It started with an explosion of heat and passion, a rocking stadium in Paris, parties in the street, and then, after three days, like the beer, the fun just ran out.
What kind of World Cup whips everyone up to fever pitch – then just kills the momentum stone dead?
While the FIFA World Cup is able to put up to four matches a day through its opening two weeks – and gets neatly wrapped up in four – the rigours of rugby mean extra time and care must be taken with the talent.
That’s a given, but with any luck, a move to 24 teams – hopefully in four years time in Australia – will help overcome the miserable buzz kill rugby fans have felt since the last stunning moments of Wales’ win over Fiji
Between that Semi Radradra dropped ball and the next action in this tournament stands a chasm of 96 hours. Sure, some of those are well used with sleeping, and nursing hangovers.
Out on the town in St Etienne on Tuesday night, and the place was humming. Bars in the square were jammed, frantic staff serving up Aperol Spritzes, glasses of rose and big mugs of beer along with planches of delicious food.
A South Africa fans celebrates during the Rugby World Cup France 2023 Group B match between South Africa and Scotland at Stade Velodrome on September 10, 2023 in Marseille, France. (Photo by David Rogers/Getty Images)
It felt like a World Cup – except for one key factor. Wouldn’t it be great to have some footy to watch as well?
And it’s no as if the return of the action will necessarily be a return to action. There is a chance that only one match is a humdinger – Australia vs. Fiji. A glance at the odds shows just one other match where the outsider is paying under $10 for the win – Japan ($9.50 against $1.06 England).
Of course the main issue is that unlike the football World Cup there is such a significant difference in quality between the 10 tier one teams and the others, and this weekend pitches too many goliaths in against Davids.
Going to 24 teams necessarily won’t solve that problem, but will at least serve up more content. More games for people to watch on big screens in fan zones, or on their couches, or in the stands. The goal must be to have games on every day during the pool stages – or close to it – with marquee matches or teams on the marquee weekend days.
The inaugural Rugby World Cup in 1987 was a 16 team tournament,, with 20 in 1999. It was rejigged in 2003 to be four pools of five. While that has been used in every tournament since, in 2003 there was a just a two day gap after the round of gaps. That’s a pause for breath. What we have now is “are you still breathing?” match days.
We are much more aware of player welfare than we were in 2003 when the Cup was an attritional affair.
Even as late as 2015 Japan faced the ridiculous scenario of having to play Scotland a mere four days after beating South Africa. They were thumped 45-10 and it cost them a chance of the knockouts.
But there has to be a better solution that a tournament that sees Tonga play for the first time NINE days after the tournament’s opening ceremony.
There are many schools of thought on how a 24 team Rugby World Cup should be run.
For starters you’d expect four pools of six teams or six pools of four teams. Under the first second system there could be an additional round of knockouts, with more meaningful games, and 16 of the 24 teams advancing to a next stage.
Australian Nelson Dale, founder of the Draft Rugby Podcast, came up with proposal for a 24 team competition that included a bowl competition for eliminated teams. It produced plenty of debate.
The Tier 2 Rugby account predicted there would be whinges about the make up of this tournament. Happy to oblige!
Several of the replies showed promise, including this from Gavin Grace who believes having the teams ranked 9-24 having to qualify through to meet the top eight seeds is a solution.
I’m going to come out and admit it: my maths proficiency is as low as my boredom threshold, so while I’m Tier 1 for complaints, I’m Tier 2 for solutions.
Who of you has a fix for this?
Muglair
Roar Rookie
True buy typically results and competitiveness of the 4th and 5th ranked teams falls away due to a lack of depth and the challenge of the weekly slog of hard tournament play. Nor will that help the next eight sides.
terrence
Roar Rookie
Chile and Uruguay have been quite competive so far..
terrence
Roar Rookie
..could use another big aggro lock like salakai-loto just bout now..
terrence
Roar Rookie
Or maybe they actually proud samoans and tongans who played for australia and new zealand..
