Rose and Ryan: All-Australian teams great debate

Cam Rose: It’s All-Australian time again Ryan, and the squad of 40 has been named, with the final 22 to be announced tonight.

Why don’t we start with a player who is in both of our respective teams, but failed to make the official 40 man squad – Nick Riewoldt.

No.1 in the competition for marks by a long, long way and the perfect half-forward/wing linkman who also kicked a lot of goals, we both love the work of Adelaide’s Tom Lynch, but surely Saint Nick should be in the 40 ahead of him?

Ryan Buckland: Cam, without a doubt! His absence was the most glaring omission from the squad. While his last game padded his numbers a bit, Riewoldt was only three goals away from averaging 20 disposals and two goals a game.

Those numbers, plus his marks tally and work moving the ball from defence into attack, made him a lock for the squad.

I can’t claim to think like an All Australian squad selector, but his year was worthy of recognition. Adelaide’s Lynch also had a great year, and his selection could be considered the culmination of a few years of work.

It’s not even an either-or proposition with these guys; I’d have looked at the bloated key position defender position – seriously, four in a squad of 40 – and cut one of them loose.

ROSE: Interesting call on the key defenders. I’d say four out of 40 is a fair representation, if we consider an AFL team of 22 would have at least two?

I’ve gone with three genuine tall defenders – we both share Jeremy McGovern as intercept marker extraordinaire and one-man army Alex Rance, while I’ve gone with Daniel Talia as well, given he has started to back himself a lot more to not just beat his opponent by spoiling, but take a mark or run off and create.

We both have Dane Rampe; you to probably play him as third man-up while for me he would be more of a runner. What a season he has had in that he can be picked on either criteria.

RYAN: Yeah Rampe has been incredible this year, and I might be showing my ignorance with this next statement but it feels like it’s come from nowhere in many ways. He’s been in and around the team for a long time now, but I can remember thinking of him as a bit of an average player. This year, he’s shouldered a huge load for the Swans as the help defender, and is a big reason why they’re conceding less than 70 points per game.

On the keys, you’ll remember I had only one – Rance – in my mid-year team, as a bit of a statement of where the league was going. I reckon we’re getting to a point where playing three tall defenders is going to be an exception, rather than the rule, with more medium-sized guys playing the role of zoning off and helping out.

Talia misses out with that statement in mind, and I went with the extra medium defender in Corey Enright. Speaking of amazing seasons…

ROSE: Yeah, Enright was huge and I left him out simply because he already has about as many AA jumpers as games played, and I wanted to mix it up a bit!

Rory Laird is the next Corey Enight, probably without the marking ability, but I rate his decision-making and kicking just as highly. Laird got a gig in both our sides, as did Heath Shaw for the second year running as Greater Western Sydney’s process architect.

Let’s talk forwards – Lance Franklin. Lock. West Coast’s Josh Kennedy. Lock. Gold Coast’s Tom Lynch. Lock.

Betts? Lock it in, Eddie. Was it the easiest part of the ground to select this year?

RYAN: Yeah, in a lot of ways it was. Kennedy is an automatic inclusion given the sheer volume of goals he kicked – and his accuracy – Lynch is the same given the context he went to work in, Betts keeps getting better, and Franklin is probably a lock until his contract runs out.

There’s a fascinating contrast here in that we’ve got three talls (and you’ve arguably got four talls by including Riewoldt as a starter on the half forward line), yet our defensive lines are much smaller.

Otherwise, our differences might be down to preference, I went with what was a very avant-garde selection in the mid-year team Toby Greene as a small forward/link up player where you’ve got Riewoldt as a starter. Was Greene far off for you?

ROSE: We both went with Greene in our mid-season team, equally surprised that the other had, given we each thought he was left field. I felt Greene dropped away in the latter part of the year, and while his numbers were still okay, I didn’t think he was having as great an impact, and I went with Riewoldt as the more consistent performer across 22 rounds. Greene was certainly in my reckoning though.

We both had Luke Parker at half-forward as a goal-kicking premier mid.

RYAN: Yeah, Parker had to be in this team, and of all of the midfielders that were picked he’s the one who is most suited to the ‘is he really a forward’ spot on the right side of half forward line. I know he’s a personal favourite of yours – I was surprised to learn that this was the first time he’d be nominated in the squad!

Another favourite of yours is Robbie Gray, who I showed yesterday had put up numbers not dissimilar to Nat Fyfe’s 2015 stat line. While this isn’t all about stats, and you could argue Gray’s influence was negated by the mediocre play of those around him, what’s a guy got to do to make it into the squad!

ROSE: Yeah, Gray’s numbers are almost identical to last year when he was All Australian, with the exceptions being a bit of a drop off in clearances and goal assists, which may have been enough to see him out of the 22, but he must have been incredibly close to making the 40. As we both know when we’ve put together our Roar top 50 players over the last two years, the spots fill up pretty quick!

Moving into the middle, and obviously Max Gawn was a literal and figurative giant in the ruck this year, and would only vie with Paddy Dangerfield for first one picked. Two brutes who stamped themselves all over this season.

RYAN: There was definitely a time where the ruck spot looked likely to be the most competitive in the team. Between Gawn, Nic Naitanui and Todd Goldstein, we had three colossuses who could affect the game with their work – both at the clinches and around the ground.

