Tuqiri to fight ARU sacking

Leftie, thats exactly what I mean. You almost relish the fact Lotes Cuzz is out of form? The facts are the bloke is 20 years old and didnt have a preseason due to injury....but go ahead, write off his career if you like. Tru Tah, you may well be right but thats not my point. All I am saying is, our countries best say that bloke like Lote and Dell lifted the expectation on conditioning of our outside backs....whos better to judge that? You or Latho etc?

Sportsmouth, I am a contractor, thus I work on on time and pay based contracts - not unlike a sports contract (They are both employment contracts). I have also employed contractors and guess what - regardless of the status of the employee (contractor, full-time, part-time etc) you can still get sacked, you simply can not have a "you can't sack me" clause in the contract. My point was that maybe he was just an underperforming (of late) employee and a management decision was made to remove him and redistribute the capital through employing other workers. Which, as the ARU email stated, makes this merely an employment issue and therefore not a public issue. The ARU are right to let Lote and his beaks decide how public the reasons are made.

mattamkil maybe spending too much time in the weights room was Lote's problem, spending too much time on his guns and not enough on his speed??

the Tuqiri clan seems to really be in the wars. Cousin Nasi's star has vanished too!!! As predicted, just a big baby who was not serious about his rugby!!!!! great at grade level and that is where he will end up.

both James and Westy highlight important points that I have mentioned many times (although they are from differing sides). The fact is NRL converts will never be Rugby Boys in the eyes and hearts of many Union Rah Rahs, or tools as I like to call them. If Lote, Matt Rogers or even Dell had gone to the right schools and never been near a NRL pitch everyone would have loved them - no questions asked. As it stands, many Union Tools can see past a persons background so the NRL boys need to 1) never drop their form 2) never do anything wrong 3) be 10% better than anyone from a privileged background - Then maybe one day they will be accepted 100% by the Union Tool society. I love and play union and consider the best game to ever be invented. But sometimes I am ashamed of the bitter, narrow minded 'eastern suburbs or north shore' attitudes a section of my fellow fans have. The truth is both Lote and Dell changed aussie rugby forever. I remember hearing Latho (considered the best by most) talking about how the attitude in the weights room changed the minute Dell turned up at the reds.

Jameswm The old reds under the beds routine,blaming Lote's rl background.Next we will have rl blamed for the GFC/global warming. Suggest you maybe check the background of Mr C Shepherd(who was a Wallaby) involving damage to a car, not that long ago.Funny no rl background.Surely he must have handled a Steeden somewhere along the line. Players have to take responsibiltiy for their actions.They are over 18 years of age,they are eligible age wise to fight in wars. Blaming a former code smacks of pomposity ,and the usual "get out" clause.Heard and read it all before,and just roll my eyes.

VV I agree with your sentiments.We (society) have a deep seated problem with abuse of alcohol and "social" drugs.We also have a society where corporal punishment in the schools is a no no.You have to be PC and not spank on the bottom a misbehaving child,Discipline went out the door in the pre teens.Is it any wonder by the time,youth has finished the HSC,they go on the fortnightly binge at Surfers or wherever .Great breeding grounds for alcohol abuse,and anti social behaviour.I see graffiti everywhere,it is considered by some as artistry.And sometimes parents quite willingly provide the kids with alcohol to fuel their needs.The same parents perhaps who look down their nose,to what happens with sports' people. People wonder why people including sports people in all codes repeat all codes(yet some will deny it),adopts this attitude in the ME society. Based on what has happened over the past few years bankers/politicians/clergy/sportspersons/police/lawyers/developers/financiers/media/musicians etc etc are hardly paragons of virtue,and certainly to be held up as role models is a bit rich. I do not consider myself a role model,simply because I have fallen short of the standards one would expect.But a good kick up the backside or the use of the cane,solved my problem fairly quickly.IOW the school of hard knocks. That is why I agree ,the moral posturing appears rather hollow.

"Has anyone made the point yet that Lote - sacked for presumably alcohol-related breaches - is an ex-Leaguie? And that this could reflect back on the League mindset he was first exposed to?" Jameswm - i've seen some long bow's drawn on this site, but this is one of the best. Poor Rugby, try all they might for 7 years they just couldn't drum that mungo out of him. Watch out for those League players hiding in your cupboards and under your beds. And don't worry Tahu, Barnes, Elsom, Rugby likes you now, but when you fall, they now who you REALLY are. What would anyone want to switch to Rugby with rubbish like this?

Not one of the posts has alluded to the problem of binge drinking. The problem is not limited to Sports people. It is symptomatic of our societ. As a parent with Teenage kids many of you will grapple with this same problem. It is also counterproductive to have a leaguies was union argument. It is further pompous to say the Lotes and Symonds of this world should know they are role models. This is abrogating the responsibility we all have as parents and community neighbours. Neither Lote or Martyn or any of the league players set themselves up as role models. The corporatisation of sport has its own attendant evils. Complex questions need reasoned answers and an absence of moral posturing. These comments are offered as a sports lover and not as an expert in any field.