Tim Carter
Roar Pro
How about 5 pools of 4? Only the top team in each pool and the top finishing 2nd place side makes it straight through to the quarter finals. The other 4 to come 2nd have to play off for the last spots. No byes, though teams lose a group game.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
Fiji could but Samoa like Tonga is stuffed full of journey men who want one more WC and will not play much after the WC until maybe 2026. Then you will have the next batch of WBs and ABs looking for one last WC. Fiji is good because of all their Fijian players, Samoa is becasue of OZ and NZ
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
Either we go back to 16 which is the 10 teams from the 6Ns and RC plus a regional champion of each Region with no playoff, or you have three regions of Americas, Europe/Africa, and OceninaAsia (or Europe/Asia and Ocenia/Africa) and 1 gets through and the 2 and 3 team go into a playoff. We need to remember that with 16 teams a PI team missed out each WC and we aren’t going to 32 teams.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
And how many of them were born or raised in Samoa and Tonga. If those Island don’t have a pathway like Fiji does then Samoa and Tonga just become heritage teams like the Maori. When there 2/3 of the Samoa and Tonga teams only link to the country is heritage we know that those countries are not producing players. Like I said compare it to all the other T2 nations who have more than 2/3 of their team are players born and raised there. Tonga and Samoa should have numbers like Selknam & Peñarol but how many of the MP players are NZ born and raised.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
But signing players in Oz and NZ up to not picking any other nation is ok. Its amazing how many players leave Oz and NZ and suddenly are turning out for other nations. Monty when at the Rebels magically made himself unavailable for test rugby and he was not the first nor the last. Reece was going to declare for Fiji but could not once he signed a contact with the Saders, it was only months later that he got picked for the squad. Maybe fight the organizations closer to home that are holding back T2 countries. There are 151 French based players at this WC. If we take out France’s 33 (all home based) there are 118 professional players from French Clubs at the WC that are not French. If you exclude home based players (I have counted MP as Tonga and Samoa as that is what it is meant to be) T14 has 80 players, D2&Fed = 45, Prem=37, URC=18, Japan=17, MLS=10 and SRP comes in with 7 plus 1 each in NPC and Oz Club. Not hard to see where the problem lies.
JD Kiwi
Roar Rookie
I highlighted Japan rather than Europe but as Harry mentioned on the Roar pod, there are still France based players pulling out of the World Cup for "family reasons." It's an absolute disgrace.
JD Kiwi
Roar Rookie
At least 19 players currently with MP and at this world cup. And 17 Drua. Plus alumni. That's Leinster territory and a huge contribution after just two years play.
Tim Carter
Roar Pro
But you should try to replace a bad situation with a good situation, not just a subjectively less bad situation.
Tim Carter
Roar Pro
Easily solved. During the group rounds, women play Saturday to Tuesday, men Wednesday to Saturday. When it comes to the knockout rounds, they could alternate, but given the need for consistent rest, the group stage patterns may still apply.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
Not as much as the 4 pools of 5 where teams dont play for 2 weeks or Tongan fans will see to French games before they see a Tongan one.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
I don't agree that the European Clubs are the ones stopping the PIs from playing as most are not even from the island. For the Samoa and Tonga WC squads T14 are providing 22 players (33%), SRP also 22 players, URC and Prem 11 players. If you take out the 19 players from MP that number drops to 3 players for the rest of SRP. France only has 1 club out of the 30 in the T14 & ProD2 not sending a player to the WC. T14 is sending as many players to the WC as all of SRP even though it only has 1 nation compared to 5 in SRP. For Fiji 16 players are in Europe, 16 at the Dura and 1 in the rest of SRP. If the European clubs (4 big leagues) are so bad why are they sending so many players to the WC (334/660=50.6%) when they are only sending 7 teams. This means 103 players from the URC, Prem, T14 and ProD2 are not representing those 7 countries (higher as not all of those 7 squads are playing there). SRP are sending 106 players from 5 teams in the area which is 106/165). Now surely with all the PI people in Oz and NZ there should be more PI players at teams like the Tahs and Blues but they are not becuase they must all chose NZ or Oz to play there.
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
Teams like Portugal have 23/33 home born and same figure for home raised. Romania are 21/33 on both. Italy 21 & 20/33. Scotland 17 & 18 /33 but only 3 are on residency. Compare that to Japan who have 22 home grown but 16 born with more players playing for Japan based on residency compared to anything else. Tonga has 10 home grown players and 13 born in Tonga while Samoa are 5 home grown and 9 born. Contrast that with Fiji who are 27 homegrown and 28 born. The Island Boys are just not getting a pathway to rugby and MP is mainly NZ players with PI heritage
Brendan NH Fan
Roar Rookie
WR tried to do more T2 comps but even then teams like Nambia have often been forgotten. Up until 1992 there were only 8 teams in the European Championship in soccer. If there were 12 teams in the European competition it would be the 6Ns plus 6 from the B6Ns (they now have 8 teams). Groups based on ranks would be Seed 1 - France, Ireland, Scotland, Seed 2 - England, Italy, Wales, Seed 3 - Georgia, Spain, Portugal, Seed 4 Romania, Netherlands, Belgium. France as it is sends an A team to on July tests so the 5 big teams would all be weaker. If they did it like the u20s you would expect England to be the 4th semi final but a fully stacked Italy and Georgia would make the top 7 competitive. We are already seeing that with a strong u18 and u20 European championship and with the formation of the European Super Cup giving teams like Georgia, Spain etc their own Dura they have established themselves as above most of the T2 nations at underage. Can't see why the same wouldn't happen at senior level.
AntiCorey
Roar Rookie
Hallelujah! And that was an excellent piece of writing Tony. Memories of yesteryear when some Roar writing was about stuff that meant something. Give yaself an uppercut.
cookie
Roar Guru
I’ve been advocating that for years.. There is many formats it could take but a simple north and southern hemisphere mini cups could do the job.
Tony Harper
Editor
Your service is appreciated. I'm loving all these suggestions.