How will Smith and Thurston be rated in rugby league history?

When answering the question How will Smith and Thurston be rated in rugby league history? By the looks of the comments in this section, Cameron Smith's indiscretions will be totally disregarded in Rugby League history. While he is most certainly the most talented hooker I have ever seen play the game, too many people, some of which would turf Joey Johns out of the list because he liked to use recreational drugs, are quite happy to overlook the golden boy Smith's indiscretions. We should remember that Smith was the captain of the Melbourne Storm when the biggest salary cap scandal took place and subsequently they were stripped of everything. You can't tell me these players didn't know anything, but alas the NRL and the Police/Tax department didn't even try to look. We should remember that Smith was the captain of the Melbourne Storm, who under coach Craig Bellamy effectively had a new Rugby League dictionary created as a result of their grubby wrestling tactics, sliding tactics a tackling tactics that forced the NRL to coin then outlaw. Now in any other circumstance you would praise a team for changing the game and forcing the NRL to change rules because of the dominance brought on by new and improved tactics. But lets remember these tactics were outlawed because they were deliberately designed to injure other players. You could in a lot of cases lump that blame on the coach. But when the captain of your side is also the captain of the country, has managed to somehow get every referee in the country to look the other way to your indiscretions, give favorable treatment over every other captain in the game, you have the ability, if you have the integrity to stand up and say "this isn't my game and I wont do it!" Did Smith do this? Of course not, not only did he not have the integrity to tell his coach he wasn't going to "Chicken Wing" "Crusher Tackle" "Leg Twist" and the like, he actively participated in it. It got so bad, and even with every referee in the game giving him favorable treatment, he was eventually rubbed out of a Grand Final!!!! You have to do something pretty bad or be doing something for a bloody long time to be rubbed out of a grand final..... ACTIVELY PLAYING TO INJURE OTHER PLAYERS WITH GRUBBY TACTICS! As for Thurston, a class act that I can only put in the category of Sterling, Johns, Lewis, Kenny and Locky when it comes to ball in hand. His defence over the years has left him well below the likes of Johns and Lewis and it showed in the 2008 RLWC final. He spat his dummy out and all that were at the ground at Suncorp that night saw it. Locky was left to lift the team and tried his guts out until the end while JT sulked and whinged when things went against us. So many times since has he made up for that day and rightly sits in the upper echelon of playmakers. Though for reasons stated he sits slightly behind Johns, Sterling, Kenny, Lewis and Locky in my book.

Great list of 5/8 I would have Daley above Fittler .

Questioning the integrity of the game, swearing and abusing referees and not to mention his little adventure in Coffs

Agree. Next tier Cliffy Walters Lamb Tier below Florimo Filipana Alan Thompson Jason Smith

Lockyer redefined the position of fullback. I'm surprised that people have been so dismissive of Fittler these days. I remember back when he was a standout player for dominant NSW and Roosters teams. They were far less scary when he wasn't there.

I think that Cliff Lyons was very underrated, but I don't think he belongs in that company. Maybe around the top of the next tier with blokes like, say, Kevin Walters?

I love Freddy, but there's no way I would put him above Brett Kenny or Lockyear. Best 5/8th's I've seen in order: Wally Kenny Lockyear Freddy Daley Thurston Cliff Lyons

Lovely comment considering we are on internet.

Thurston is fantastic when playing of the back of good players. Smith makes average players look good. Smith would be my first pick because the attack starts from the ruck. Smith rarely gets it wrong.

Anyone who thinks that Smith, Thurston and Lockyer are/were made to look better than they really were because of the players around them has got it backwards.

I would have Smith above Thurston, but this list is pointless if it doesn't feature Johns. I am happy to discuss whether Johns is better than Lewis, or even better than Alfie or Sterlo. But if he's not in the top 20 there's no point even trying to discuss it with you. How you have Fitler above Lockyer (or Johns) is a disgrace.

Yeah Mal seems to have a golden spot in the hearts of the people, fair enough but not the great he's made out to be. Def not within cooee of Smith and Thurston. (And I'm and Qlder if it's relevant)

Lockyer was a 5/8 who transitioned to fullback than back to 5/8 . The games I watched him play pre super league were at 5/8 when Kevvie was injured . I figure the coach wanted both in the team. Pretty obvious who would be the better option at Fullback

Both incredible players. But for me Smith is about as a good a player I have seen. He has been great right through his career. Super consistent, never injured his record speak for itself. Thurston ain't half bad either. Both will be regarded as legends of the game.

Hi David, Cameron Smith is already the best hooker I've seen & Jonathan Thurston is the best halfback/five-eight I've seen. Unfortunately we can't compare Smith directly with past hookers in terms of his quickness in striking for the ball in the scrum, as that is a lost art. But his play at dummy-half is unmatched. Australia has never possessed a hooker as skilful as Smith. Thurston is better than Johns in my view. Yes, there is a perceived weakness in his tackling, but that's it. Otherwise, he trumps Johns in all the skills. Admittedly, there's not much in it. The best Kangaroos of my time, 1967-present 2nd team after '/': 1-Graeme Langlands/Billy Slater 2-Ken Irvine/Eric Grothe snr or Andrew Ettingshausen 3-Reg Gasnier/Mick Cronin or Steve Rogers 4-Mal Meninga/Bob Fulton 5-Greg Inglis/Kerry Bousted or Mick O'Connor 6-Wally Lewis (c)/Darren Lockyer 7-Jonathon Thurston/Andrew Johns 8-Arthur Beetson (vc)/Noel Kelly 9-Cameron Smith/Danny Buderus or Steve Walters 10-Glenn Lazarus/Shane Webcke 11-Bob McCarthy/Steve Menzies or Gorden Tallis 12-Ron Coote/Bob Lindner or Terry Randall 13-John Raper/Brad Clyde or Ray Price Bench: 14-Bob Fulton (can cover centre & 5/8, other players can cover elsewhere) 15-Andrew Johns (can cover halfback & hooker) 16-Noel kelly (can cover prop & hooker) 17-Terry Randall (can cover 2nd row & prop) Randall was specifically chosen for his ability to cover 2nd row & prop, rather than pick a specialist 2nd rower (e.g., Steve Menzies or maybe Bob Lindner) or a specialist prop (e.g., Shane Webcke).

He was at the Bulldogs when they rorted the cap in 2002. They had very good depth from 2002 - 2004.

A great analysis of both men's strengths & weaknesses. Not unhappy with your rankings! But what does say is that BOTH Mal Meninga & Norm Provan MUST be elevated to Immortal Status ahead of these two!

...I think Ben said rorting, not rooting...

*cough coffs*

That's cool homie. Never gonna agree on everything ?? I do rate Locky highly. I just always think Freddie gets a raw deal cause of his goose persona