Playing dual openside flankers in Australian rugby is a practice dating back to at least as early as when George Smith and Phil Waugh played together under Eddie Jones, coinciding with when Australia stopped winning Bledisloe and the Rugby World Cup.
This has been long enough to demonstrate that the practice can never be more than a short-term fix for a team lacking in other aspects of their game, which ultimately comes unstuck against the best teams.
The short-term fix that dual opensides can achieve for a team is to facilitate a supreme defensive game. The high work rates and pilfering ability of a good No. 7 are doubled, starving the opponent of the ball and halting their attack.
We have seen it work several times in the last five years, including the Wallabies in the games leading up to and including the 2015 World Cup final and the Queensland Reds in the 2020 Rugby AU competition. On each occasion teams employing dual opensides played well until the final match of the tournament, when the strategy was unpicked by the best team in the competition and they were beaten.
In the finals against the All Blacks and ACT Brumbies both teams buried the pilferers under big ball runners and efficient cleanouts, effectively kicked when they loomed as a threat or played the ball away from the pilferers, making good use of the short side.
The second Brumbies try of the Super Rugby AU final was a masterful example of this. First Reds captain Liam Wright was targeted, buried under 123-kilo lock Cadyrn Neville. The Brumbies then passed away from looming Fraiser McReight towards the blindside, making ground through centre Tevita Kuridrani and the forwards. They then spun the ball back out to the right away from McReight and to Kuridrani again, who made another bullocking run, setting up flyhalf Noah Lolesio for some smart footwork and an offload to winger Andy Muirhead to deliver the coup de grace. Both Reds opensides were completely neutralised.
With the advantages of dual opensides being able to be nullified, only the disadvantages are left to consider. The first disadvantage is that with a traditional shorter openside the lineout is likely to be compromised. The All Blacks ruthlessly exploited this against the Wallabies in the 2015 World Cup final.
The second disadvantage is lost physicality, which is required across a range of scenarios, including in the tackle, at the defensive and offensive breakdown, in the maul and when running in traffic. Adding an extra pilferer and perhaps a slightly higher tackle rate during a game does not make up for this critical work in the highly physical game of rugby.
Some opensides may be able to offset one of these disadvantages. For example, Reds captain Liam Wright is an excellent lineout jumper and Wallaby David Pocock was as physical as many No 6s No. 8s, but neither of these players has been able to fully offset the disadvantages of their unsuitable body type for those positions.
The reason Australia has continually used dual opensides lies in statistics. Men measuring 183 centimetres make up about 14 per cent of the Australian male population, while 193-centimetre men make up about one or two per cent. There are simply many more men in Australia who are of a suitable build competing to play No. 7 than there are to play at Nos. 6 or 8.
Add to this competition for this body type from rugby league (and AFL early in development) and that these players are often required to fill in at lock and it is no wonder Australia has a hard time finding elite big loosies.
The issue is that surrendering to this statistical reality and selecting a second Bo. 7 at Nos. 6 or 8 simply hasn’t worked, so Australian coaches and rugby administrations need another strategy.
In the short term the development of our current large loose forwards should be a priority, including maximising game time in these positions. The temptation to start two excellent opensides just because a team has them should be avoided because a good big loosie will ultimately play their position better than a great openside.
The question that selectors should have on their lips when deciding whether to play a larger player is: would I be worried about the need to select this genuine blindside or No. 8 if a second excellent openside wasn’t available? If not, the hard choice to select the larger player should be made.
In the longer term this body type should be made the number one priority for investment by state union and Rugby AU funding. These sorts of players are critically important to Australian rugby if they are good enough – think the likes of Sergio Parise or Kieran Reid – so the strategy should be highly marketable to the fans.
MO
Guest
Fair enough but the lineout should have been okay with Arnold, Rodda/Coleman/LSL/Simmons and Nairsarani. Pocock still came up with some big plays. Funnily enough Scott Fardy was still in good form in 2019. He'd have been handy for a world cup swan song.
MO
Guest
Hugh McMeniman?
MO
Guest
the height and weight stats on players do seem a bit rubbery but on a six foot frame going from 100 to 110 fits pretty well. Agree it is hard to tell. Scary thing for normal people is that James O'Connor and Nick White are pretty big blokes in the real world.
MO
Guest
A guy like FLW or RHP should seriously consider going to a place like Japan where their size will be a good bonus. If it wasn't for the Force LeeWarner may still be playing first grade in Sydney instead of at least bumping heads in GRR, NRC and now super rugby oz. Hard to see LeeWarner breaking into the Tahs as they already have a few guys his size and shape.
stillmissit
Roar Guru
MO: that is just part of the mystery of selections. Many try, few make it and others pick up who we dismiss and make something out of them. Too many examples to list here. We have a major coaching and selection issue which I am hoping we get addressed in the next couple of years.
Train Without A Station
Roar Guru
Have to laugh at a bloke saying Hooper is too small. Then recommending the even smaller Will Miller.
