest of the Saints’ young talent, and it’ll be when they step up to the elite level that this team becomes a genuine force.
Collingwood could drive a man insane
How does one proper assess this season from Collingwood? On one hand, they are hugely disappointing after so much talk of finals over the off-season. On the other hand, they’ve been kind of impressive when you look at them as what they really are, still a work in progress.
With a win over West Coast they’ve now beaten three top eight teams for the year, with Geelong and GWS the others. That’s actually more wins against top eight sides than North Melbourne or West Coast, both set to feature in September, can claim at this point of the year.
Yet their worst has just been woefully bad. Even on Saturday, with victory all but assured, they still had patches late in the game where they seemed to be begging West Coast to snatch the win away from them. There is a long way to go here.
Can Nathan Buckley – under pressure for so much of this season – guide this team into being one more consistently capable of playing it’s best footy? He will now surely get the chance to show us whether or not he can in 2017.
Is it back to ‘The Future’ for Port Adelaide?
Port’s big win at the Gabba was dominated by the quality performance of an unlikely hero – 25-year-old 197cm key forward John Butcher.
A former No.8 draft pick, once dubbed ‘The Future’ after his hot start to his AFL career, Butcher has spent the last few years in the AFL wilderness after failing to come on.
Is a bag of four goals, coupled with injury to Charlie Dixon and form struggles for Jay Schulz, a sign that ‘The Future’ has finally arrived?
No, definitely not, he was playing against Brisbane after all.
Can the Crows win the flag without Sam Jacobs?
The Crows’ big win was marred by what looks like a potentially serious ankle injury to ruckman Sam Jacobs, and if it turns out that way it could derail their quest for premiership glory.
Jacobs has played an incredible 92 consecutive games for the Crows, the second-longest current streak in the AFL (behind Sam Gibson of North Melbourne, 102).
He has come mightily close to All-Australian selection on two occasions in the past and while you wouldn’t say he’s the best ruck going around, he’s certainly one of the top few.
If he isn’t able to get up, then untried youngster Reilly O’Brien (or is it Brien O’Reilly?) is likely Adelaide’s next port of call. Heard a good thing or two about him, but it’s not a great position for a finals-bound club to be in.
Of course, this could all prove to be moot if Jacobs’ injury proves to be minor, and here’s hoping it does.
Big Joe has a big future
In a game where the Crows dominated more or less all day long, Joe Daniher was a shining light for Essendon at Adelaide Oval.
Sure, his performance had a few bad hook kicks and shots out on the full. And those are things he needs to work on. But really, given the circumstances, he’s having quite a good season, now with an equal career-high 34 goals to his name.
If you think that doesn’t really sound like a lot, consider this: No Essendon played has kicked more than 35 goals in a single season since Matthew Lloyd booted 62 in 2008. Nearly a decade ago!
With a bit of luck, Joe probably hits at least 40 goals for the season. Get a solid midfield behind him, keep working on those set shots, and he will be a beast.
bilo
Guest
Good team Andrew. No room for Boomer? Wright ahead of Mackenzie? Mac is a better kick but not a glaring omission. And Jed Anderson? I like the body work Anderson does. I saw him crunch Pendlebury a few years back playing for the Hawks and the bump on St Nick was a beauty, not to mention the chase and tackle in the 3rd qtr that potentially saved a goal.
andrew
Guest
im not going nit pick your side. respect opinion on who you think best 22 is. so you will be missing 7 of your best 22 come sat night being : adams, liberatore, wallis, murphy, mcrae, campbell, crameri of course, if boyd, suckling, morris do not get up, then this figure swells. have to wait and see on this trio i guess. norths side this week is very clear cut. waite out, daw in. north will be missing 7 of best 22. so in terms of quantity it could well be level pegging. happy to accept that quality (in raw terms) and also importance to team structure, is a sererate and subjective debate where supprorters of a given side will always have rose coloured glasses.
