Where are the Sydney racing carnival’s punters?

I fell in love with racing as a kid in the mid sixties, but I have to confess that I now for the most part, find it as boring as bat shit. Sure the Melbourne Cup stops the nation, but even it falls short of what it used to be as a spectacle. The Cox Plate and the Cup are the win pillars that support Australian racing at the moment, and as much as they try, Sydney and the Slipper just can't match their southern counterparts when it comes to drawing public interest. Ask the average person in the street what they think of the possible make up of this year's Golden Slipper field, and all you'll get in reply is a vacant stare. Racing can never be what it used to be, it's a spectacle of a past age, being clung to by those too blind to see the reality of the situation. The rapid expansion of the media as we know it today, has opened up a plethora of opportunities for other sports, and people have gravitated toward them. It takes something really special to get them off their back sides and through the turnstiles these days. Black Caviar offers that something special, but when did we last see the likes of her? "Now where's that bloody remote? I might just be able to watch my race, and not miss too much of the football."

Rosehill crowds have disappointed somewhat in recent years though. Girls Day Out in November, for example, seemed to attract a very low figure compared to five years ago. In the last 10 years, it has ALWAYS been Rosehill's second biggest meeting in terms of attendance after the Golden Slipper (Coolmore Classic day is third, then not sure between Rosehill Guineas and Golden Rose). I hope, this year, Coolmore Classic day can push past Girls Day Out. If not, it could be a major disappointment to the ATC.

I can't understand the statement "Considering the racing industry isn't exactly strapped for cash" Who is he talking about? The Sheikh perhaps -but few others. This misunderstanding of the current knowledge of the current state of the industry throws into question the validity of any of his statements. Lets look at the sectors. The Country Clubs are all broke. They can't even maintain their tracks and purchase capital equipment let alone improve facilities for patrons? . You might ask what about the reputed $150m which the Country Clubs expected would be used to improve their lot. Well 14 months after the successful outcome they are still waiting.The Singleton Review on Racing and Training on the Central Coast has been shelved because Racing NSW hasn't the funds to implement the findings. What about the breeders? In last weeks QTIS sale 450 lots averaged $21,193.The cost of bringing a yearling to the sales and selling it are about that figure plus the service fee plus X-Rays, Commission, stabling, etc. And what about those passed in? There cost are the same but what of their value? I won't go into how much owners lose each year but it is hundreds of millions but it is a hobby isn't it? The only people doing well are the Government (betting taxes and GST),they never lose, and vets and Jockeys. TAB seems to be ok and I guess the corporate bookmakers are doing well or they wouldn't be in it. Trainers are definitely struggling. Perhaps some more investigative journalism is required before wild assertions like "You never had it so good" are made

Demographics & willingness to attend sporting events aside, Melbourne has a distinct advantage over Sydney in that it's big races have managed to capture the imagination of marginal race-goers. And, they all take place at the same time every year. The Cox Plate, Caulfield Cup, VRC Derby, & of course, the Cup itself, need little PR hype to get the crowds in. The quality of racing in Sydney is easily as good at certain times of the year, but for some reason, it doesnt pull the crowds or generate the public interest. The Golden Slipper barely stops Sydney, let alone the nation.

The reason people don't like horse racing is because they're idiots. Racing is awesome, and is best enjoyed at the track. But, like I said, most people are too stupid to realise this. How you educate stupid people, I really don't know. Maybe you can't?

Spear, Sydney used to do this over Easter remember? Derby was on Easter Saturday, Doncaster was on the Monday, Oaks on Thursday, Sydney Cup on Saturday. I think it was abandoned because they wanted fixed dates for the major racedays, which makes actually does make sense. That said, the Sydney carnival does go for a while, and it could possibly do with some condensing.

With all the scheduling conflicts and restricted media coverage, I think the Sydney carnival is too long. They need four major days with one or two of those possibly being midweek like Melbourne Cup Day and Oaks Day. For the amount of relevant Group 1 races on offer in the autumn, the Sydney carnival is about two weeks too long in my opinion.

Free entry to all race days around the year for children under the age of 18 is a must.

NRL and Union are only played on Saturdays at night. Racing has no competitors when it comes to crowd attendances unless Sydney or GWS have a Saturday afternoon game and that happens maybe once a year. There's a huge market to be filled for Saturday afternoon and Racing NSW have been lazy not do more to draw people through the gates. Sydney Siders are lucky to have four metropolitan racecourses located well within traveling distance of the CBD but they just seem under appreciated by the wider general public. It needs to be more about 'a day at the races' than 'a day of punting on big races'. This might sound kind of silly but I think they best way to get people into horse racing is to get them into horses. My brother is always watching Saturday races on television and his five year old daughter is always asking to go horse riding. With all the useless horses stumbling around farms these days, maybe kids could be targeting with free horse riding lessons? Mum and the kids learn to ride a horse while Dad has a few beers and a punt with his mates while complaining about Mum and the kids! What a great family afternoon.

