Don't be fooled by the Crusaders start to the season: They are still boasting plenty of NZ Rugby talent in their ranks

"Might have been exciting for you as an Aucklander" There's your 'alternate reality' right there. Then you proceed to twist a pointless narrative around that. And double down with an equally pointless post in an attempt to save face? IDGAF if Harris was a pisshead, I was just going to watch NPC games chocka block with All Blacks. Try and do that these days. I'd read a few of your posts in the past and pegged you as something to avoid. Thanks for proving me right.

No mate I don’t have a chip. I know family members of Lindsay and my other comments actually relate to how others were seeing it outside of Auckland. The fact you can’t acknowledge the truth of this is not my problem. It is called reality. Calling others a POS merely just shows the calibre of person you are, so not surprised you live in an alternate reality.

Sorry to burst your bubble of indignation but I'm not from Auckland. But don't you have giant chips on both shoulders, you POS.

Might have been exciting for you as an Aucklander. The Swamp Foxes scored a try in a RS challenge when Auckland generously took it on the road, because interest was waning and dying in other rugby communities, such was the lopsided nature of the game. Truly exciting stuff. I guess you never spent much time talking to those outside your little bubble to see how excited they were. Lindsay Harris didn’t make the AB’s because he was a drunken time bomb.

Thats an interesting comment Piccolino. I think what you would love is for your side to dominate rugby like the Saders do. As an Aussie you would much prefer Aus sides to dominate and you would most likely be very happy. Its all about perspective I guess. From my POV I want ( like yourself ) more equality but I want the Aus sides to raise their standard to the NZ sides not NZ sides to drop standards. Without an NRC that will never happen.

The problem is JD that the players they sign to their academy are from all over NZ. I think maybe its time NZR ran a high quality academy and have the talent go back to their own franchises. The development is crucial but it doesnt all have to be because the Saders have the best academy, attract the best juniors from all over NZ, to that academy then lock up the best ones for Canterbury and the Crusaders. 18 capped squad members v 12 at the Chiefs just isnt an equal opportunity for sides to improve but always garrantee the Saders are at the top at other teams expense. Its a bit like having 5 identical race cars but giving new parts to one and having the other 4 use them once team 1 has chosen what they want. They wont win every race but will win the majority.

I was living in Auckland back then and would go to most of their matches. Lindsay Harris was often the only uncapped player in the starting XV. Some fabulous rugby was played in that era and not just by Auckland as their opponents often lifted for the occasion. Thames Valley scored a stunning length of the field team try during a RS challenge.

G'day S81. I don't understand the question what's SR for? Is it to win or is it to develop better players for the (insert national team here). IT'S BOTH! I've never wanted to be part of a competition to come second, or worse. The NPC and Ranfurly Shield were never competitions just to be used as selection matches. Nor was the interstate rivalries between Qld, NSW and the ACT. (Actually, throw in NSW Country while you're at it.) These games meant something to the players and supporters of all sides. And so too should Super Rugby. Those clubs who get into the European Cup aren't there just to flog their players, or let national selectors have another look at them. It's a competition to be won. So, in our neck of the woods, we have to, - back the teams who are there each week, - find ways to make it financially viable, - be more active in the ways each club goes about their player identification, development and retention, - and finally, let's get some fire in the belly of supporters. We can't rely on the media, broadcast rights, others, to make our game great. We have to be there doing what we can for the game, demanding media coverage. supporting our players who in turn should be seen out and about, supporting grassroots rugby. (And please don't tell me that they have made their minimum number of public appearances for the year.) This is something we all need to be doing together. And yes, I know I'm probably talking to the converted, but let's get out there and promote the good, not waste our time fighting the evil. (You know who you are in Sydney and Melbourne) If SR gets better, and that's up to players, coaches, admins and supporters, so too, does International Rugby

I remember the ‘Auck-Blacks’. It got ridiculous at one point.

