3 days to Rio: The greatest Olympian of all time

Comparing Phelps and Bolt: only way I can think of is take all events Bolt has done...take the same number of Phelps's best events. Compare medals, world records and % time a world record was broken. Find a way to quantify that and you have a 'Greatest'. (can't penalize Bolt for lack of events to enter. And sprinting for is more taxing on the body than swimming per unit of time. Fact.

Jameswm " I won Nationals in athletics and represented Australia. " If so , you must of represented Australia at The Commonwealth Games ? Please cough up your full name for verification ? I won't be waiting with abated breath as your comments on swimming are comical - I could see Thorpe and Phelps on the ground laughing in stitches .

FFS Phelps doesn't swim the same events twice in the same evening either. What's the difference between doing 2 of the same or 2 different events? You said 2 events, not 2 different events. And it is bucketloads harder to cross events in athletics than swimming. Maybe you do know a bit. But if you think 100 free is as hard or harder than a 100 sprint, then a bit is all you know. There is a reason runners need more recovery. It is harder on the body. I won Nationals in athletics and represented Australia. I made state champs swimming too, and cricket and rugby. I've coached state and national champs in athletics, two of my kids made state for swimming. You need to very carefully manage workload in athletics because of wear and tear on the body. It's a much tougher gig than the uneducated realise.

Sheek Outstanding post , you make some great points and a lot of sense !

That's equally as ignorant a comment, a comment mired in your obvious preference for athletics and possibly in your inabilities as a swimmer. Running is more natural to humans than swimming. Unless you don't believe in evolution? Swimming is significantly more challenging on the body.

"Bolt runs the 100 semi and final about 90 mins apart. So that comment is wrong." By any definition the semi and final of the 100m is the same event. Same event mate. Phelps swims 2 distinct events. Jessica Ennis' time in the hurdles in the heptathlon would have finished 4th in London and won gold in Beijing. If that was her sole event, and could focus all her time on it, then she would be faster than 12.54. I made state and national athletics, and state swimming mate. I know a bit about it too.

"Running 100/200 meters is easy . Swimming requires a lot more training than track & field" Possibly the most ignorant comment I've seen on these boards, certainly in the Olympics section. Congratulations. Again - why can they spend so much time training? Answer - because it isn't as hard on the body as running. You really need to learn a bit.

sheek Im with you about (Decath/hep/penathlon's). There amazing sports having to be competent at a decent level at so many sports, it takes a special athlete to do them.

Michael Phelps is the most successful Olympian, but not necessarily the greatest. 100m, 200m, 100m, 200m, freestyle, butterfly, freestyle, butterfly. There's really not much difference. In 1984 for example, Carl Lewis emulated Jesse Owens (1936) by winning the 100m, 200m, long jump & 4 x 100m relay. The long jump is entirely different from the sprints. While the 200m is different from the 100m not only by distance but also requiring runners to handle a bend. In 1972 I thought Shane Gould's effort in winning five medals from 100m to 800m plus a medley, was more impressive than Mark Spitz's seven golds across two distances & two disciplines. Personally, I think a rule ought to be introduced, especially in sports like swimming & gymnastics, restricting competitors to only four events each maximum. It's crazy. Decathletes have to accumulate points across 10 different athletic events; heptathletes across seven athletic events while pentathletes have to be proficient across five entirely different sports. I often think these guys & girls are the real heroes.

"Bolt has never run 2 events on the same night" Bolt runs the 100 semi and final about 90 mins apart. So that comment is wrong. Running a 400 and swimming 100 free take roughly the same amount of time. You know nothing about either if you think doing each flat out will achieve anything like the same level of fatigue. The fact that Phelps can do 2 events per night proves you can recover. You just can't do that in athletics. The hard breathing isn't what they have to recover from, by the way. In fact you need 48 hours to reover from a hard 400 (run), to be able to do another one. Hence the day's rest between semis and final in the program. They can back up for the semi the day after heat because the heat is not flat out. "Heptathlete Jessica Ennis would almost certainly have been a medal chance in the 100m hurdles if she chose to do it in London" Wrong again. Finalist maybe. Medal? No way. "Recall Ian Thorpe in Sydney. Swam a WR 400m and then backed up that night with a herculean 100m leg 2 hours later" Aren't you just proving my point? Imagine running a 1500 and backing up the same night to run a 4x4, or running a 4 final and backing up for the 4 x 100. Much, much tougher in running and you would not be at your best for the 2nd one. It is easier to back up in swimming - as I said.

Jameswm Running 100/200 meters is easy . Swimming requires a lot more training than track & field . Swimming is actually one of the hardest sports in the world - especially at Olympic level . Swimmers hit the pool at 5.00am 5/6 mornings per week followed by another 2/3 hours in the afternoon session . Swimmers are up against inertia in the pool and require extraordinary strength, power, biomechanics and cardiovascular output to win at Olympic level . To corroborate this statement , Phelps consumes 12-15,000 calories per day to fuel his swims . Swimmers have the lowest resting heart rates of all athletes - from years and years of brutal training . Phelps is the GOAT , he doesn't even have any challengers . His achievements , hours in the pool and appetitive for more success are unbridled . While Bolt is a great, great athlete , sprinters don't suffer the pain and latic acid burnout swimmers experience .