Train Without A Station
Roar Guru
MO I suspect they would have, simply because players generally do have defined roles. Pocock would have primarily been a cleaner. Doesn't mean he didn't carry. if needed or if he was set up and a hole opened, just if 3 players in a pod set up equally, he would slot into a support/clean position trailing the lead runner. Pocock really hurt the line out, and doesn't offer a strong carrying game. At his peak he offered excellent breakdown work, good linking and a decent hole running game. But with all 3 of them diminished I feel his work as a grafter in 2019 wasn't enough to overcome the weaknesses it gave the team.
Train Without A Station
Roar Guru
Yeah poor mugs like be running around getting folded like a deck chair by him all weekend :laughing:
MO
Guest
He's a fitness nut though. Probably terrifying 10's in a country comp.
MO
Guest
Hi TWAS just a reminder of the 2019 cleanout stats. It was all Pocock and Arnold. Would Pocock's replacement in 2019 have done that cleanout work? I reckon our best RWC 2019 back row was Pocock, Isi and Hooper. We had a rare opportunity to have AAA, Kepu and Tupou as three of four props and NSW/Cheika/luck blew it coz Kepu wasn't left to finish his career at loosehead. Who was that guy going to be anyway. Samu injured at an in opportune time (and not really used as a clean out expert), McCaffery passed over. Dempsey injured most of the year and I'd have picked Pocock instead.
soapit
Roar Guru
mate, im pretty sceptical. i did think he was heavier than 100 but when you look at the guys who are also 115 it seems a lot. who knows tho.
MO
Guest
I think early career Pocock was around that 100kg mark. Later career Pocock looked a good 10kgs heavier to me. When I heard he was 115kg I thought it could be right. Muscle is heavy and it looked to me like he put on a bit of it.
MO
Guest
Fionn I'd add that the team which matched up best on the Saffers was the Welsh who had a "small" back row. Dual 7's or 61/2s can work okay. Getting the unit right is important. I think they need to consider at an earlier age whether a big slightly under (ball) skilled centre is better suited to 6 at international level. The leaguies have almost given up on positions and move the locks, centres etc around a lot.
MO
Guest
Taqele Naiyaravoro should have been diverted to playing 8 not become a battleship type winger. They seem prepared to switch centres to 7 but why not 8s? Pocock was a school boy centre as was Tizzano. Guz Bell and big Pone have the size and ball running of a 6 or 8. I don't know if Bell can catch in the lineout but he has speed so he should be able to jump. Consider giving Uelese time at tighthead at state level and moving AAA back to loosehead.
MO
Guest
SMI, Fergus LeeWarner (from NSW) got recruited by the Force to play lock so he may never be able to develop as a six. He's a good small lock but is not getting any real experience at 6. The Force have/had the Samoan rep Henry Stowers at 6 and he's pretty good but that doesn't help FLW spend time at 6. Ross HaylettPetty is about the right size but for whatever reason he never quite made it.
Laith
Guest
All the good 193 cm 195 cm athletes go to the NRL.
MO
Guest
there are some big centre back kinda soccer players. Guys who are 6 ft 4 and fast. Basketball is big in Europe. I presume but don't know there is a bit of it the UK. England have a bigger population than Auz and NZ. Saffers/dutch are naturally very tall. Seems like there are a lot of tall slavic people around too. You are right that in Oz AFL is king and plenty of kids like basketball. A good 16 year old will be aggressively courted by the AFL and by US colleges. More Aussies than ever playing well in college system and NBA and they are tall and mostly built like middleweight boxers.
Laith
Guest
We have big loose forwards but with Hooper at 7 they will leave for overseas.Big 6s and 8's wont play with hooper as he is a massive detriment to them. They are the first to get sacked when the team plays poorly whilst Hooper is untouchable.
Patrick Brennan
Roar Rookie
Darcy Swain of the Brumbies is 6ft 7ins, 113 kgs and currently plays lock. Darcy is 23 yrs old. He is fiercely combative, does very well at the 'dark arts', is surprisingly mobile and a skilled operator in lineouts. Somebody somewhere should check his skill set and possibly try to convince him that he should try to play No 6.
Kiwi Bob
Guest
Good point about the NRL wingers. I can't believe the Reds just blew a huge chunk of their salary cap on Vunivalu. Absolutely disgraceful and shoots the bird at the young guys in the Qld rugby program. There is a kid at my sons school and he was a flyhalf till last year when he grew four inches in eight months and is now 6'4". The boy has mad rugby skill and is an incredible sportsman plays basketball, AFL, soccer, cricket and represents the school in league. I asked him if he was going to play for our club again next year and he shrugged and said he only wants to play footy if he can run with the ball and didn't think being a forward in union would provide that. His dad as I understand it was an ex Reds forward so I imagine there are lots of discussions at home. Back home the choices wouldn't loom as large in the decision as every kid wants to be an All Black.