Well in the early days when they linked up Waikato, Counties and North Auckland the decision was made to give Joeli Vidiri and Jonah Lomu to Auckland. Then when Frank Bunce was in his late 30’s, Little was on the way out and all their stars had left, they decided a better fit was to give NH to Waikato and move North Auckland to Auckland. As a Waikato supporter, nothing new in Auckland getting preference… After all they also took Craig Innes and a Jason Goldsmith just when they were making an impression on AB selector having demonstrated their wares in the Black jersey and they were born and bred in Matamata. But be a bit rich to complain considering at the time Waikato was doing the same to the BoP. Auckland just had first dibs over anyone. Not sure if it was money, opportunity because playing for Auckland meant you were more likely to hold down an AB position and were playing with other ABs. The whole thing to be fair was bit rotten, but with the demise of the NPC as the premier rugby event being replaced with a bunch of franchises poorly connected to fans and labelled SR, this aspect got fixed which was better for the local game although some of the energy for local rugby was being sucked away by SR. People often complain about the Crusaders domination as being the problem. I am not so convinced it is the same product that we used to hang out every weekend for, fill the pubs with when a game was on and barrack for our team. Those times were noisy and colourful… Can’t really be blaming the Saders for the slide into complacency and boredom we see in and around the game. I think by setting a high benchmark and forcing other teams to get better sorted is a positive. The fact that other areas haven’t been able to develop the same is disappointing. The highlander always punch above the ire weight, the Canes and Chiefs are always going to be next tier, but the most disappointing of all are the Blues. Anyway, probably a mile off topic… just my thoughts.

The NZRU would love more money from Super Rugby. There is far more money to be gained by increasing Super Rugby's interest in Australia than the Crusaders' region/New Zealand. Another thing to think about is it's good for players to be challenged. Yes, winning is a habit. But it's difficult to learn to win tough/close games when your team always wins well.

Yes mate. I watched the final Bledisloe in Christchurch before the earthquake. It's a tragedy.

The Crusaders would even more able to set up good development systems if they didn’t lose the Jade Stadium (Lancaster Park) money. They must have very well developed systems to have withstood that, long term, financial loss.

The NZRFU used to have some say into the make up of the New Zealand Super Rugby teams. The NZRFU had to sign off the New Zealand Super Rugby teams squads. They could theoretically make changes. I’m unsure if they ever did. They had opportunities to do so; one year Dan Carter was listed as a Fullback as the Crusaders had two other good 10s (Slade, Taylor?); or when they had both McCaw and Matt Todd, so one of the better opensides in New Zealand was often playing out of position, or on the bench. I’m unsure if they still can alter the squads now they sold the Super Rugby teams to private investors. Yes, being in a high quality environment helps players develop. But there is also merit in having quality players actually playing. It’s a balancing act. One of the main ideas, for the NZRFU, in setting up Super Rugby was to get the best players, playing together; not spread over 10 first division teams. With the idea that five high quality teams getting regular game time together would produce better All Black candidates than the NPC. Is the goal of the NZRU to win Super Rugby, or produce better quality All Blacks? If one of those two goals has to suffer I would prefer better All Blacks than a New Zealand side always winning Super Rugby. Also, if Super Rugby was more even it would bring in more money to keep more All Blacks in New Zealand.

Most likely a bit of both. Thought they undoubtably have excellent development systems, going back to when Robbie Deans was running the show.

For the record, as an Australian I would prefer a more balanced SR competition. I just understand why NZR may not :happy:

Very well said Piccolo, By way of analogy, I remember a coach telling my team if a player makes a break, it’s up to his team mates to chase & get into a position to support …. It’s counterproductive to expect the leader to slow up to allow the support to catch him.

It realy comes down to what is the purpose of SR? Success breeds success. More Saders wins means more finals home match $$, sponsorship $$, third party player agreements $$ etc. This money goes back into developing the next gen of players and having a higher budget to afford their salaries as they develop. This again leads to more wins. Other clubs will struggle to catch up as they can't fund the same development or retain players tempted by higher contracts elsewhere. So my point is, if the objective is a strong ABs, this is a good outcome as it gives the majority of the AB squad good connections and a culture of winning. So we should leave it as is. If the objective is an entertaining SR product, we should enforce a salary cap so talent gets spread around and there is more uncertainty in SR matches and champions, creating a more exciting fan experience (for everyone except Saders fans...) No right answer, it is a matter of priorities and I think ABs is the priority for NZR.

We can’t punish one group for their success by making them less. It’s up to the rest of us to raise our own standards.

Yeah the Crusaders will be back, will make the 8 this year and their talent will come thru next year.