Shute Shield never asked for Nick Phipps

Australian rugby pushes the promising players to Uni out of school. So still not an even playing field.

Thank you for your kind reply, which I'm afraid addressed none of the concerns I raised regarding the original article. Your insistence on bringing up Israel Folau is interesting, especially as he has NEVER played a game for Sydney Uni, and is therefor a "straw man" argument when we are (or so I thought) discussing Super rugby players returning to club rugby. Folau originally linked with Sydney Uni on the proviso that, together, a scholarship was established to support a young rugby player of Tongan heritage. This seems reasonable, as we should be looking to remove barriers to education that do unfortunately exist. However, he perhaps may have done more good for rugby NSW, and for players of Polynesian heritage, had he been aligned to a Western suburbs club - not to play rugby, but as you say, to promote the game to an area which no doubt has an abundant of talent looking for a home. Similarly, was Karmichael Hunt "parachuted" in to Gordon? I don't think we could ever make that claim, although he did similarly return to play in the build up to the Shute finals having previously NEVER played a game of Sydney club rugby before. He genuinely appears to be a great bloke, who turned up to the juniors and senior training when injured, just to lift morale. Both Gordon and Karmichael should be congratulated, no doubt his appearance for the Stags was a great lift for the club. NSW rugby should pay more attention to this, and contracted players coming from outside Sydney Club Rugby should be "distributed", and perhaps they are. Rob Simmons has ended up at Randwick, although I can't say whether he has ever been down on the team sheet - so what is the difference between his link with Randwick, and Israel's with Uni? I must admit that I am completely lost with your mention of a lyric, NRL satire, and Queensland. I think your last point is that more needs to be done to support and promote rugby in Western Sydney. I think the majority of club rugby fans, including myself, agree on this... although no-one seems happy when you move the Shute Shield Final out there. However, this again seems a different argument altogether, and unrelated to this article.

I know it was at Bankwest Stadium. Not a good move, on the face of it.

"Uni has Waratahs players because they created them" Really? They weren't making rep sides prior to landing a scholarship?

Match was at bankwest stadium, not North Sydney oval as per the previous few years. Dear say crowd would have been bigger at NSO.

Julian, “Perhaps this does need to be looked at by Sydney Club Ruby, but ultimately will rob rugby fans the opportunity to see the best rugby players in the strip of their home club. Uni has Waratahs players because they created them,” Let’s do that Julian. Let’s look at how Uni ‘creates’ players. Let’s look at how players like Folau who are a million miles from even an arts degree or geographical proximity end up aligned to Sydney University, instead of where a poster boy should be - out where the posters are most in need. Are Minto and the Maroons catchment part of the Uni home? Home club indeed. I hear a lyric “Where’s Minto? In Camperdown.....” to the tune of the NRL satire ‘In Queensland’ Let’s define home club. Because I know a few home club players who have left home to join uni. All Shute Shield clubs are equal it seems. But some are more equal than others. Some have tax payer funded scholarships to bargain with for instance. It may prove to be all be ‘even and fair’ but at the moment our great untapped resource west of Parramatta has exactly zero Shute Shield clubs, while Uni and a few eastern clubs have majority pro squads. Home is where the heart is Julian. And NSW rugby’s heart is definitely east of Parramatta with an ever shrinking relevance. Nibbling caviar and celebrating with champagne on the Titanic doesn’t change the context. Uni are good, very good. In a balanced context their excellence should be applauded. But on this lopsided ship taking water fast we need a broader horizon and a bigger vision than ‘yippee! We won (enrolled) another Shute Shield’.

Dear Eyezac and the Roar, I understand that you are clearly upset (and apparently angry) at the result of a highly competitive and nail-biting Shute Shield final. That you apparently rushed home to pen this emotion and spite driven article based on an entirely false premise is deeply disappointing, and frankly embarrassing. But most of all, the important issue you are attempting to argue is lost, as the lies and ad hominem attacks unfortunately removes all credibility to your argument. I'm not sure what your problem with Phipps is (the second best half-back on the day, behind Jake Gordon), but both have played every Shute shield match since July this year. Last year, Phipps played a number of early season Shute games as he came back form injury, and also played the latter games in the season. Both players started in Colts (I think Phipps in 3rd Colts!), and Gordon was a Canterbury Junior. Both players are Waratahs because of their commitment, form, and perseverance at club rugby. Gordon played three seasons of first grade for the Students before getting his Tahs contract in 2016. Similarly, Swinton, HJH, and Talakai are all part of the Tahs because of their form playing for Sydney Uni. You clearly have no issue with Warringah's starting Waratah, Rory O'Connor (who has played significantly less games of Sydney Club Rugby then the others you did mention), but again has a Waratahs contract because of his form for Warringah. That Sydney Uni has a system that can develop talent from 18 year old school leavers, put them through colts, grade, and offer a platform to higher representation should be celebrated by the rugby community. So what was the argument you were trying to make? Should Waratahs contracted players not be able to play Shute Shield at the end of the Super Rugby Season? Should we rob Beasties fans the opportunity to see Mac Mason, Lalakai Foketi, Alex Newsome, and Jack Maddocks? What about Norths fielding Will Miller, Michael Wells, Andrew Tuala and Cam Clark in the finals? Perhaps this does need to be looked at by Sydney Club Ruby, but ultimately will rob rugby fans the opportunity to see the best rugby players in the strip of their home club. Uni has Waratahs players because they created them, not because they were parachuted in. Currently, Randwick and Gordon have had the best colts teams for the last few seasons. These players need to be given the opportunity and pathways to develop in to First Grade rugby players, and ultimately to higher honours. Clubs should be assisted by Sydney Rugby and NSWRU to nurture and retain young talent. Lastly, I'm not sure what your comment about Fowler is... he is not "part of the Sydney University Pack" as you stated, but I believe a scrum-half for Eastern Suburbs. I think it is only appropriate that the Roar either remove this article, or publish corrections. Eyezac, you have pointed out some of the issues with Sydney Club Rugby, so re-write this article. Your point needs to be made. But no unfounded personal attacks, and no misrepresentation please.

