How good has the 'Tim Paine era' been for Australian cricket?

Patrick I’m also coming off as a bit stern on paine but I do want what is best for the Aussie team going forward. I want to pay compliment to him as a great person, and a guy that did well under an incredibly difficult situation. He is very likable but I think Smith probably is too and will be a much better man manager now and Warner has been put his his box and really any captain in more recent times would have struggled with Warner as he’s erratic and impulsive . If smith had intent in the process on field id be more negative but I think he’s more than done his time and What I saw him do in england was nigh on incredible and time after time I could see Paine going to smith for decision making when I sat in the stands it wasn’t so obvious on the screens. I think this aussie squad could galvanize under smith now. Paine may get the gig this summer due to an easy 5 nil series win at home . Smith would have got the same result or Ponting as the matches were often over on day 1 or 2 with opening batting and winning toss and NZs decimation. I actually think it was a fitting way for paine to go out as captain instead of waiting for a bad loss abroad or against India potentially. Let him Keep and enjoy that process as the interim period is over and the past is now the past. Smiths the most experienced of the lot of them as international captain and will be a much stronger leader for me. Groom cummins or possibly head in under smith if he can find consistent batting abroad. Id love paine to concentrate on grooming carey or next keeper in in the coming 18 months as he’s not getting any younger. Aus can play to its strength in prep of the upcoming massive subcontinent tour which I think is 2022 and that will be a tough one abroad so would want to be chopping and changing captaincy then

Patrick appreciate the well written thoughts and a few good points but your underestimating the horrendous amount of decisions Paine made in the ashes. The bad decisions went series long (not just a few bad decisions) and his horrendous DRS record spoke for itself with smith calling for a review in the key Headingly loss and then Paine absolutely wasted a decision. Re some of your comments heres some key highlights: He left it way too late to throw to the ball to labauschagne at manchester, should have been bowling him much much earlier than last few overs as commented on air several times. Awful decision to bowl first in fifth test two days after bowling in fourth test for most part of three days in a row in that preceding test . Awful decision. DRS howler in the third test really cost us the match and series , Smith was begging to challenge. Replays showed a review would’ve been successful and Border was fuming by Tim Paine’s poor use of the system. Allan Border “The one time where the review was there to be taken for the right reason and to win the Test match, we’ve run out of reviews because of stupidity earlier on,” . “It’s come back to bite us badly. Our use of the review system has been appalling in this series in particular.” One more example off the top of my head DRS nightmare in england with day three of final test as poor judgment cost Australia two wickets. Mitchell Marsh struck Joe Denly on the pad on 54 and appealed loudly but umpire Marais Erasmus kept his finger down and Paine decided not to review. Replays showed had the Aussies challenged, Denly would have been out because the ball was crashing into leg stump. He got nearly every single challenge wrong. Ricky Ponting said it was “staggering” Paine didn’t review in that instance because the appeal came at a time when Australia was desperate for a wicket. déjà vu in the final session when umpire Kumar Dharmasena didn’t reward Nathan Lyon for an LBW shout. Again, Paine chose not to review but Hawkeye showed the ball was hitting the stumps and had the Aussies challenged, Jos Buttler would have been out. “I don’t know mate, I’m getting it wrong,” Paine said about his troubles with technology. “I don’t know what else to say. The decision by Paine to bowl all morning long on a rain effected fifth day lords ( I was there ) when Lyon was getting nothing out of the pitch and turn was in the rough on the other side of the pitch and he wouldn’t bowl labauschange much at all. Denly got wickets there from memory . Allowed england to thump runs . It put australia in a pressure cooker situation which nearly lost us the test not for labs heroic efforts hanging on. Paine was awful with decision making in england. We had our hands in our heads at Lords and headingly . Moreover in the first test . Paine came out swinging like a looney at the ball with bat when his team needed a conservative innings. Head was ok in some innings but you can thank Siddle for hanging with smith to turn it around in the first test. He did the job that Paine should have done but for his reckless hook hitting to get caught when there was no need. I have to disagree on paine . He’s a poor decision maker , appreciate your thoughts though

I think this fair. I’m prepared to throw him shade because being ‘keeper compromises your role as captain. Marshalling, and l mean marshalling, bowlers and setting fields are, by far, the most important aspects of being a captian. I think he lacks in attacking acumen. Or more likely keeper is a demanding responsibility and shouldn’t be compromised by captaincy duties. —– Fabulous ambassador and example. As for run-making l don’t care too much because he has been this country’s best keeper by a country mile. Injuries and time are catching him tho.

