All Black number 8 options post-Kieran Read

Hey Carlin. Interesting article. I reckon the next four years after this year’s World Cup will be interesting. The All Blacks depth will be tested and the no.8 position is up for grabs. Kieran Read has been amazing for so long and in my opinion, he is one of the all-time great no.8s. I reckon Akira Ioane might be the man for the job, but there are concerns about his attitude apparently.

That suffocating is easily our number one issue. Lions did it, Ireland did it, boks did it and England nearly did it. The good thing is we just carried on playing our more open game, trying things for later on. What hasnt been unleashed by Hansen is our own beat em up approach as we did in Dublin. Cut the slack and hit them up through the middle until they break. I think he may resort to that in the world cup knockouts, and will select one or two tests before the tournament to practise it. He may have given up on trying to beat sides through skill and will leave that to the future coaches, instead ensuring his swansong is a success and perhaps showing them all how to best play the way theyre all trying to. Be a bit boring, but would be funny to watch others A games being beaten by a B one.????

True, for me the Barretts continue to surprise though, theyre made of tough stuff and dont shirk the physical or decision making stuff. They contribute positively and get involved, thats common to all three. Theyre also gifted, and almost as error prone but in terms of reaching that space where McCaw and Kaino lived in as loosies, Im not sure Barrett has that in him, but as 6 and lock cover hes easily the best at the moment, a genuine international lock to back up the main two.

No one stands out as obvious but in terms of the Savea Cane situation we need both back in time for the world cup. I still maintain Canes missing defensive prowess was key to the Ireland loss. Savea played well but the way the game played out required Canes punishing offensive tackling and heavy workload in the tight plays to keep the Irish honest. I think we underste Canes importance because hes often hidden in the dark areas doing the work few others can. Savea is faster on the ball, more visible, and appeals to the kiwi rugby psyche but in the caukdron of a semi or final in Japan, Id much prefer Cane. Akira promises much but thats all I see. He has the propensity to go missing and as the writer mentions, niggle, usually unnecessarily. He needs maturing as a player and although we are seeing him involved more, the maturity isnt developing as quickly. He has the potential, theres that word again, to blow the world cup open if the ABs can get the upper hand in more areas than not, but for me he’ll need some convincing on the maturity stakes. With maturity comes the clarity and focus he’ll need to perform at World cup winning levels. Still dont understand why Cane, or even Savea, cant be considered 6 options if the plethora of 6’s being tried there over two years. I can easily see a Read, Savea, Cane backrow. Might be a lack of height but Read represents the loosies well enough at lineout time and Barrett is a good covering bench option for lock and 6. Otherwise we are banking a lot on one or more of Frizzell, Hemopo and Fifita. Must admit I havent watched Luke W closely enough but he seems to have been around for a very long time and not made his mark. If Cane and Savea are not both available at world cup time, our struggle to nail our loosies and midfield could be our achilles in Japan. No problem with any other position, or the bench, we bat deep in most positions. Right winger might be an issue now, it wont be at the tournament.

Really enjoyed the article. Papali'i is a player who really grabs one's attention - presence/mana? If he has a background at 8 I like his body shape for that role, although he also looks like a good northern hemisphere style 7 (unusual for NZ). Ardie plays well at 8 but I think he gives more at 7. I do wonder if Evans might give most of what Whitelock provides plus Evans has a real burst of speed off the back of the scrum. There are no real stand-outs (although all are at least very good) though, which is surprising to me. I wondered if Cane might have gone well at 8, because of his smarts, with Ardie at 7. The neck injury really raises huge issues about Cane's longevity in the game, sadly.

As a Kiwi I tend to worry about that physicality factor. We seem to do skills and fast feet so well, but watching the Sharks and Bulls in the weekend what I saw was brutality. One off runners x100. If you take the Crusaders skills for granted (which we shouldn't of course) the most important thing they did against the Chiefs was accurate clean outs. Every team that hasn't spent the last four years building depth and planning something new in the way they play is going to bring the easiest alternative, which is defence. Fast, in your face, physical defence and flood the breakdown with flailing feet and arms. McCaws tackle count was almost always top 3 and Kaino's right shoulder was concrete. Is Barrett either of those guys?

Good article Carlin, the bigger question is the back row balance. Kaino, McCaw and now Read. What a back row we had in their prime. Akira is the obvious technical choice in the long run. Everyone sees his enormous potential but what we don't know are the hidden attributes; is he teachable? is the ambition there? It would be great to see him blossom into that which everyone can see waiting in the wings. I was watching highlight reels of Richie last night (just because we can) and was reminded just how relentless he was, how aware of where to be and how he turned up at that place with 100% commitment. Does Akira have that engine?

Savea? Doubtful. Best year is certainly valid and with Cane still missing Savea's value will be at openside. Disagree with Finn as Ardie has been dynamic at the breakdown although I agree he can add value wider on attack. Akira is an enigma isn't he. Also dynamic he carries well, if a little upright in contact, but is also an able distributor. He does need to maintain focus on core roles though and enters the fray too often. And another forward who cab excel a little wider. Whitelock seems to be a genuine contender. Nothing too flashy but solid in most aspects of his game and a genuine leader. He is also a better line-out option. And he already has some time under his belt in the black shirt. But he will need to add to his game to become a regular. The reality is that Kieren has made this position his own and his body of work makes him arguably the best 8 the All Blacks have ever had. Whomever inherits his shirt will have a lot to live up to but the caveat will be allowing the next incumbent to develop and stamp their own skills on the position.

What does he lack in terms of the abilities of a number 8, aside from perhaps a bit of weight? I certainly think he’s better at ball running in tight and in the wider channels than he is at the breakdown.

Hansen doesnt believe Ardie is a genuine 8 and i agree with him. He doesnt have the general all round game of an 8. Keep him at 7 where hes superb. The one you missed out on is Gareth Evans. He was superb in his only test last year, albeit against Japan and was superb for the Canes last year at 7 and 8. He had the most turnovers last year of any Hurricane. Fast, athletic, smart and big. Hes my pick for 8 in competition with Akira.