Perry Bridge
Guest
The irony here of course is the Doggies compared to North - last 2 seasons (2014/2015) Doggies have won 21 H&A games to North 27. Doggies 1 final to North 4. This year - both have 12 wins with little % to separate and both have and have had injury concerns. Doggies are seen as a young exciting list on the rise - North with an aged top end. Each side has it's game plan and style. Ben Jacobs has developed into a top line stopper. Would he fulfil that role in the Doggies? Not really relevant. He does for North and does it very well. He is a 1st 22 player who has been missing over half the season. Shaun Higgins - was not a Doggies reject - they would love it had it all worked out with him - and he kick 39 goals in 24 games last year at North - his best return of his career - and is a definite 1st 22 player. Sam Wright is a dependable rebound half back - the Doggies at full strength have about 15 of these type players. Luke McDonald is an improving player in that role. Taylor Garner is a shame - showed so much promise late last year including in the finals and started pretty well against Adelaide and hasn't played since Rnd 3. He had got somewhat established in the 1st 22 - playing last year from Rnd 15 through the finals and first 3 rounds this year. Holding out Mason Wood!! The reality for both North and Doggies is that the best 22 is a bit of a floating equation - the key is the best 25 or best 30. Both look to have a reasonable best 30. They've both had to draw upon their depth. North with half a team out beat Hawthorn in all aspects except accuracy in what was so close to a season defining win. North were quite 'brave' against Geelong with the injuries on the night - but - that's not the narrative that had been prepared before hand - so instead it was proof North weren't up to it. At present the Doggies are brave too. I'm just annoyed because if my North can't get there - then I'd be supporting the Doggies through the finals.
Pumping Dougie
Guest
Andrew, I think I made my point well enough above, but for the record (to answer your question) I think our Best 22 is as follows: FB: Boyd, Morris, Wood HB: Murphy, Adams, Suckling C: Hunter, Libber, JJ HF: McLean, Stringer, Dahlhaus FF: Crameri, Boyd, Dickson Foll: Roughy, Bont, Macrae Int: Campbell, Wallis, Stevens, Biggs OR Clay Smith Out: Biggs OR Clay Smith, Redpath, Picken, Dunkley, Roberts, Webb, Dale, Williams, Collins, Hrovat, Cordy, Hamling, Minson, Adcock, Roarke Smith, Prudden, Jong (all have played senior football for us in the last two seasons). I see what you're doing here, Andrew ... you're just compiling a list of who to target during the trade season. You can have Jong for free.
andrew
Guest
im not talking about who you were missing last week. i am focusing on the relative (likely) strength of the two sides this week like.....when they actuall play each other !! (and yes i am assuming you get boyd, morris, sucking back). im also not talking about which players would get a game in the other sides best 22 or not. that depends on the relative strengths and weaknesses of the side. i dont think any of your rucks/talls would get a game north, but your strengths lie elsewhere. dougie, for avoidance of doubt, can you please list the dogs best 22. im happy to do likewise for north. as below: 18, 25, 19 34, 16, 15 8, 7, 43 4, 30, 32 20, 50, 12 22, 10, 5 9, 21, 27, 14 im happy to concede crameri, but if he counts, he possibly pushes someone else you are claiming as injured out of the best 22.
Martyn
Guest
Sam Jacobs and Taylor Walker both face fitness tests ahead of Saturday night’s clash with the Brisbane Lions. Jacobs, was forced from the ground early in the second quarter of Adelaide’s win over Essendon after rolling his left ankle. GM of High Performance Brett Burton said the initial prognosis was positive. “It’s obviously only early still... but it was relatively minor,” he said. Walker, who is also nursing a minor ankle injury, missed the 82-point win over the Bombers. https://outlook.live.com/owa/?n=61375149&path=/mail/inbox/rp
Macca
Guest
" think it is just sour grapes and an urban myth at best." You have a former umpire admitting the crowd makes them second guess themselves - it is more than an urban myth. The umpiring dept can review the decisions as much as they like but when you have 40K screaming at you and you have a split second to make a decision sometimes you perceive things differently to when you review the tape 2 days later - umpires are human, home teams get a better run - it isn't a conspiracy or even a complaint, it is just a fact of life.
gameofmarks
Roar Guru
Well if that's the case, ie umpiring decisions are being influenced by the WCE home crowd, the umpiring panel aren't doing their job properly and reviewing these games closely and sanctioning umpires giving erroneous free kicks to WCE. I find it hard to believe that, if this is the case, it would continue to be prevalent amongst the umpires for very long as it would affect their standing in the pecking order and their chances of getting to umpire finals. I think it is just sour grapes and an urban myth at best. It is usual for sides that are being flogged on the park that they will give away more free kicks than the side that has possession of the ball the majority of the time.