Yeah I get that its a bit rough on them and I'm sure it would probably stir up a lot of issues with some of these big clubs. I guess it would be less of an issue if the Tahs were more proactive here and made a point of distributing out players not originally from Sydney to the bottom 3-4 clubs. I guess that would require a greater degree of thought and engagement with the amateur game and its needs though and I'm not sure NSW Rugby is particularly capable of that.

Just 9222. That's 40 per cent down on last year at NSO. Well done, Sydney Rugby Union.

How many spectators showed up for yesterday's Grand Final?

Anon, if Phipps has played before yesterday my main point still stands. Uni are part of a myopic quest for ‘excellence’ that ignores the code context. What business did uni have selling itself to Izzy when Parramatta, Penrith and the whole western Sydney catchment is screaming out for engagement? Sydney Uni are not the disease in Australian rugby but their easy ability to drain the talent swamp is one vivid symptom of it.

The difference is most players at the Brumbies have come from elsewhere, so they can be spread around easily. But Gordon and Phipps played for Sydney Uni before they played for the Waratahs, so it’s a bit unfair to ask them to move clubs just because they become professional. Where there is a problem is when Uni sign big name players when they move to the Waratahs (eg Israel Folau when he moved there – if anyone should have been aligned to a western sydney club it was him).

Two years in a row Uni have helicoptered pros into their teams. Woopeedo Uni won the comp! No Uni corralled the talent and wheeled it out to exploit this loophole. Once upon a time there were a certain number of games you had to play at grade level to be eligible for that grade in finals footy. Sydney Uni might think they won. We all know the phrase ‘rugby was the winner’ Well yesterday and last year, it wasn’t. Right here you see some of the pox that infects the game in Australia. Self interested pockets that cannot give up their little quasi empires for the greater good of the code.

Any comment from NSW Admin.....? Too busy sucking dollars from the grass roots club/ family based rugby, who've had to self fund their amazing success over the past four + years... BTW great venue choice for a GF. Absolutely dripping with atmosphere. Well done.

You should probably check your facts before writing such an ignorant post. Phipps has been playing for Uni since the end of the Tahs season...he didn’t just come on for the grand final. Not to mention Phipps isn’t the only professional player who takes the field for club rugby. These people play for the love of the game and shouldn’t be denied that. I think it’s time for you to sit back and reflect. We don’t need your naive commentary.

I get they both played Colts for Uni, but why should that matter? The Tahs should follow the Brumbies lead and distribute their players across all of the premier grade clubs. It doesn't work out completely evenly in the ACT but at least every club gets a minimum 1-2 professionals who are likely to play at least part of the club season. In contrast a number of Shute Shield teams have 0 Tahs aligned to them. Imagine how much benefit perennial whipping boys like Western Sydney would get from having a player like Nick Phipps or even a couple of the Tahs wider squad play part of the season for them.

Agree with you Eyezac, it is ridiculous. I'm amazed that Shute Shield doesn't require a player to have participated in a minimum number of regular season games in order to be eligible for the finals. I know for instance Brisbane Club requires either four or five games in order to be eligible for the finals. And they enforce it - Karmichael Hunt was disqualified from playing in the finals for Souths last year for this reason. They should also have a rule limiting the number of professionals that a club can field in any one position - it seems deeply unfair that Uni could take off Jake Gordon and replace him with Nick Phipps.

Every comp I've ever played in, Rugby, touch, oz tag all of that, if you haven't played enough regular season games (~5) you can't take the field in finals. Not the individual players fault but the rules allowing it.

A fair point about denying regular players, but a bit harsh on one individual I think. He is eligible under the rules of the competition and played well for his club. The bigger questions, is why Sydney Uni can keep stockpiling players and have such a big pool of Waratahs (and Wallabies...) to draw on. But to be fair Gordon and Phipps both played Colts with Uni.

Absolutely disgusting this win all costs attitude is not what true sportsmanship is about. Part of the enjoyment of sport is not knowing the outcome. Stop ruining grass roots rugby. It is a hollow victory for uni because everyone knows they only won because a wallaby played the last half hour. The uni player who missed out playing in grand final was cheated. Warringah was cheated of a likely victory. The fans on both sides were cheated of fair game. Ban current wallabies and Super 15 rugby players from the Shute shield. Otherwise the Shute shield will start losing fans