Since old mate Israel Folau warned gay people and idolaters and thieves and nigh-on all of us that we must repent and acknowledge that we are bad, and if we don’t we’re going to hell forever – no parole, nothin’ – rugby union has known nothing but dud press and lawyers at ten paces.
It’s expensive, it’s stupid and we’ll know soon enough if Israel was sacked by Rugby Australia for practising his religion, as he reckons, or for violating an agreement with an employer.
Regardless, rugby league has dodged a bullet with news that Folau won’t turn out for Tonga after the Rugby League International Federation suspended the board of the Tonga National Rugby League.
Because why would you want Australia’s most famous homophobe in rugby league?
Arguments I’ve heard include:
- Because he’s a famous person and very good at rugby league and will bring a few more thousand through the turnstiles and to watch on the telly when Tonga plays Great Britain and Australia at the end of the year.
- Because he isn’t Matt Lodge, who terrified a family in New York.
- Because he didn’t beat up anyone or get charged with domestic violence.
- Because he’s done his time.
- Because stuff rugby union.
- Because Tonga can pick whatever Tongans Tonga wants.
- Because a lot of folk agree with him.
- Because if the game’s preaching ‘inclusiveness’, it can’t ban a bloke for expressing Christian beliefs.
- Because footy fans would like to see him play again because of the criss-cross-code wow factor of it, the same thing happened when Wendell Sailor went to the Rah-Rahs and Israel went to AFL and Andrew Johns almost played for the Waratahs and rugby league deemed him too big to fail, though he did turn out for the NSW cricket team for reasons known only to God.
(AAP Image/ David Rowland)
Now, at the risk of sparking up the old free speech and political correctness debate and triggering all the malarkey we had when rugby was (is) dealing with the great palooka, as Jules Winfield said to old mate at the start of Pulp Fiction, allow me to retort.
If Israel had vilified another tranche of society – women, say, or Catholics, Jews, disabled people, Samoans – and never once apologised for it, then he’d have been derided as a fool and a bigot with no place in rugby league.
Imagine his meme went: “Warning! Jews, Catholics, Muslims, women, quadriplegics, Samoans, gays (of course)! Hell awaits you. Repent! Only Jesus saves. Put him in goal for the Wanderers.”
And so on.
Imagine if – and this is a bit of a stretch, granted, but try it on as hypothetical – Israel included black people in his list of hellbound peoples. And then he quoted passages in the bible that prove it, as members of some particularly unsavoury groups do.
Is he then just ‘expressing his Christian beliefs’, as Alan Jones and company would assert? Or is he throwing out hate speech under the guise of religious freedom and freedom of expression?
Some turkeys do quote the Bible to illustrate their belief in white dudes’ superiority over black. And they’re pilloried for it and put in jail.
Yet Israel can say that gay people should change? Should repent because being the way God made them is sinful? And rugby league people, good people, would give him a free pass on this stuff? Tell the gays not to worry about it?
I don’t think it’s on.
It comes down to if you’re sweet with homophobia, which many quiet Australians appear to be. Or at least aren’t that fussed about. It’s not happening to them – what’s the problem?
And you can argue Israel’s dopey meme is pretty light on. And certainly gay blokes I know don’t give two stuffs about Israel’s happy-clappin’ horseshit.
But I do. And Ian Roberts does because this sort of dopey hate-speech is dangerous to young gay people.
Israel says he’s telling gay people out of love that God made them gay and they’re going to hell if they don’t change. From who they are. As they were made in God’s image, apparently.
Young gay people suicide five times the rate of straight kids. And if Israel loves them, he’d shut up.
A lot of Polynesian kids, if not the vast majority, are brought up church-going, God-fearing. There are gay kids among them. If Israel loves them, how about: don’t say they’re going to hell. How about: keep that stuff to one’s self. Be a quiet Australian and vote for ScoMo in silent protest because you don’t like being lectured to.
As for ‘inclusiveness’ – please! Rugby league doesn’t include plenty of people. Ben Barba won’t play again. Todd Carney’s in the bush. Tim Simona rorted a charity and won’t play NRL again, one would assume, unless he’s very, very, very, very sorry and does many good deeds.
These chaps were bad for the brand. Israel Folau would be bad for the brand.
The NRL has a float going up Oxford Street at Mardi Gras because it wants to be cool with a section of the community and via them the greater community.
Rugby league wants to get aboard the massive goodwill felt towards gay people at that time of year (a couple weeks to kick-off) because it wants the NRL’s brand to be known as progressive and, well, good.
Israel Folau is not on board.
Timbo (L)
Roar Guru
DP, I am not sure where you are going with this, Are you suggesting that scripture being misunderstood, or perhaps misquoted, misinterpreted or misrepresented? If you dig down to the last translation that I am able to read, one of the sentences forbids a specific act, with no mention of a relationship. The other deals with marriage.
