Jofra Archer is the most overrated bowler in England

sounds good Rich. I think Archer needs to improve rapidly. I'm guessing Broad & Anderson will play in next years Ashes and that will be about it for them, which will make Archer the leader of the attack. Right now, I don't think he's up to that, hence the need to become very good, very quickly.

Cheers Paul, I’ll buy the first round and how about we meet in the middle of ‘quality and overrated’ and settle for glimpses of potential but a way to go in the long form but worth sticking with and perhaps better suited to the short form game at the moment. I honestly think England need him in the long form but only if he improves, becomes more consistent and sticks with it. Honestly, my gut feel is he won’t. Cheers

should be used exactly how Mitch Johnson was used in his last ASHES series ask Jonathan Trott

Look @ Thomos record before he busted his collarbone he could of been anything.

Will be interesting to see what Archer can extract from the Indian pitches in England's 5 Test series commencing in January. And then to compare that against his performances against India in England during the 5 Test series commencing in July. Agree re your comment about instead playing for Windies under Holder; he would have been a bigger fish in a smaller pond in that scenario.

I agree with the original post but not with quite for the same reasons. Archer has an habit that he bowls reasonable fast for a couple of overs and then drops down to the middle eighties, about the speed of Broad but without the experience of the forma. Indecently, Wood is much faster a bowler than Archer. As for breaking the breaking the rules for traveling he deserved to be dropped, a stupid thing to do,he could have infested the whole team. A young bowler with potential but he has a lot to learn. we will wait and see.

Archer played two seasons in the Big Bash for the Hobart Hurricanes before England picked him. He did pretty well here from memory and also would have got good experience playing against our top players

I agree with most of your post but I think Rabada is the most exciting bowler in the world. He’s got a bit more under his belt though and it’s purely a matter of opinion.

Eight Tests and three five wick hauls. He's not overrated. Joe Root flogged him in New Zealand to the point where he broke his elbow, because Root is a very average captain. Also because he was forced to bowl despite complaining about the pain he was in. Blackwood hardly handled him with ease in that second innings, where Archer was brilliant. He's young and new to Test cricket and probably the most exciting bowler in the world.

I wonder if Archer is pacing himself ( pardon the pun)? He's something of a shock bowler who can come up with unplayable deliveries ( just ask Steve Smith), yet the Poms are using him as a stock bowler. Last Test he got through 39 overs which is more than anyone in their attack, bar Anderson (40) and that's not the first time he's been asked to bowl a lot of overs. Sure he's got the lazy looking run up, but he must still really exert himself to bowl that fast.

Yes it was a real pity he took up in England, Windies need all the help we can get. Not sure whether it was a mistake from his point of view. Too bad England relaxed the residency rule that deters poaching of players with second passports, but the fault seems to lie in part with the Windies management for not nurturing him when he was at Under-19s - at least, that’s Jofra’s version. But his pace seems to be well down from the Ashes, from the glimpses I saw in the first Test. Pace is only good if it’s quick, ask Jeff Thomson. Archer wasn’t bowling much faster than Anderson, same in the NZ series.

;)

Patrick's article mentions Archer's form dipping from the heights of taking those 22 wickets. Perhaps something has changed in his delivery of the ball. We are used to hearing about a batsman developing habits such as not using their feet or walking across the ball. No doubt bowlers develop problems that before they know it develop into habit. A loss of confidence can follow. Of course a coach needs to step in and help them through it. At his best Archer is intimidating. I don't mind him returning to form, as long as it's after the next ashes series.

Nice Neil. May it never end! :thumbup:

I think there's some very much more experienced Test captains and vice captains whose breaching of 'protocols' actually on the field, shows they don't think very clearly and they've still a lot of learning to do. Still, being Aussies, I'm sure a couple of half decent scores will see them feted as minor gods again. (Any chance to have a dig) :laughing:

Just 8 matches into a Test career and 25 years old, an action built for longevity, a 96 mph ball with already decent Test averages and potentially with his best years ahead of him. Probably more prematurely rated than overrated.

First of all, I completely agree that Archer is the most overrated Test bowler in England - right now. Does that mean he can't improve? Of course he can. England's ideal 4 quick attack would be Broad, Anderson, Stokes and Archer. To date in his 8 Tests, he's never had that happen. Losing Anderson in the Ashes last year forced a lot more work onto Archer and he responded in favourable conditions, which I think led Root to believe Archer could bowl quick all day. Fast forward to the Black Caps series and Root overbowled him on pitches where the much more sedate New Zealand attack out bowled the tourists. He then played that one Test in South Africa, had to bowl 36 overs, which for a young seriously quick bowler is a lot of work, then was injured. Move on to the last Test and his numbers were underwhelming but the effort wasn't, certainly in the second innings. If/when Root learns how to mange his workload, if the Poms can sort out how to bowl with him in partnerships, if/when they get a settled attack that includes their best bowlers to apply pressure from both ends, then Archer might stop being overrated and fulfill his obvious Test potential. If not, I reckon he's become a white ball specialist in the next 3 years. PS I think he made a mistake becoming an English Test player. Sure he might make more money, but a captain like Jason Holder would be the perfect guy to nurture his career.

"Not sure your title and your last line make sense." I think what Patrick is saying is that Archer displayed his quality on a couple of occasions in Tests but far more so in white ball cricket where he appears to be better suited. His Test form after a great first series has dropped off quite a bit, hence the headline.

As his breach of protocol shows, he doesn’t think very clearly on or off the field. He’s got a lot of learning to do. Having said that, being a pommy cricketer he won’t have to do a great deal to be knighted. (Any chance to have a dig) :laughing:

Thanks for posting Patrick. Not sure your title and your last line make sense. I have watched a lot of him so think he has fantastic potential. I think he is very new to test cricket so has a lot to learn. I think his fitness is probably not where it needs to be. I also think ENgland are still learning how best to use him, when and and on which pitches. I am also not sure he has the best coaching at hand. I think it is fair to say that if England get those things right, and he continues to learn, and get fit, then he will only get better. The balance is that they need to get some more depth in their attack as at the moment, he is potentially a luxury. But when he is going well then he is a weapon indeed. As an aside, I am not sure what on earth went on today with his omission. Living 8n London, the reasons they have given don’t add up at all. One last point, I hope he sticks at test cricket for a while. Cheers,