We all know the story of Nic Nat, who we’ll sadly miss for most – if not all – of next year. Goldstein really dropped away in the second half of the year, to the point where he was probably out of the top echelon of ruckmen in the game. We’ve heard whispers that he’s carrying an injury of some kind, which would be the best case scenario. So it really defaulted to Gawn, which takes nothing away from his season because he had a great one.

As for Dangerfield, well, you could run out of superlatives describing how he’s gone this year. The most impressive stat for me is his metres gained: 617.2 per game playing as an inside midfielder is off the chain. His go-to move this year was the 30-degree run off the mark, where he’d just blow by the poor sap tasked with manning the mark – he’d do it three or four times a game.

ROSE: Danger really did become Mr Football this year, both on the field and off it, fully embracing his status as Geelong Messiah. Rarely has a footballer looked as comfortable in his own skin.

At the other end of the personality spectrum is Dustin Martin, who is seen as being able to offer Dangerfield some sort of challenge in the Brownlow. He was given more inside responsibility at Richmond this year, which allowed him to take his game to another level.

RYAN: Martin has a phenomenal year, it’s just a shame that much of the rest of his club didn’t go with him. I saw him as on the cusp of the game’s absolute elite coming into this season, and it was great to see him blossom into that inside animal he’s always shown glimpses of becoming.

He was an automatic inclusion in my team, and I’d put him well in the hunt on Brownlow night. There’s a strong chance he’ll poll well in the same way that West Coast’s Matt Priddis did in 2014 – a middling team with a lot of passengers, and playing in role that means he’s always on the mind of the umpires.

I don’t think he’ll win it – Dangerfield has had the thing sewn up for months – but a high place is in play.

There’s actually a lot of similarities across our midfield groups. While we’ve got them lined up in different positions, we both have Adam Treloar, Dangerfield, Martin, Marcus Bontempelli, Dan Hannebery, Lachie Neale, Luke Shuey. That’s boring…

I preferred Rory Sloane, where you’ve slotted in Jack Steven. Steven was on the cusp for me, but I couldn’t look past Adelaide’s hard nut.

ROSE: It all sort of becomes much of a muchness for these positions, and there’s always four or five midfielders that you hate leaving out. Sloane was one of those. There’s a strong statistical case for me to have the likes of Treloar, Shuey, Steven ahead of him for one of my bench spots, and on the whole I felt all of those guys were either the equal of or better than Sloane on the inside but also offered more run and damage on the outside.

Speaking of players left out, many people will have Joel Selwood pegged as the All Australian captain this year, while neither of us found a spot for him in our 22.

RYAN: He was my final cut, and it didn’t feel good leaving him out. I don’t know if it was a case of being attracted to the team debutants, or whether I rated my selected players a bit higher than him this year. Selwood has also had an excellent season and I’d have no qualms with him being picked in the final team. Ditto Steven, who like Martin could also go very well on Brownlow night given the year he and his team had.

The call of yours I’m most interested in is Kade Simpson. He had a great first third-and-a-bit of the year, but I’d have three or four half backs comfortably ahead of him.

ROSE: Simpson may have had a little mid-year lull, but came home strong to average 30 disposals per game in the last seven rounds.

Funnily enough, my first draft had both he and Docherty at half-back, given they both benefited from Bolton’s game plan at Carlton. I like to do something a bit different with my last bench spot (last year I went with Cale Hooker as genuine swingman) and this year it was worth honouring Simpson, who has never won an All Australian jumper despite putting together a 14-year career of courage and class, with another one or two still to come.

RYAN: So it’s a bit of a sentimental pick, and one I’ve got no issues with at all.

So to wrap it up, I guess the big take away from our two teams is that the side looks quite straight-down-the-line, so it will be interesting to see tonight whether the selectors throw up any curveballs.

Let’s just hope that after three or four years hosting the thing like it’s a Sunday League wind up, Fox Footy nail the broadcast!

Cam’s team
B: Daniel Talia (Adelaide) Jeremy McGovern (West Coast) Dane Rampe (Sydney)
HB: Rory Laird (Adelaide) Alex Rance (Richmond) Heath Shaw (GWS)
C: Dustin Martin (Richmond) Marcus Bontempelli (Bulldogs) Dan Hannebery (Sydney)
HF: Nick Riewoldt (St Kilda) Tom Lynch (Gold Coast) Luke Parker (Sydney)
F: Eddie Betts (Adelaide) Josh Kennedy (West Coast) Lance Franklin (Sydney)
Foll: Max Gawn (Melbourne) Patrick Dangerfield (Geelong) Lachie Neale (Fremantle)
Int: Adam Treloar (Collingwood), Luke Shuey (West Coast) Jack Steven (St Kilda) Kade Simpson (Carlton)

Ryan’s Team
B: Corey Enright (Geelong) Alex Rance (Richmond) Heath Shaw (GWS)
HB: Rory Laird (Adelaide) ) Jeremy McGovern (West Coast) Dane Rampe (Sydney)
C: Dustin Martin (Richmond) Patrick Dangerfield (Geelong) Adam Treloar (Collingwood)
HF: Lance Franklin (Sydney) Josh Kennedy (West Coast) Luke Parker (Sydney)
F: Eddie Betts (Adelaide) Tom Lynch (Gold Coast) Toby Greene (GWS)
Foll: Max Gawn (Melbourne) Rory Sloane (Adelaide) Dan Hannebery (Sydney)
Int: Marcus Bontempelli (Bulldogs) Lachie Neale (Fremantle) Luke Shuey (West Coast) Nick Riewoldt (St Kilda)