You make some good points Pierro, but I'd diasagree, and say that Paine has done a good job on the whole. You correctly point to some mistakes in the Ashes, but on the other hand he played an important hand with the bat at Old Trafford, and made what proved to be a good decision in throwing Labuschagne the ball on Day 5. In terms of Smith and Cummins winning him Test matches- I think if you take the two best players out of any team, they won't win too many matches. Even then, it wasn't just Smith and Cummins. In most innings during the Ashes, someone put on a noteworthy partnership with Smith or Labushagne, preventing the horror collapses that we've seen in previous Ashes tours. Head did it in both innings at Edgbaston, Wade made two centuries, Paine put on 76 with Wade at Edgbaston, 60 with Smith at Lords, and 145 with Smith at Old Trafford. This may not seem important, but Smith needs partners- remember the 85 all out in Hobart (where Smith finished on 48*)? In terms of losing to India- that was a horrible batting lineup. No Smith, no Warner, Labuschagne yet to emerge. Its hard to expect a different result. As for losing to Sth Africa on home soil- I assume your referring to the ODI series that summer, but Paine didn't play in it. Of course he gets some 'easy' wins on home soil. Most captains do. If you look at Smith's captaincy record, it's even more home dominant. He won one away series against NZ, but lost away to SA, Sri Lanka (3-0), and India, and drew against Bangladesh. He dropped a home Test series to South Africa, but has otherwise beaten teams that haven't really competed- much like Paine. I'm not sure a couple of Ashes mistakes override the significant cultural changes he's made to that team, or warrant putting the man that led the team into the crisis back in charge.

Cant resist putting some reality bites on this one …dont rate him as a captain at all , smith and cummins won him two of those test matches in the ashes and paine arguably cost us 3 1 result at worse ) win with poor decision making for me.. That means his record could be a lot worse without smith and cummins decimating england on his behalf. He also lost our first series to India on home soil as captain and we lost to sth africa on home soil to . Not particularly impressive across the board for me as captain . Made so many clanger decisions in the ashes in it wasn’t funny throughout the series and his batting was shot away from australian pitches (not that others weren’t worse). He was also just gifted 5 easy test wins on aussie soil against absolutely pathetic efforts from pakistan and NZ. So his percentage win rate is pretty much built up by default as any one could have captained this summer and got a 5 nil result on home soil , the openers and labushchange and cummins were winning matches before paine even made a decision and injuries decimated NZ and we won a lot of key tosses batting first in the heat. Its an overexagerated record to say the least. I rate him as a top wicketkeeper (who could have had a better record too if not for terrible injuries. I also rate him as a top bloke . I also appreciate finding a candidate was tricky after the horrendously over exaggerated bans on smith and less so warner. I actually think Smith can resume captaincy now against India , he’s a better captain than paine and no problem after the ban was served. Cummins a candidate . Happy to keep paine on for one more summer for his keeping and service to the nation but his batting is not good enough now compared to the potential carey has and the need to prepare for the future. We should prepare a captain for the away series to india and subcontinent the following year this summer really IMHO. Paine has filled in well and ridden the waive of smith, labusschange and cummins in the ashes series who saved his hind and certainly didn’t benefit from his captaincy decisions in fact they had to bail him out from more losses or hold on to a draw to at lords where he made more poor decisions. We would have won the ashes series with a better captain in my opinion, granted the length of the bans gave us little to no choice though. On a positive note the guy was a freakishly good keeper before injuries and an excellent one after the numerous injuries he faced and hes a very popular guy on character. He was unlucky not to be the aussie keeper much earlier although haddin did a pretty good job at times after gilchrist but Wade was well behind paine as a top keeper

It effectively became the unplanned new era of cultural cleansing that Australian cricket perhaps did not know it needed. With fan retention and public perception so vital, as we are talking about a product at the end of the day, the transformation has gone a long way to recouping lost respect.

"But is this the beginning of a new era or is he retiring soon?" - I suspect it's both. He'll probably stay until the WTC final, or maybe even the next Ashes series. With the fixturing uncertainty due to the COVID situation, it's a bit hard to predict, but he's certainly at the back end of his career. That doesn't mean that it isn't the beginning of a new era. One would hope that the cultural changes made under Paine's leadership last long after he has retired.

Paine was a Captain for the moment. He's a calm individual and a class act, with plenty still to offer. He will be given the credit to know when enough is enough.

Paine was in charge of a culture change, and had to steer the ship of public perception about the Australian Cricket team. Results on the field were only a small part of that. The Captain of the Australian Cricket team is the 2nd highest office in Australia (behind the PM). He has gone a long way to re-establishing that trust in the position and the role of Men's side has in society.