Pumping Dougie
Roar Guru
gameofmarks, I'm still happy with our recruitment of T.Boyd. I think anyone who is a good judge of a footballer should recognise T.Boyd is progressing pretty well for a 20 year old 2m player. I'm confident he will become a gun key forward for us, but not before 2018. (He's on a 7 year contract, so to see him star for the last 4 years of his contract will still be good value to the club IMO.)
Pumping Dougie
Roar Guru
Assuming North only win a maximum of 2 of their last 4 games (against Doggies, Hawks, Swans and GWS), even if the Doggies lose 2 of their last 4 games (against North, Pies, Essendon and Freo), the Doggies will finish 6th and West Coast 7th. We might be injury-ravaged, but playing West Coast in Victoria the first week of the finals is the best scenario we could hope for (given that we won't finish top 4 now) - we're due some fortune!
gameofmarks
Roar Guru
I would take a Redpath (without the knee problems) over a T. Boyd any day of the week. Boyd will turn out to be the biggest waste of money IMO.
Pumping Dougie
Roar Guru
Cheers Macca. Yeah, I'm not sure about Redpath, from a team balance point of view. We definitely need a player offering that role to support T.Boyd and Stringer. On the weekend, Hamling played that aerial contest role, but wasn't very threatening or effective and was useless once it went to ground. I think the combination of Tom Campbell and Roughy as rucks/forwards gives us the best option. But the alternative to Campbell is Redpath. I think Big Red needs to add more mobility and nastiness defensively to be a lock for the team. But for a bloke who's only played 25 career games, he's done well. Poor bloke is now having his third knee reconstruction.
Macca
Guest
Yeah sorry I keep forgetting that even though I read the article for free it won't let me share it. The article also had a quote from a former umpire who said that the crowd gets umpires "second guessing" because even when they pay an obvious against the home team they get booed ferociously - the same would apply if they missed the most minute free I imagine.
Macca
Guest
Pumping Dougie - I wouldn't call Redpath debateable - I love what I have seen from him this year and I think he will be sorely missed.
Pumping Dougie
Roar Guru
Andrew, you've gotta be kidding. Talk about 'one-eyed'. On the weekend the Doggies were missing 10 of their best 22. Now we've lost 2 more: Bob Murphy, M.Boyd, Morris (three All Australians), Libber (2014 B&F), Macrae (25+ possessions per game last 3 seasons, DE 72.7%), Wallis, Suckling (dual premiership player), Crameri (30+ goals last 5 seasons in a row), Adams, Toby McLean, Redpath and Campbell. I concede, the last two are debatable as to whether they are in our Best 22 or not. The rest are 'locks'. We are now at Essendon levels of blokes out, except we don't have "top-up" players. Of the North blokes missing that you've listed, Waite is the only bloke who would be a certainty to get a game in our Best 22. Mason Wood and Luke McDonald would be contenders but no certainties.
I hate pies
Guest
Dogs have 9 of their best players out injured. North has also-rans and old men out; it's a big difference.
I hate pies
Guest
Thanks Macca. For those who don't know how to cheat the system to read that article, it says that West Coast's positive free kicks differential is 3 x more than its nearest rival. In an nutshell, the umpires there are either incapable of copping flack or they're biased. Probably the former.
Pope Paul VII
Guest
I know this too well Andrew but the rules are; 1. Only WB get's sympathy for injuries and 2. North are old pretenders. The good news is Majak should get a decent run while Waitey is out. Anyway got to be ruthless against the dogs.
Pope Paul VII
Guest
Actually I can't argue with that. As you indicate, more than plenty has to go right for the chasers. Would be nice to see pressure on the old Hawks though and I think they'll get it on the field at least.
Macca
Guest
"You can only beat who you play against." True but you can be much more convincing than the Eagles have been.