It's free to go to the metropolitan midweeks in Sydney. Since that's been the case, crowds haven't increased much but at least it halted the steady decline.

Who wants to go to Warwick Farm ? Zero mainstream media promotion of the Autumn Carnival. Non-racing folk wouldn't even know there was a carnival on at the moment. Unlike the spring carnival the autumn carnival has no identity at all. There are some sensational horses that will be racing in Sydney over the next few weeks, including a bumper crop of 3 year olds - there is plenty of (missed) opportunity to sell racing. Prices ae outrageous. Derby day at Randwick has a $50 entry. Add in $8 beers, $6 meat pies, etc and you need a miracle day on the punt to break even. These days someone can sit at home, watch all the races on tele, have their choice of bookies, claim the best seat in the house (or the shed) and not have to line up for food, drink or toilet. Only drawback is the missus hassling them to do jobs and the kids wanting to watch Tom & Jerry after four hours of racing...

This is the conversation that doesn't end, based on questions that can't be answered. Almost every suggestion/idea posed in the article and in the comments below is valid. Everyone is coming at the problems from their own perspective, which is great because we all love racing for different reasons. The racing industry is something like the third biggest employer in this country, so it's not going anywhere, but maybe we have to accept that people are only going to enjoy the races from home or with a few mates at the local TAB. In Melbourne it has a 'season' which fits in somewhere between footy and cricket. The first Ashes test this year in Brisbane starts on Nov 21, which means racing has all of October and most of November to generate headlines and fill column inches. In Sydney, racing doesn't occupy a unique, vacant space. Full credit to Racing Victoria for capitalizing on this time period, and no doubt the income generated through this six week period, nd especially Cup week, funds racing throughout the rest of the year. The price to pay for this buzz and high attendance is people only allocating that time in their minds and planning to racing.

Fair comment Scuba! There'll be pressure on the ATC to ensure the crowd turns up on Saturday. And no excuse - good weather, good facilities and great racing. 15000+ should be the target.

Warwick Farm is probably the worst metropolitan track in Australia taking into account both the track itself and the facilities (the facilities at Sandown are similar, but at least the track itself is good), hence nobody goes. Let's see what the crowds are like this weekend before worrying about it too much.

Alfred as someone who frequents Sydney racetracks often, I'd say there is a small problem. The ATC, much like the clubs they have replaced have struggled to get crowds to their Carnival meetings. The redevelopnent of Randwick hasn't helped and I'm not sure the STC and AJC were heading in the right direction several years ago by attracting a party crowd to the track - that can only bring short term relief because racing fans, these people are not. There is no short-term fix. The new Randwick will help and a more streamlined Sydney Carnival is a must - Rosehill Guineas Day can't draw more than 10000 people and that's a problem - but to get people to the track you need to create interest. There isnt the same interest in an Aus Derby as there is a Cox Plate, and until racing starts marketing it's greatest asset, the horses and races better, we are not going to progress. And the great races of the Sydney autumn are some of Australia's great races. The Sydney Carnival deserves massive crowds but I don't think the people of Sydney have been reminded enough why they should attend these great meetings.

This is something which is no doubt plaguing Sydney racing at the moment. I agree with a lot of the points you have made Alfred, especially in regards to the seriously outdated fashion rules. Surely some common sense can prevail and the administrators can bring these fashion rules into the 21st century. The unfortunate reality for me is that the Sydney population do not have the same passion in attending sporting events as those in Melbourne. Unless something special is happening, many are quite happy to sit and home and watch it on TV. The younger generation is where the ATC really need to target. For me, if they want to charge up to $8.80 for a beer then they should waive the admission fee. Free entry would have to boost the attendance and it will probably lead to an increase in punting turnover on the track.

Alfred, points well made, the Melb spring carnival isn't perfect but it is an event which showcases racing as more than just about racing, and it has successfully engaged females at many levels. If many of those people switch off for the rest of the year so be it, but it does help legitimise racing to the wider community. I'd like to think that Sydney will improve a little once Randwick is finished. Certainly it's no surprise to see so few at Warwick Farm - it makes Sandown on a cold winter wednesday look and feel positively palatial.

i think you are barking up the wrong tree with your weather analysis. temps in Sydney in mar/apr are 25 and 22 compared to 19 and 22 for Melbourne in Oct/Nov. i think the reason that Nov is a good time for Racing is that there is no AFL and NRL at that time of year. Crowds at WF are really bad and its an antiquated facility not close to where most racing socialites would go anywhere near. WIth the ATC spending over 150 mln on Randwick, i am hoping that it is money well spent. it seems ridiculous for a place that is busy a couple of times a year