Regrave for me. Tough sport, longevity etc. Possibly Bolt if he wins again. I'm sorry, individually you're either a time/distance based sport (Sprints/Hurdles/road race/rowing) or a technique based sport (gymnastics/diving). I don't think its particularly important that you can swim in 4 different styles, just how quickly you can get from A to B. Yes I hate walking as an Olympic sport too.

Felix Savon won gold at 3 Olympic 1992-96-2000 in heavyweight boxing. But the one bug bearer for boxing at modern games and counting against Savon's record, is it was just amatuer ranks allowed to compete. Would Savon had been as successful if pro's could compete, we will never know. Now pro's at rio will be able to compete opening up the boxing field to a larger talent pool at games.

I don't think you can have a greatest olympian ever. Because in some sports, amateurs only compete, or pros only recently. For example, the USA dream team would have to be the greatest Olympic sporting team. But how do you compare the Dream team to the football comp which is under 23? or Boxing which is still amateur. I do think Phelps and Bolt's records will not be beaten. But would Jessie Owens have matched Bolt if he was professional and WW2 didn't happen? He did win 4 medals, including a WR in the Long Jump that wasn't beaten for 25 odd years. Also in terms of swimming, prior to about 1952, not all swimming strokes were available to compete in. And with the swimmers being amateurs, they just didn't have the time to practice all the different events. Who knows if Dawn Frasier or Mark Spitz would have won more for longer if they were professional and had professional physio to keep their bodies together. So in the end, I believe Bolt and Phelps records are remarkable, but I do not think you can compare them to previous eras. Too much has changed.

The thing with Phelps is, in swimming it's easier some might say to be good at multiple distances compared to swimming. Look at Thorpe/Hackett, they are both competitive from 100m-200m/400m/1500m, they are good in all 4 areas. Very rarely will you find a sprinter who is good at 100m-200m-400m very rare for modern times. Micheal Johnson never ran 100m, not sure Bolt has ever done the 400m at any decent level. Valerie Adams is giving the Olympics a shake she's won 2 golds, if she wins a 3rd you never know. Jackie Joyner Kersie, has to be pushing close to greatest ever Olympian. She went to 4 Olympics 1984-96(longevity), won 3 Olympic golds 2 in Heptathlon/1 in long jump(she won Gold in heptahtlon and long jump 88 2 different sports with all countries competing at Seoul). Plus a silver(84 heptathlon) and 2 Bronze(long jump). She some say is greatest ever modern female athlete, if not ever but certainly in modern times best female sportswoman since end of (WW2 1945-2016) timeline. -Carl Lewis won 4 golds at LA 84, 4x 100m/100m/200m/long jump, but the point was the Eastern Bloc countries were not there. But im not sure how good the eastern european guys were at sprinting or long jump anyway. The Eastern european girls have always been good at track and field.

"Add in how easy it is to: (a) recover from a swimming event, when the water is supporting your body weight; and (b) excel at multiple events in swimming compared to athletics," While I agree that Bolt deserves to be considered the superior athlete, that is an immensely harsh assessment on swimmers. I don't think anyone would say that a swimmer is any more or less exhausted than a sprinter irrespective of whether the water supports your body weight. Factor in that a swimmer has a reduced capacity to breathe a full tank. Factor in that a swimmer such as Phelps will have 2 swims across disciplines per night. Recall Ian Thorpe in Sydney. Swam a WR 400m and then backed up that night with a herculean 100m leg 2 hours later. The 100 and 400 to swimming is what the 200/400 is to sprinting. Bolt has never run 2 events on the same night. Sprinters do have the opportunity to switch disciplines: Carl Lewis and Gail Devers immediately spring to mind. Heptathlete Jessica Ennis would almost certainly have been a medal chance in the 100m hurdles if she chose to do it in London. And yes, Johnson is the only man ever. Perec is the only woman ever. Still, after all that, Bolt would be the GOAT. Fastest human of all time is the title that I would want.

Carl Lewis, no doping suspicion. Merlene Ottey, no, no Gold medals. The contenders are Steve Redgrave Al Oerter Usain Bolt, especially if he wins any event in RIO Michael Phelps, will have stronger claims if he wins more gold in RIO.

Was just about to write Steve Redgrave before I saw Johnno's comment. 5 consecutive gold medals is an achievement that ranks right up there with Phelps. Even Al Oerter's 4 consecutive discus golds in what is one of the true Olympic events (ie. the Ancient greeks tossed them around).

Carl Lewis. Steve Redgrave. Longevity also has to be looked at Merlene Ottey's record is awesome, so she has legitimate claims to be greatest Olympian despite no gold, to do that well for a long period of time. She won a bronze aged 40 at sydney, she made the 2004 Olympics aged 44, and missed out by 0.28 of second to qualify for Beijinng in 2008. So her Olympic athletics career ran from 1980-2004, what an effort. She was still running in 2012, she competed at the European athletics championships and didn't get a chance to qualify for London 2012 because her adopted country slovenia finished 22, and you have to finish top 16 in world to qualify and slovenia was 22nd. But she is a remarkable athlete. She picked up 9 Olympic medals, just no gold.

It's easier to get lots of medals in swimming because they have 8,000 bloody events, ranging from extremely short range to medium short range. If you're a good short to medium range swimmer you will do well. It's like having sprints ranging from 50m, 100m, 100m backwards, 200m, 300m, 400m and then relays for all of these events.