Has anyone made the point yet that Lote - sacked for presumably alcohol-related breaches - is an ex-Leaguie? And that this could reflect back on the League mindset he was first exposed to? I don't think you can lump Tahu in with Lote. Tahu's a good player in a different position - one occupied by the Wallaby captain. Lote had his moments of being the best winger in the world. I still think they should have been breeding him for the back row. And yes League is of course an option, but he'd make more from playing rugby in Japan or France.

So given all that, how about this for a possibility? Maybe the company (ARU) is facing some hard times and has decided to retrench a well paid but under performing employee, to reduce overheads? Could it be that simple? No Rabbitz, it can't be that simple he has a contract which according to the rumour mill they tried to buy out, he refused so they sack him! You may be able to retrench in the normal workforce but I think you'll find unless they've got a good reason they can't just sack the man!

Westy, Thank you for these figures. I don't have a problem with posters taking an adverse view of Lote's recent form, but when it descends to the level of denying his past achievements, then Rugby and its supporters have sunk to a new low. Some of the comments on this thread have been stupid, there is no other word for them: One poster wrote "Tuqiri couldnt even get his head around the basics of rugby …" – In view of Lote's achievements that better describes the person who wrote this! And: "Let this be the last of the converts. Tahu must be shaking in his boots. The ARU have done waht they could in the last 9 years to promote rugby league its time they gave up and concentrated on union again." – What rubbish. There will be many more converts and Rugby will be the richer for them. The comparison to Jonah Lomu is irrelevant – Lomu was not available to play for Australia. Lote was, and in his day was one of the most significant wingers to don the Wallaby jersey. If its time for him to go now, then so be it, but only fools denigrate his past achievements.

Better to wait for the facts to emerge before passing any opinion on this.

westy - I agree , mind you IMO I did not think that highly of Roff at intl level. Lote strike rate is not far below that of Campese our best winger ever. At his best Lote was very good. However he has not been at his best for a while.

If Lote has clearly breached his contract then there are consequences . What i do not like is the complete ridicule of his ability. of the 86 tests Joe roff played for the wallabies and in order of top 5 countries he scored 5 against Romania, 5 against SA , 4 against Argentina 3 against NZ and 3 against Scotland. Lote in his 67 tests scored the same number of 30 test tries 6 against Scotland, 5 against SA , 5 against NZ . 4 against England and 4 against Italy. Joe played 17 tests against the NZ and scored 3 tries. Joe played 15 tests against the SA and scored 5 tries. Lote played 14 tests against the NZ and scored 5 tries, Lote played 14 tests against SA and scored 5 tries I do not wish to be seen to diminish Joe Roff's record . But I do wish to highlight that lote's ain't half bad either. Some people do not remember the mumblings in Joe's day that it was a long break between drinks sometimes or was it that we had no one better towards the end of his career.

Couple of things or three Thankyou Lote, 67 tests, there are many that would have loved to say they have that under their belt. You weren't my favourite player but hey I am an old front rower and was always pissed off when getting out of a ruck or maul and seeing wingers going in directions i couldn't follow. But hey i trust the coaches of the time and they thought you were there......btw loved it when you played flanker in the world cup. Thankyou ARU and JON. For running ARU in a far more constructive way than we have had for some time. For having the balls to say when time is time to a player.....who is more importantly an employee therefore ARU pull the strings not the player etc. I dont need to know all the info, you do your job, when i want your job and all the details i'll come and get it (well you know what i mean I'll get the PM job first its easier). Having been very very close to community rugby for many years and others know this, the current generation coming through (socially not just rugby) have an attitude of 'I believe i am good enough and therefore i will be playing (doing) what i want', I believe i am good enough therefore i am. We (as Society) have spent years empowering people to believe this ....fine and good for the soul apart from the bit where we forgot to tell them that also means to take responsibility for themselves. So ARU made a decision...at last I can show the ramification of action to players....no more pussyfooting. May not be the commercially perfect thing and yes the dollar means something (a big thing) but its not everything. I'd rather be involved (give 30 odd hours a week voluntary) in a sport giving to society than having a focus on every player being a wallaby because THEY think so....Its life boys get out there and earn it

Stash don't be silly.....................Berrick Barnes will do.

Hmmm... if the ARU are throwing away players... any chance of throwing Giteau in the direction of the All Blacks until Dan Carter's fixed?

ARU better have a damn good reason. Whilst im no Lote fan, the whole situation seems a big bloody shame not just for Lote but for Waratahs fans, Wallabies fans, players and the ARU. Apprently the tahs were in agreement of his termination (or more likely told that that is what they WILL be doing). The tahs biggest draw card by a long way and theyre want to get rid of him ? Either something very serious or being told that that is the ways things will happen. Whilst I have no idea what caused it, i feel sorry for Lote. He might not have been the best winger in australia but the guy tried hard and did his best for his country. to treat him like thats disgraceful. When they have no more use for him, chew him up and spit him out.

Well said westy...be ready for the assault.. you just bad mouthed "roffie".