DP Schaefer
Roar Rookie
You're right, I down played the importance of Scripture. I should have said 'he simply quoted Scripture' which should not be the cause of such outrage. Perhaps the misunderstanding of Scripture is the cause of the problem here? The cover of the book means little, the essence of its words means everything.
GoGWS
Roar Guru
Herein lies the problem. Insularity. The ‘most read book on the world’ isn’t saying much though is it... maybe one third of the world identifies as ‘Christian’, at most... so 7 out of 10 people couldn’t care less what advice or threats the book contains. That’s the reality. We non-Christians don’t want to be pestered with advice or threats from evangelists like IF. As for politicians swearing oaths by placing their hand on bibles - yes some (not all) do that but so what. It’s just a convention which says nothing about their belief in god. Good luck to Folau ..if he does get another chance somewhere hopefully he’ll stay off social media altogether.
Justin Kearney
Roar Rookie
Nice to see your boys kill the afl grand final ratings GO! Thank you ever so much. You are my favourite afl fanboy!
Timbo (L)
Roar Guru
DP, Interesting comment "nothing more than quote a piece from scripture." Your comment infers that the scripture isn't problematic. I, on the other hand, contend that the scripture is the root cause of the problem. The same messaging from a different book was a green light for genocide. Why does a cross on the cover of the book it came from make it OK?
Timbo (L)
Roar Guru
Papi, Folau's views aren't shared universaly across Christianity nor pacific islanders. In fact his church/cult, much like Orthodox Judaism and Extremist Islam are in the minority. Unfortunately the minority is a vocal and violent making it seem like it is the norm.
Yattuzzi
Roar Rookie
By the way, happened to see Ali tonight, just an entertainer. Like Bolt, maybe like me, just earning a living. No I deride myself, I can’t fake it. Hope you too.
Ruckin Oaf
Guest
there are no atheists in the fox holes 1. Meh I've met a few 2. If you think it through it's really not a stunning endorsement of religion.
Yattuzzi
Roar Rookie
Ok swords in scabbards.
Peter Traver
Guest
It is absurd he can no longer be employed cause he is expressing a belief from a book that it not only the most read book in the world but Prime Minsters place their hand on as they swear to oath. Blake Ferguson was convicted in court for groping a women surely that is worse what Folau did.
Nick
Roar Guru
yattuzzi, I agree with all that (perhaps the exception of your thoughts of Jones, but minor quibble). What I cannot stand, and can't abide by however (and it's not from you) is when people say stuff that is factually wrong and then spout it again and again when they are challenged on it. That's all. I absolutely agree nothing is black and white, and welcome the debate. But people must debate with facts and informed opinion. They cannot be allowed to say stuff that is fundamentally incorrect and then think they won the debate. DP, among others (Jacko) are people that are spouting factually incorrect information and is making the debate worse. There are people on this website who talk about laws that do not exist, and have never existed in Australia. It's fiction. But when challenged by it, they absolutely refuse to accept truth. It is not hard for people to equip themselves of basic facts and knowledge before jumping in to what should be quite an enriching debate.
Yattuzzi
Roar Rookie
SM, I only ever asked for an open mind. I never really disagreed with you. I am not the stupidest person on this site. My view, most are warm compassionate people. Even people like BB. He has a heart. Maybe I am wrong preaching that people shouldn't follow media commentators like a footy side. Ali and Bolt, could they both be the GCS status. Now Jones, he is not nearly as simple, coached Australia in Rugby, coached a winning NRL side, worked for the PM, single and rumoured and spouts rubbish as well. Now isn't that a twist. A company head who is used to getting his own way teaching young Israel a lesson in life. And Israel doesn't want to be pushed around. Then of all people Jones defends him. So who is the more right. Is anyone? You are a better man or woman than I if you can see black and white here. Anti gay, anti black, anti elitist and bullying. Then throw in the propaganda. Cheers
DP Schaefer
Roar Rookie
Equally famous and more enlightened - "there are no atheists in the fox holes". When faced with obvious mortality so many 'atheists' start praying.
baz
Roar Rookie
you should be in school.
baz
Roar Rookie
mate she is partaking in the Aussie rite of passage atm, but on her return maybe she'll get a chance to implement sharia law or compliment our brave men and women of the ADF. lest we forget.
Razamatazbaz01
Guest
GOLD!
Don Lampard
Guest
So righteous the warmists https://youtu.be/RkdbSxyXftc?t=15
Jacko
Guest
So according to what you just wrote IF is born the way he is and also has no choice.....
Jacko
Guest
Haha Sprucy babe wants out...Insults just not winning the arguement eh Sprucy?
Jacko
Guest
What evidence Scrum? According to latest news reports Folau not only offered to remove the post he also offered to publicly apoligise......I reckon court documents are reasonable evidence...